U.S. Presidential Election 2008

Sarah Palin simply is not qualified for the job. She is barely qualified for her current position. She was chosen for 2 reasons
1. She has a vagina
2. She is staunchly conservative, in that hardcore religous way

She is a gimmick pick.

I agree it's a little weird that scheduled speeches by Bush and Cheney have been scrapped. Not exactly sure what they're doing to aid with Hurricane Gustav, especially since Cheney's leaving the country, but whatever...

I think the more interesting aspect of Palin is her fight to tap ANWR oil. She's said she would only take the position of VP if it would benefit Alaska. And the massive amounts of federal money and influx of new tax profits that would flow into Alaska would be astronomical. They wouldn't have to introduce a sales tax for ages.

Regarding the election, I can see the ticket playing this ANWR card to appeal to those worked up into a frenzy over dependence on foreign oil and the price of gas, while McCain can play the moderate who leans against it, as he actually respects the treaty Reagan signed preventing such drilling. What happens once they're elected is anyone's guess, but with the #2 aggressively pushing for drilling, you'd have to think that may emerge as an item of importance for the administration.

If that's the case, it certainly looks like a selection made by the old guard.

...and that is what keeps a lot of people out of public service. Public service requires this, the needs of the community, or nation come before the needs of one's family. It's hard but necessary. It's understandable that not everyone can do this, there are enough people who are willing to step up to the plate so that not everyone needs to.

I respectfully disagree. People can and do balance work and family (whether in the public sphere or not). However when the kids are infants and or there is an obvious need/crisis, then the family must weigh what is in the best interest of the family.

I have to agree with Cinzia that if this was 4 years later and she had a 4 year old Downs child and a grandma of a 4 year old, and her daughter was 21, this might be a very different story.

Of course there are cicumstances where one can not do the best for their family, in order to serve the greater good of society or the world, but I do not believe this is one of those circumstances.

Congratulations. You're meddling in another person's private life with as much enthusiasm as your average bigoted suburban housewife who looks down on anyone who isn't married with children and goes to church every Sunday.

Which is exactly why you would make a shitty politician. Politics is not family friendly, and running a country is not like running a family. But politicians need happy-looking fresh-faced families because voters think precisely the way you do, and really needing to feel that elected officials are representative of their exact lifestyle and ideals. It's a huge joke. Politicians are not like you but you think they should be.


Morals matter because Americans have an insatiable thirst for scandal, drama, and Schadenfreud, and want their politicians to represent the opposite, the squeaky clean ideal, because they wish to be represented to themselves and to the world as having all the morals they secretly despise or find unattainable or unsustainable. If politicians fall from grace, all the better, because the public gets bored by Really Good people, and then there's the joy of being morally outraged and relief that not even these idols can keep up the moral act.

I'll first agree with that, and second continue to wonder why people like to paint me so anti-american, when all i ever hope to point out is stuff like what you write above.

props to JW as well

No I read it right.
Of centeries/generations of educating kids in American society and yet there continues to be the epidemic of unwed and unmarried teen mothers, Palin's 17 y/o daughter Bristol just became another statistic. But since she's the daughter of a mother who is the potential VP of the Nation, well, I guess she should be treated like the special child she is.
I totally agree with these statements:
1,
2,


You're trying to divert from the real issue of importance. It's not about exploiting a child (you used my word btw) it's about the deeper political meaning in this electorial race, the conservative agenda and lack thereof.

Wait, are you saying I painted you as anti-American? I wasn't writing about you at all. Confused.

Oh, nevermind, I got it. (Coffee deficiency)

I don't know why people do that, either. I guess because there is a very narrowly defined realm of thinking that is safely American. Thoughts are dangerous. Criticism can kill. Ooooo.

Well call me crazy, but I hope for improvements in education, health care, infrastructure, getting out of Iraq, and a whole host of other things that have NOTHING to do with what you just said. And I am as Yankee as they come (from a VERY Repub family). I also staunchly supported Bill Clinton, despite all the BJ drama.

