Freelancer with spouse who is a permanent employee

15 posts in this topic

My wife works as a permanent employee and I'm about to become a freelancer. Right now, we're 3/5 and my helth insurance is covered by hers. So, when I become a freelancer:

 

1) Regarding 3/5

Does it continue the same? or do we change for 4/4? or depends on the salary?

 

2) Regarding health insurance

Do I need start paying it? if yes, the state or a private one?

 

Thanks ;)

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YOu will no longer fall under family insurance. YOu will have to start paying into the private sector, as you no longer qualify for public.

 

As far as tax ratio, you should base it on income giving the break to the one who makes more. But I am not all that familiar with freelance tax. But it will still come out to total 8, as that is the regulation for married couples 3/5 or 4/4. your choice. Maybe best to contact a tax advisor on that one.

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as soon as you have an income in excess of 360 EUR/month, you have to get yourself insured individually. If you can stay with public health insurance technically/legally depends on how long you have been co-insured with your wife. It is/was a year or longer, you may be eliible to stay as a voluntary member in the public health insurance...

If that makes sense at all or if you would be better off in private health insurance instead depends on a number of other parameters: estimated income, will you earn more than the wife and do you have children (because then you might need to insure the children privately too), do you suffer from any major medical condition or are you currently undergoing any treatments etc. Might be wiser to get this all checked out thru a professional, an independent advisor or independent broker.

 

Cheerio

I am a professional independent insurance broker, financial adviser, and authorised advertiser. Contact me.
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I knew our man starshollow would come through.

 

I have a question to piggy back off what you just stated, with under 360 being able to be earned without having to go private sector. In the US you can earn so much a year and not have to pay tax or even file, I suppose here like a mini job, but can be done selbstandig. Does Germany have an equivalent. I do not mean for a major business, but a stay at home mom who wants to do nachhilfe or babysitting. Is there a tax free limit, or how would that work for someone earning probably less then a hundred a month. I don't want to fall into the freelance sector, though I am fine paying a tax if need be,just trying to determine if it is more hassle then worth, and can't find anything on TT about it. Thanks.

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there might be some other folks like YL6 and Freising who are better suited to answer this tax related question, but I am reasonably sure that my following answer is correct:

you can earn up to 7.664 EUR per year without having to pay taxes - because income taxation only starts if all your combined income exceeds this threshold (and then only the amounts in excess are actually taxed). If you are working self-employed/freelancing, your turnover (i.e. all the money you bill and get paid) may actually be higher than that amount, because you can take away the directly connected costs and these 7.664 EUR are meant as income after costs.

 

The 360 EUR/month rule is only for health insurance reasons...

 

Cheerio

I am a professional independent insurance broker, financial adviser, and authorised advertiser. Contact me.
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As I understand it, you can earn your 360€ without having to pay your own health insurance,, but if your husband is taking advantage of your tax allowance ("Ehegattungsplittung"), you will have to pay tax from the first euro at his tax rate. Although there is an exception for "Nachbarschaftshilfe" - I think this means that if you do babysitting, nachhilfe etc, for a few euros and not amzingly regularly you don't have to declare it.

 

To be honest, I get the impression that the vast majority of people who earn, say, a hundred a month don't declare it, and the tax office has better things to do than to investigate them. If you get a mini job you can earn up to 400€ tax free and so that makes it a better bet for housewives than freelancing. Please correct me, anyone, if I'm wrong.

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Hi, all, thanks for your help. I'll contact a insurance broker to decide a good option for me.

 

Just something that came to my mind. If I get a job (permanent contract) can I go back to the state health insurance and get my future kids covered for "free"?

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Hey Jan- I was just worried about the dreaded swarzarbeit. But I actually do have a minijob, just looking for a hobby or to make a few bucks, maybe even through etsy or so when I stay home over the next year with the baby.

 

Newcomer- YOur kids can always be placed under the mom as family insured. I had heard a rumor that once you leave you cannot go back into the private sector.

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Hi Serenajean,

I don't think you need to worry about the Schwarzarbeit issue, if you're babysitting or giving nachhilfe to private people.I heard of someone who got caught out, but she had been doing a lot of work for a commercial Nachhilfe Institut for years and never declared a thing.

 

A good bet is to teach a couple of courses at the Volkshochschule as the first approx 2,000€ comes under the "Ubungsleiterpauschale" and isn't taxed. This also applies if you teach sport for a sports club ( not commercial ) and is aimed at getting people to do things for the public good.

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Was ist mit dem Nachbarsjungen, der gelegentlich den Rasen mäht und dafür ein paar Euro erhält?Die bisher nicht als Schwarzarbeit erfassten Sachverhalte der Nachbarschaftshilfe, Gefälligkeit und Selbsthilfe gelten auch zukünftig nicht als Schwarzarbeit, wenn sie nicht nachhaltig auf Gewinn gerichtet sind.

Folglich löst nicht jede Tätigkeit Verpflichtungen nach dem Steuerrecht oder Sozialgesetzbuch aus. Wo Hilfeleistungen erbracht werden, bei denen Gefälligkeit und Hilfsbereitschaft deutlich im Vordergrund stehen, ist die Leistung nicht nachhaltig auf Gewinn gerichtet und deshalb steuerlich völlig irrelevant. Solche Hilfeleistungen begründen auch kein Arbeitsverhältnis und keine Unternehmereigenschaft und sind damit auch sozialversicherungsrechtlich ohne Bedeutung. Dies gilt auch für den oben beschriebenen Fall des Nachbarsjungen

 

This might help.

