Warning: Health insurance is mandatory

Health insurance is now mandatory!! For those who have a proper job & your employer pays you're OK but for those who have
cash in hand jobs or are self-employed are'nt covered. Recently, last month in fact, a friend of mine, who is self-employed, decided to get insured.
Not only does he have to pay 170 euros per month!! but when they asked how long he had been living here(since April 2007) he was also expected to pay for those months he wasn't covered!!!
Whose ever heard of back-dating insurance! So a word of warning. If you do decide to get insurance tell them you have just moved here!

All foreigners--including EU citizens--are required to have health insurance. This is not new.

I know it's not new news but it's the bit about backdating the insurance to the time you moved here.
I knew about the insurance i only just found out about the backdating business.

Ummm . . . You should tell your friend to give a local insurance broker a call. Does he have state or private health insurance? Anyway, there are LOTS of questions to be asked before jumping to a 2210€ conclusion. None of our self-employed clients have ever had to go through this "back payment" thing.

That's universal health care for ya . . . I hope to Jesus/Allah/Buddah that the US doesn't join in on this bull shit.

If you move to Germany from another EU country, e.g. in my case from the UK, do you have to take out private health insurance from day one if you don't have a job? Does your years of paying into the UK National Insurance system carry over at all? How about if you are still being prescribed medication from your UK GP when you move; do you have to start claiming that from private health insurance as soon as you leave the UK?

actually, if you are from the EU you can make a declaration for the first year you are here and extend that to the next so that you can contnue paying hypothecated tax in the home country without being required to get health, unemployment, care and pension insurance here in Germany. That suits those of us who move from EU country to country on a short term basis.

I made such a declaration for the first two tax years I was here and continued to pay NI in the UK which covered me here in Germany for all my health needs but was considerably cheaper than paying for German insurance.

I didn't say you had to have *German* health insurance (although it may get harder to get around that in the future), just that you had to have health insurance coverage.

actually as of april 2007, _everyone_ is required to have health insurance. prior to that if you were a german citizen or had perm. residency, you did not have to have it.

simon-zero: your friend made the mistake to sign up for public health insurance and not private health insurance (though if he is married with children it might not be a mistake in general after all) because only the public health insurance will require back-payments. If you are found after Jan. 2009 without insurance or sufficient funds to cover a treatment/surgery, this will even become worse. But since he is appearantly self-employed/free-lancing, he has also the choice to opt for international or German private health insurances and there this problem would not have occured at all. Once more a clear case where the help of an independent broker would have prevented serious monetary problems for someone.
You or the friend might want to check the WIKI on health insurance here on Toytown with loads of information (pls check the 2007 up-dated version only) or check our website for information on health insurance in English here http://www.crcie.com/pageID_5742682.html

Cheerio

I'm sorry, I just don't get why people think it is bad to require health insurance coverage? I find it incredibly selfish not to be insured.
And yes, the state scheme might cost more per month than the private, but it also covers an entire family even if they can't pay the coverage for awhile (due to unemployment or illness).
I knew a family here for months without coverage, which was really fun when one of the kids got sick - all of the money they had saved on premiums? Yeah, all of a sudden they are now state insured.
I suppose if you are not insured and get sick, then you are responsible. Right. And if you show up at the hospital with a burst appendix? Worse yet, your kid does? FFS How short-sighted can one be?
*shakes head

State costs more per month than private? I thought it was the other way around - private more expensive that state?

For me, private costs more than state. But I am a woman, over 30 and also insure 2 kids.

Generalisations but: State probably costs more than private if you are young, single and will never get married & have kids.
Private costs more if you get married, spouse doesn't have an income & you have kids (am caught in that hole...).

I feel genuinely sorry for women, because their premiums are much higher just simply because they are women and have more potential medical issues (pregnancy etc.). Of course, that makes sense, but it is one of those things about life that is unfair. Sorry ladies.

Mmmm, but there again men tend not to look after themselves as much as women, leading to more drastic measures being taken. How many guys here get a biannual check up?

Hasn't that just changed? Mens premiums went up at the start of the year and womens went down due to some new rule that they can't discriminate between men and women.

Mine went up
I left the state scheme for the simple reason that if I couldn't afford insurance, I wanted to at least make sure the kids were insured. Being a freelancer didn't mean the state scheme would kick in if I couldn't pay unless I gave up freelancing and went unemployed. However, if money were to be that tight, I could more easily pay their premiums, or get family to help there, than to cover the huge lump sum of state insurance. The total is the same, give or take, though in the end with deductables I pay more for private. But I can, if need ever be (touch wood) drop mine and still have them covered under the private scheme.

Health insurance is a must imho. A lot of us have spent too much time and effort building up our wealth and assets to run the risk of just burning them (and potential future income stream and pension) up on healthcare bills.

It's not just physical health. There's also life's randomness. We might have a bad accident, not of our own making.

The classic theory: the cost of low probability but high impact risks should be transferred, usually to an insurance provider.