I believe in separation of Church and State, and with the Republicans that always seems to get muddled.

and that's the irony, isn't it? Self-proclaimed feminists damning a woman for choosing to have it all.

sorry JW, I am hardly a church going Suburban housewife . Would be nice to paint anyone who feels as I do as one, but no.

Well said, in other words.

We need to be looking at the entire C.V. of these people before we hire them to run the most powerful country in the world.

Barack Obama: B.A. From Columbia University in Political Science w/ specialization in International Relations
J.D. Magna cum laude from Harvard where he was editor of the Harvard Law Review. Obama worked as a community organizer and practiced as a civil rights attorney before serving in the Illinois Senate from 1997 to 2004. He taught constitutional law at the University of Chicago Law School from 1992 to 2004. After a primary victory in March 2004, Obama delivered the keynote address at the Democratic National Convention in July 2004. He was elected to the Senate in November 2004 with 70% of the vote.

As a member of the Democratic minority in the 109th Congress, he helped create legislation to control conventional weapons and to promote greater public accountability in the use of federal funds. He also made official trips to Eastern Europe, the Middle East, and Africa. During the 110th Congress, he helped create legislation regarding lobbying and electoral fraud, climate change, nuclear terrorism, and care for returned U.S. military personnel. After announcing his presidential campaign in February 2007, Obama emphasized withdrawing American troops from Iraq, energy independence, decreasing the influence of lobbyists, and promoting universal health care as top national priorities.

Joe Biden: Biden graduated from Archmere Academy in Claymont, Delaware and, in 1965, from the University of Delaware in Newark, where he double-majored in history and political science. He went on to receive his J.D. from Syracuse University College of Law in 1968, and was admitted to the Delaware Bar in 1969. Has served 6 consecutive terms in the senate.

John McCain: B.S from the Naval Academy fifth from the bottom in class rank, 894th out of 899.
1958 and became a naval aviator
1967 to 1973 prisoner of war by the North Vietnamese
1982 in the U.S. House of Representatives
1986 US Senate
Lost Republican presidential nomination in 2000

Sarah Palin: 1983 transferred in to North Idaho College from Hawaii Pacific College in Honolulu, Hawaii
1984 won the Miss Wasilla beauty contest, then finished 2nd in the Miss Alaska pageant.
1987 Bachelor of Science degree in communications-journalism from the University of Idaho, where she also minored in political science.
1988, sports reporter for KTUU-TV in Anchorage, Alaska
1992 - 1996 Alaska city council, as a member of the Alaskan Independence Party.
1996 - became a Republican
1996 - Mayor of Wasilla (pop. 9000)
1997 - Fired the police chief for not supporting her administration.
1999 - Reelected mayor
2002 - Lost bid for Lieutenant Governor
2003 - 2004 appointed to the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
2006 - 2008 Governor of Alaska

But careful, if you like the democrats you're a LEFTIST, and nobody will listen to you here because you're a LEFTIST! Good god no!

Just because you can choose to have it all doesn't mean that circumstances support that being the best choice all the time.

From your article


Cindy McCain's response about Sarah Palin on the news report that Palin's 17 year old daughter Bristol, unwed and unmarried, is pregnant.

Truly, you can't make this stuff up.

Yes, the feminist can have it all, but that doesn't mean that it works out well for the kids... I figured that out myself and quit my high earning job to raise my son. You can always go back to your career... your baby can't get those important years back. There is a reason that Germany gives women 3 years off -- because those are the most important years in human development. This has been pretty well established. And hey, if mama's career is the more important, then dad should quit and stay home! And he should remain attached to the stove, barefoot, too.

You left out the part where he was the RIAA's little bitch and an opponent of allowing people on the Internet have privacy from the FBI. Not to mention his efforts to make it a felony to record internet radio - thank god he has his priorities straight and his fingers on the pulse of the problems of real americans. And he is a patriot act defender.

I'm happily ambidextrous. I am beholden to neither party. In fact, I won't make up my mind who will get my vote in this election until I hear some debates!