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Hi, all, thanks for your help. I'll contact a insurance broker to decide a good option for me.

 

Just something that came to my mind. If I get a job (permanent contract) can I go back to the state health insurance and get my future kids covered for "free"?

 

NewNewcomer: under the current 3-year rule (sounds a bit like 3 strikes and you´re out!), you MUST return to the public system if you become an employee and would have to earn over the threshold for said three consecutive years to be allowed to go back to private.Even if your salary were 50 million euros a year, you go back to public from the beginning! :D

I am a professional independent insurance broker and authorised advertiser. Contact me.
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Hi Newcomer,

 

my Hubby is a freelancer while I am in a permanent job. After talking to our tax advisor we decided to leave it as 3/5 seeing that the tax department wants to have their funds, based on both incomes, at the end of the year anyways and I preferred to have part deducted on a monthly base instead having an higher net worth and still having to pay the taxes every three month or at years end depending on the total income

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I have few questions while working as a permanent employee and spouse as a freelancer (2 freelance jobs at the same time). Currently in 3/5 class both non-EU.

 

1. Can I still remain in class 3 where my taxation is automatically done via monthly salary or will it be a self-tax claim for both of us? (means we have to fill the tax claim including all receipts etc at the end/start of the year).

2. If this will be a self-tax claim, then how does it effect the tax class? Will it remain 3/5 or change to 4/4? FYI: Spouse will have ca. 1300 Euro per month as a freelancer.

3. In this situation which criteria is better? (Permanent+2 Freelance jobs or Permanent+1 Permanent+1 Freelance).

4. With 1300 Euro as a freelancer, the spouse has to pay for private health insurance. How about Pension and other insurances? (Is it compulsory to pay those insurances which usually are deducted from the monthly salary or is it flexible in any way?).

 

Any other suggestion is most welcome.

 

 

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  1. Tax classes are just used for estimating the final income tax that is due. This final income tax is always calculated in a tax return.
    Only someone in tax class 3 whose spouse has no income at all is not required to file a tax return, since in that special case the income tax that was estimated through tax class 3 is actually the same amount that would be calculated in a tax return, so they don't bother.
    In all other cases the amount estimated through tax classes does not correspond to the final income tax burden, so you have to do a tax return.

    For you: as soon as your spouse earns only 1€ of income, you have to do a joint tax return for that calendar year, which has to be submitted by 31. May of the following year.
    So the 2017 tax return is due by 31. May 2018.
     
  2. Your tax class will remain the same, but the result of your mandatory (= obligatory = you have to file it) tax return will be that you will have to pay a healthy extra amount for income tax, because of your spouse's income.
     
  3. No difference at all, the taxation is the same - money gets taxed the same way no matter whether it was employee or freelance income, and in both cases you have to file a tax return.
     
  4. Nope, your spouse could also remain in public health insurance, but it's more expensive than private health insurance: https://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/topic/359003-health-insurance-in-germany-possible-to-be-covered-by-spouses-employer/?do=findComment&comment=3451383
    If his/her monthly freelance profit is below 425€ (= 1/7 * Bezugsgröße, amount changes every year) he/she can remain for free under your public health insurance, under Familienversicherung, open the entry "Gibt es Einkommensgrenzen für die Familienversicherung" in here: https://www.tk.de/tk/versicherung-und-beitraege/versichert-als-familie/haeufige-fragen-zur-familienversicherung/816160

    Public pension insurance is only obligatory if your spouse is a freelance teacher: https://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/topic/242387-freelancing-as-english-teacher/?do=findComment&comment=2644827
    or if he/she is an "arbeitnehmerähnlicher Selbständiger", i.e. gets at least 83.3% of his/her freelance income from just one client (details in here). But if he/she is an "arbeitnehmerähnlicher Selbständiger", he/she can get an exemption from paying public pension insurance for the first 3 years of being in business, but he/she has to apply for it beforehand, see here.

    No other insurances are obligatory.

    But regardless of your employment status, you should have a family personal liability insurance (= Privat-Haftpflichtversicherung), details of why this is a must are in the middle of this post: 
    https://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/topic/370232-telecommuting-from-germany-on-temporary-basis/?do=findComment&comment=3574624
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Hello TT-ers

After doing some reading in TT firsthand and not finding suitable answers, I would like to ask few questions.

Please excuse if they were already answered .
I am an employed person, my wife is employed part time + has a Nebenberuf since 2017, and my income is more than my wife's.
Until last year we made Steuererklärung under one Steuernummer ( on the top left corner of  our Stuerbescheid  2016 has  IdNr. Ehemann, IdNr. Ehefrau and Stuernummer).
She registered a Kleingewerbe in 2017, from which the earnings were less than 500Eur last year, and got a separate Steuernummer.
So can someone tell us how to proceed in Elster with two Stuernummer's for Stuererklärung 2017 ?
Should we do both yellow and blue marked forms in TT wiki/Elster https://www.toytowngermany.com/wiki/Elster ?

Thanks a lot in advance !

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