Huge bill for heating (Nebenkosten)

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So what should I expect to pay in heating costs for 42qm apartment where there are 3 rooms, with one radiator on all the time over winter, (the other two will have been on for about half of the cold months)?

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It depends..

 

If it's a new building not more than 200€ (60kWh/a/m²) a year,

if it's an old building 1000€ (300kWh/a/m²) and more.

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Hello everyone,

 

I realize this conversation dates back to 2008 but perhaps I could get some help from one of you. I have recently moved to Berlin and am finding it extremely difficult to understand all this gas and heating cost business. I barely speak a word of German, so it becomes a huge problem when trying to read letters and bills from the heating/gas companies.

 

I just moved into a small one bedroom apartment (38m square). The landlord told me that I would have to take care of gas and electricity myself. I was a little skeptic since I did not know how much my rent would total to. All I knew for sure, when signing the contract, is that I would be spending 500 Euros Kalt. I asked my landlord how much the extra costs would approximately amount to and he said 30 Euros average. Now, I received the information from the gas and electricity company stating that I would be paying 82 Euros total (50 for gas, and month and 32 for electricity). I realize that I may be getting some money back depending on how much of it I use, but I was wondering if this will actually be the case and if I can expect to be refunded. Why did my landlord believe that I would be paying 30 euros total? Is he right or did he make fun of me?

 

I'd appreciate any kind of help and advice with this.

 

Thanks in advance! :)

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It's relatively simple - you pay for what you use and to avoid having to stump up a large amount at the end of the year you pay an estimated amount each month. You can call the utility companies and ask them what they estimate for your flat, they may have records from previous tenants. You can also ask the landlord, and ask him to be precise as possible, as he may know. Some people like their flat at 30C inside, others are happy at 30F, rather obviously the cost of these will be different.

 

Any difference between what you used and what you paid will be sorted out once a year, exactly when this happens will depend on your building's routine, but if you're concerned simply keep an eye on your own meters and see how you're doing month by month. You can ask the utility company for their current prices per unit, or use last year's and add a bit.

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i had a 26sqm apartment and travel half the time for work and got an effing 900 euro back payment to be made. i was extremely pissed off coz i hardly ever used the heating. i moved now into an 80sqm.. i cant wait to get the bill :)

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Electricity is always going to be the best part of 30 Eur a month now at least I think for anyone doing the basics of cooking, using fridges, IT kit etc. (Mine was 22 last year and there's now a 25% rise). At best a bit less if no laundry at home. It'd be the very least you'd expect an electric company to set it at for someone with no track record.

 

Gas is probably a lot more variable and to pass comment on. Depends on myriad factors like insulation, how you heat the place and your water, location (top floor can be deadly). And so on.

 

Floor space is usually not much of a cost driver (unless we choose to heat all of it irrespective of which bits we actually use). It's really numbers of people and then our life patterns (and of course we all think we are below average). Energy is expensive now per se. Poor build - bad insulation and poor quality housing (shoddy old windows etc) - makes that worse. It cost me as much to heat a tiny old apartment as a modern 3 bed home in London.

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Isit possible that sunlight gets to them from a window or something like that that would cause evaporation.Your rent increase is only allowed up to 10% in a time period of 3 years

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what the hell are you guys talking about evaportation??do you guys have the white wall heaters with the white knob with numbers up to 5? where is the evaporation occuring?? did i miss something?

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I think they mean the meters on the radiators for measuring how much heat is used by your apartment, used to determine your bill for communal heating systems. The old style are liquid filled and therefore theoretically can be affected by excess evaporation when heated by direct sunlight. Newer ones are digital.

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The device is called a "Heizkostenverteiler" (HKV)

 

The older ones with two liquid-filled tubes can look like this:

 

post-37596-12979882645372.jpg

 

and the more modern digital version something like this:

 

post-37596-12979880932483.jpg

 

If you understand German, here the Wikipedia article.

 

Of course, if you have an individual heating source with its own central mechanical or electronic meter, you won't have any HKVs

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We have a four person household and pay € 160 a month in a 4 roomed apartment,so altogether in a year we pay €1960 for hot water haeting and all the normal bills so i would say you are paying OTT

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Isit possible that sunlight gets to them from a window or something like that that would cause evaporation.

 

 

 

what the hell are you guys talking about evaportation??

 

Mounted on the radiators in all buildings where heating costs are split between several parties is a thing that is filled with a liquid that evaporates when heated. This is usually caused by the radiator getting hot but can also be caused by sun shining on the device and thus you pay more than you should.

 

From that article posted earlier:

 

 

Je nach Temperatur verdunstet die Messflüssigkeit schneller oder langsamer ... Durch die Kaltverdunstung kann es in seltenen Fällen zu Fehlmessungen kommen, wenn sie in den einzelnen Wohnungen bedingt durch andere Wärmequellen, z. B. Sonneneinstrahlung, große Unterschiede aufweist.

 

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Thank you all for your prompt replies!

 

From what I am reading, I guess I'll be paying 50 Euros for gas and 32 Euros for electricity and should not expect to be reimbursed a thing. It is perhaps very silly of me to have rented an apartment without knowing how much the extra costs would be. The landlord told me one thing, but I guess you should always expects something else. Sad to see my salary fly away... :o

 

Thanks everyone! :D

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I am going through a similar situation.

Year 3 in this flat.

rent is about 350 and I pay 518 warm. I work 1400 to 2300 and when I get home the heat is on the night system (simply saying I can turn rads full and freeze).

First years bill was 700 euro on top. Rads are off mostly through day.

 

Last years bill (and believe me I froze my bloody ass off from the 700 euro increase) I was expecting a bit less, but noooo I get a bill for 1700 euro. Talk about a heart attack.

So now we are down to the consumer protection, and they almost have a heart attach. For F sakes I am not even home, and even when I do get home I can't get any heat.

Landlord now wants all cash up front, which I can't do as, well, I just don't have that kind of cash.

I should have got insurance but I guess now I have to get a lawyer and some how manage to figure this out.

 

Add in a black plant that also grows on my walls, even after I air this place out on the regular and have humidity traps.

:(

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@ (807) Recordings:

 

Sad to hear many people go through this. Not easy, especially when one struggles with the German language. Fingers crossed for this year's bill!

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807recordings, there is something SERIOUSLY wrong with your bill. We have a four room flat, ca. 90sqm, and I am pretty liberal with the heating, and our extra costs never exceed €150 a year. Do you belong to a Mietverein? If not, get to one fast.

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No I don't belong to any rental group. The building is in an old villa so there is only a few flats per floor.

Oh ya I know something is wrong, but the landlord is playing hardball. I suspect this is why many people moved out.

Either way lawyer costs suck and I wish I would have got insurance for that a long time ago.

 

My girlfriend is German so at least she can reply, and has to the landloards.

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Off topic but also give the landlord a deadline to take care of the black mold. Very bad for your health.

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Wait, read threads here about mold (keywords "mold" and "mould") first, and you will see why if you report mold to your landlord, you could be sued for thousands in mold clean-up. (Not sure who would win the lawsuit.)

If the mold is on a wall that faces the outdoors, remove all furniture, etc. that's against that wall that could be impeding air flow. Clean it with shimmel-entferner (bleach solution) and use an anti-mold primer before repainting... wish I knew more that could help you.

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