Wiring up lights in a German apartment

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Wondering if anyone wants to offer some advice on this wiring dilemma. All the other lights have two or three wires coming out of the ceiling. But in the living room there are four wires - brown, black, blue and yellow/green. Not sure how to work this with the light that has only blue and grey from ikea. Any thoughts?

 

Thanks

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Don't worry about Electric shocks, I've had heaps. Can't see what the problem is, but maybe it's cos I'm from Oz.

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Sounds to me like there are 2 switched circuits with common earth and return - often seen in living areas so you can connect 2 levels of lighting. Blue is probably common return, so take that and either one of the black or brown wires, plus of course the yellow/green for earth if your lamp has it. You'll need to make sure the unused wire is correctly insulated/isolated and out of the way. You'll should find 2 wall-switches side by side, one for each of these circuits. Clearly only one will be used to switch on/off your new lamp - the other will be redundant.

Safety note: always test and confirm the circuits before connection, and only work with mains power disconnected at the fuse panel.

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OK after reading this entire thread I am unable to find a solution for the problem I have. I am living in a house that has a basement, the stairs then spirals up from the basement to ground floor, then first floor then second floor.

Spaced out the entire length of the stairs are connections for lights, approx two for each floor. Every location for a light has 6 wires coming out, 2 black, 2 blue and 2 yellow/green. I am unable to get any lights to work as I don't know how I should be wiring them. The 2 blue wires at each connection are connected to each other so that leaves the live and earth wires to connect but still nothing works.

The break switches are on and I have tested each wire with the screw driver tester thingy. What confuses me is that three wires out of every six are live, basically one neutral, one earth and one live are well...live.

 

Is this issue something I can bring up with with the Landlord or an I on my own with this? I think it's getting close to the need for calling in an electrician.

 

Any help would be appreciated.

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Hi all! I need a little advice. I've just moved into a new flat and, wonderful Germany, the previous tenants took all the lights with them. I went and bought some lights but encountered a little problem. In the fixtures I bought I have three connections, obviously L N and G. My wiring only has 2 - l and n. (its an old building so they're black and grey). The instructions imply I need to ground, but can some advise as to where I connect it? Any advice would be appreciated...

 

Thanks a lot!

 

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forget the earth, the other two don't matter which way around if you are using bulbs (i.e. not flo tubes)

 

You might find the earth hidden in the ceiling.

 

Before doing any work: as the flat is old - turn off all the electricity for whole flat - not just the breaker marked for that room, you can't be sure how it's rigged.

 

it's standard for tenants to take light fittings.

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Old buildings till around 1960 don't have that 3rd line, earth.The standard procedure then was to ground via N. But i would not recommend to do so, i second greenface, forget the grounding, not necessary with lamps.

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one would hope a building has been rewired since 1960!

 

sosarx is right, don't ground via N. some apartments in our building are - fucking dangerous.

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Don't rely on the brown being live and the blue being ground! Always check with a mains tester ( Phasenprüfer ) first. This is important especially when connecting E10, E14 or E27 bases. The screw thread of the bulb must never be live, since you can touch it while threading - your wife, children, friends or whoever changes your bulbs, won't say thank you for saving their lives this way, but you won't need to invest in a coffin ;-). So after you have tested your lamp it might be good practice to turn off the light, unscrew the bulb, turn on the light and check with your tester that the thread (ground) and the plate at the bottom (live) are connected correctly.

 

And check your tester is working properly before relying on it - at a socket known to be working. In case you ever find a yellow-green cable being a live wire, it's time to call the police - someone wants to kill you. Don't forget to call the electrician to sort things out then :-) Also make sure that you are not obliged by law to call an electrician before doing an electric installation. Three phase wiring always is electrician's work - and if he is already doing your kitchen why not let him check any other wiring you did?

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no no no.

 

earth = ground.

 

live and neutral are used for lighting rings. Never use the earth/ground as a neutral, that really fucks things up.

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Hello all. I've got a similar problem in that I need to install four ceiling light fixtures in the flat we've moved into. However, the problem is compounded by the previous tenants (or maybe the landlord) having painted over all the wires, so in many cases it's impossible to tell what colour they were, and besides which the metal bits are no longer exposed. Even if we didn't have this problem I'm a bit wary of doing the job myself as I have neither experience nor tools nor a ladder, so I'm thinking of calling in an electrician. Does anyone know how much we might expect to pay for this? Will an electrician actually affix the light fixtures to the ceiling, or will they only do the wiring?

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if you are unsure, then you are right not to try it.

find a friend who can do and take them out for a slap up.

An electrician will cost a bucket load for quite a simple task.

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On a semi related topic, does anyone know if there is a standard method of wiring in Germany, I thought/believe in the uk Power always went down from the switch and light always up from the switch and cables never went horizontally? I have done some basic DIY in our flat here and always first check if there are cables/pipes hidden in the wall and then turn off power in the whole flat (where ever the main switch is). As had experience where I turned the power off in the room, then fortunately checked final time before drilling only to find that someone previously had taken a power feed from the room next door through the wall and then Horizontally to where it was needed. Would have been fun...

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Just a warning, (and to complicate things), our flat has multiple light switches for the lights in a number of rooms but they are not the sort of multiway switching that has already been mentioned. These are relay activated. The switches always return to rest in the same position after pressed and they activate a relay that turns the lights on/off.

 

I would echo the thought that says that - other than the simplest installation of a light fitting - get a LOCAL professional to do it.

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earth = ground.

 

live and neutral are used for lighting rings. Never use the earth/ground as a neutral, that really fucks things up.

 

So? I guess there is a word conflict here :-) In Germany there is a "grounded neutral" (blue) and "protective earth" (green/yellow). And your equation is physically correct, they are both dragged to ground=earth potential by connecting them to a large block of metal buried into the earth. They are electrically different though - neutral can trip the fuse, protective can trip both RCD and fuse. So yes, do not use protective as neutral - it is not allowed, it is against its intended use, might make things less safe and should trip the hopefully installed RCD. Still nobody wants to get electrocuted when threading in a lightbulb, so it is important that the thread - which you can touch and which will get into conducting contact first - is not connected to a live wire.

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