Serenissima
There is an E?? which you can get from the Dept. of Work and Pensions if you are moving to Germany
and you have a qualifying record of UK NI contributions.
This covers you for health insurance for a limited time - e.g. when looking for work.
Check with the DWP.
There are special rules for pensioners.
Normal folk of working age will presumably end up working for an employer
or being self insured and will need to be privately or "Gesetzlich" insured.
If you don't qualify for the E?? then you are supposed to be insured in Germany.
if not and and you need medical attention you have to pay for it yourself.
(Cheaper than I had imagined, but for serious problems can be astronomical).
One alternative is a UK based insurance that covers you for things that must be dealt with in 48
hours in Germany - otherwise you fly back to the UK, and get NHS treatment.
I used one of these when I thought I would be returning to the UK - now, 10
years later I'm insured with the TKK (English on their website too..)
and going through convoluted discussions as to how much I should pay
as a pensioner...

It used to be called E101 and though that is still available it has largely been superceded by the EHIC card, which you can apply for from the DOH if still paying NI


You can actually continue to pay NI in the UK for up to two tax years after moving here during which time the EHIC can be used to access healthcare. AOK handle reimbursement in these cases and claim it back from the NHS. This can get a little complicated and some doctors might tell you that you are not covered when you are. But if you persists (and in some cases liaise with the NHS yourself) you should not have to pay a penny.

I just got bollocksed by the AOK. They want me to pay for the last 2 months where I wasn't insured (between jobs). I couldn't tell them that I had just moved here because they wanted to see this and that bescheinigung. Grr! Hopefully when my E301 comes through, I'll get all my money back!

That's why it is wise to register as unemployed even if just between jobs for a short time.

to damara and all and sundry,

may i kindly suggest to you all to go and get a copy of Sicko by Michael Moore and really watch and learn.

what a disgraceful state the us system is in!!! no-one should have to go through the things that these us citizens went through on sicko. i myself spent nearly four years in the us and i too saw the system for those with the money and those without. absolute disgrace!!! shame US shame!!! (to quote Derryn Hinch for all the aussies reading this ;-D)

otherwise, the US is the greatest country on earth. if it had a good health care system oh and not to mention a good education system i would love to live there!

all the very best of health to you all!!!
comrade stella
viva fidel ;-D

The other thing to bear in mind is the importance of certain regular screening checks as we age. Decent healthcare packages provide these usually. Once we get to middle age, the stories of cancers being spotted through mammograms, skin lesion checks, smears etc sadly increases dramatically .

I did! But the Agentur fuer Arbeit won't pay for my health insurance until I show them a E301 formula. GRRRR! So, my boyfriend is paying out of his money for my insurance... but the AOK /AfA said they would pay the money back once I get my form.

ARGH!

hello all,

just a little correction, if the US had affordable health and education systems - as the US does have excellent education and health, but only the employed and/or the wealthy can really access them so that is why the 50 million uninsured have it sooooooo bad.

cheers from an atheist australian,
have a great sunday
and GOD bless America!

Yes, we (the US) have a problem with our healthcare system that needs some serious fixing, BUT universal health care (or the system we have in Germany) is not the best way to go. I am a married woman with no children, and I am a small business owner (both in US and Germany). While it's not all smooth sailing for small business owners/free lancers in the US, in Germany, it's so much harder to keep your head above water.
In the US, I have private health insurance, which is pricey, but I have CHOICES. I can choose to pay $400 per month for excellent health care w/little to no copay/deductables if I have the means to do so; however, many new small business owners don't; so the insurance I have costs about $90 per month with a $3500 annual deductable, which means that my insurance will not pay for anything until I have met my deductable. What this means for me is that I am taking a risk of having to pay $3500 up front (plus my monthly premiums) if I come down with a case of cancer or if a building falls on my head and the f*cking building owners refuse to pay for it.

In the US, I can choose to take this risk because I CANNOT afford to pay $400 per month for excellent insurance (or +/- €300 for private German health insurance), and in the end, I would be paying the approximate amount of cash whether I pay $400 per month, or $90 per month +$3500 deductable; of course, in the later scenario, I only have to pay IF I need it . . . My choice, my risk.

I understand that there are families out there who need coverage for their children, but sometimes the state scheme doesn't provide a nice option for families (in the case of self-employed parents). What sense does it make for someone who earns €48,149 per year to have to pay €498 for mandatory health insurance, when someone who earns €48,150 per year can choose to pay €258 for private health insurance (exact same benefits)?

The state scheme is great for those making little to no money, but it sucks for those stuck somewhere between poor and rich/very young and very old . . . I am a part of the middle class yuppies who sees the fruits of her 50+ hrs per week of hard work get swiped away by big government subsidies, and the liberty to manage her own money taken away for the illusion of a safety net.

Cheers indeed, to the US not buying into this universal healthcare shize.

You can pay NI contributions voluntarily as long as you are in Germany (up to I think 30 years of contributions).
This helps you to get your 30 years entitlement to the full UK state pension.(O/K
it is only 4.5 K per year - but it is index linked as long as you are a pensioner
in the EU and a few other countries).
The cost is minimal.
My mistake was not going back to the UK to claim it!
The UK Dept of Work and Pensions put you into the tender hands of
the BfA in Berlin Wilmersdorf and it takes for ever!

Does anyone know whether I will automatically get Arbeitlosengeld when I give them my E301 form? The AOK want me to pay shed loads of money for insurance for now, but then the Agentur fuer Arbeit will pay it back when I give them the form.