Are we in the middle of a financial meltdown?

1,054 posts in this topic

I have a bad feeling that the pensions will be the thing that means what you're saying isn't true. Depends how long it goes on but those pension funds have taken a huge battering as well. The middle classes are going to potentially taking at least as big a battering as the lower.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

But the Democrats are in the majority, and about 67 Republicans voted in favor of the bill. Are Democrats fit to govern if they cannot pass a bill when in the majority and garnering significant Republican support for a bill? Yet Labour Party activist has only a partisan perspective here.

Hmmm, so why did 94 Democrats vote against it, cinzia? Also, the US has had a mixed economy for a long time, so please spare us the leftist demagoguery.

I can't believe you are trying to spin this into 'the Democrats let us all down'. Both sides had sections that voted against but while the Democrats had 94 (40%) voting it down, the Repugs had 132 (66%). The truth is this bill required a majority of both parties and while the Democrats delivered a majority the Republicans completely failed to do so.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The bill could have passed without a single Republican vote. Funny how BTC does not blame Pelosi and the Democratic leadership for not being able to get twelve more Democrats to vote for the bill. BTW, who do you think decides when a vote will be taken in the House? Not the party in the minority- the majority controls the agenda.

 

Nice job of trying to hook up your fraternal center-left party, BTC. :rolleyes:

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

it was a bill put to the house by a Republican president Conqy. It was not a Democrat sponsored bill. Really you are astonishing.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Who gives a fuck who caused it , shit needs to get sorted out before it's curtains.

I really must have had far too much to drink yesterday. I'm agreeing with Parnell again.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just tried to find that famous cartoon from the late 20s early 30s with people on a ladder and the rich guy at the topsays it is only fair that everyone takes one step down. The working (or unemployed) man at the bottom would drown.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Go and look at how many votes have passed with the Democrats voting in a 100% bloc, Conquistador.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

it was a bill put to the house by a Republican president Conqy. It was not a Democrat sponsored bill. Really you are astonishing.

Once again, if the Speaker of the House is not sure that she has the votes, she controls the agenda and can delay the vote. Can Bush force her to hold a vote? No. Do you think there were no discussions with the Democratic leadership in Congress, BTC?

 

cinzia, why did something like 66 Democrats vote against the bill? Why aren't you and others on the left fuming about them?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

it appears that undertakings from the Republican leadership that there was support were all groundless.

 

And if you do not believe there was any PRESSURE to take this vote then you are living in cloud cuckoo land.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

...delay the vote.

Uncertainty. Just what's needed at the moment.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A lame duck President was not the source of any pressure- it was the exigency of the credit crunch. Wheel, what do you think would be more damaging- the bill getting voted down or it being delayed a day or two?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

A lame duck President was not the source of any pressure- it was the exigency of the credit crunch.

well DOH!

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

any reports yet of people jumping out the windows?

Maybe we´ll see people bein' thrown out of windows... ;)

 

I dont really understand why one would turn this into a Democrats-Republican fight. There are people on both sides in both parties and they all seem to have good reasons for their decisions. We dont even know if this bailout is a good idea. It might turn out useless and leave the US taxpayers with additional debt, increase inflation, put the USD under additional pressure, ... or it might be the one thing that could save the world from a longterm depression... who knows... Im glad Im not responsible for this decision.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

cinzia, why did something like 66 Democrats vote against the bill? Why aren't you and others on the left fuming about them?

Because I know what the chances of Democrats voting in a 100% bloc are, especially considering they were asked to support a Bush Administration initiative.

 

Freising, I am only interested in who is at fault here because McCain made a flagrant and ridiculous attempt last week to paint himself as the candidate who was going to be the Leader and go to Washington to whip everybody into shape behind this bill. That his own party sunk it is a referendum on his leadership abilities, as he himself tried to define them last week.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

... we are facing straight into the hole here ...

SPIEGEL INTERVIEW WITH GERMAN FINANCE MINISTER STEINBRÜCK

 

'We Were All Staring into the Abyss'

 

 

... Steinbrück: There will be shifts in terms of the importance and status of New York and London as the two main financial centers. State-owned banks and funds, as well as commercial banks from Europe, China, Russia and the Arab world will close the gaps, creating new centers of power in the financial world ...
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On the bright side, gas prices are down. Well, they were this morning.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Because I know what the chances of Democrats voting in a 100% bloc are, especially considering they were asked to support a Bush Administration initiative.

So the Democrats just wanted to let things run their course? Of course not- the Democrats were involved in the negotiations. There had to agreement on the part of the Democratic leadership before this bill could go to a vote.

 

 

Freising, I am only interested in who is at fault here because McCain made a flagrant and ridiculous attempt last week to paint himself as the candidate who was going to be the Leader and go to Washington to whip everybody into shape behind this bill. That his own party sunk it is a referendum on his leadership abilities, as he himself tried to define them last week.

Whatever. He is not a member of the House Republican leadership, who are the ones responsible for doing vote counting and any necessary persuading. But what partisan Democrat cares about an inconvenient fact like that?

 

Freising has made a very good point. The failed vote was a bipartisan failure of leadership.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's a very, very small upside here. Amidst the carnage, I think the Fed will probably lower interest rates, dramatically. This is going to send US homeowners with good credit straight to the bank (the three remaining) to refinance. Someone posted earlier that real estate values will probably rise steadily from the lows here in the next few months.

 

With money so cheap (like Greenspan cheap at 1-2%) the credit market between institutions will have to loosen up. But still, lots of shit to get through before this happens.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This topic is now closed to further replies.