This is what I see:
Magna cum laude from Harvard or fifth from the bottom at the Naval Academy?
6-term senator Biden or the beauty queen?

It's a no-brainer - literally.

I didn't "damn" her, I gave you my personal reasons why I did't think this is a good time for her to run. As have other professional women on here who also happen to have the experience of having kids.

Melia said it better than I can.

Just because one is a feminist does not mean the ability to "have it all" should trump everything at all times. Having freedoms requires making thoughtful and careful choices. Our actions do not occur in a vaccuum, but effects those around us, especially our families.

Like I said, tell me her husband will pick up the role of primary here, and I would feel differently...though not about her political beliefs.

How is it possible that similar feelings can be invoked in different people?
Could it be, because the GOP Evangelicalism permeates every agenda.

You may want to include the entire CV when comparing them. I especially enjoyed the attention given to Obama's almost 4 years in the senate while McCains 22 years comes out in one bullet statement.

Fair enough, but McCain's 22 years in the Senate are already well known, and I also didn't go into his involvement in the Keating 5 scandal or his cheating on his first wife, or Cindy McCain's drug addiction and theft of drugs from a charity, or his votes against alternative energies, etc. I was just trying to keep it short and to the point.

I think this election has given the holier-than-thou Republicans a taste of their own medicine and that's what is driving the train wreck.
Country First, Family Values - God and Country!
The GOP has a candidate that is a middle leaning conservative and selects a VP who does seem to represent the religious family values that that party screams is the RIGHT way. (not wrong way). Compare the four candidates:
McCain - Bomb, Bomb Iran WAR HERO, calls his wife a C word in front of cameras, makes weekly gaffes. Calls himself a reformer/maverick and selects a woman nobody knows that believes in home schooling, religious anti-gay, anti-choice, and being investigated for corruption, with a pregnant minor daughter. This is supposed to make him look stronger so therefore a good balanced ticket. Following right along with the Republican network - Fair and Balanced. You decide sheep.
Then you look at those (be damned) lefties:
Obama: Rock Star, supposedly corrupted by a racist ranting Rev but had a working (unproud) wife, that he married before having two daughters and selects Biden to compliment his knowledge, education and lack of executive experience. He believes in sex education, health care and bringing all parties ideas to the table and debating without attacking the person's character. One thing - gay couples don't have unplanned pregnancies.
Republicans are on the defense because they have a weaker ticket now. She would do the party a favor by withdrawing but frankly, I'd like to keep her. It hasn't been this exciting since Super Tuesday #1.
Edit: In other words, they can dish it out, but they can't take it.

Well, it's easy to keep things short wih Obama, so I understand how, for the sake of brevity, you could list all of Obama's accomplishments while appearing to slight McCain.

Maybe she is a cunt.

WTF Kitty Kat?! Post 3073. I didn't say that! Don't quote me on what I didn't even say, man.

it even links to where you tried to quote me from. i didn't even say that. (i agree however)

Not exactly a credibility booster

Senate experience is not the only kind of experience that's relevant and I place a very high priority on the education of my leaders.

i couldn't agree more with post 3076

A commentator on NPR yesterday said that her husband had cut his hours back to parttime to take care of the kids. Haven't seen it in print to link it though.

Oh chill ... I absolutely agree with the feelings expressed in the Posts.
I just wanted to point out that even individuals with vastly different political views can find some agreement in this.
And why? Because (my words) there's a common thread that is the GOP and it underminds their political agenda, at their expense.

no disrepect to your post at all, um, that would be post 3011 thou.

So two wrongs make a right...

So you believe Obama's education trumps McCain's experience?

Do you think that Obama's stint as editor of the Harvard Law Review beats McCains time commanding a Naval Air Wing for leadership education?

What does Obama have in his educational CV to compare with McCains year of study at the National War College?

Which university that Obama attended stresses leadership as much as the Naval Academy, whose purpose is to train leaders for the Navy, not just offer educational degrees?

Are you sure eduction of the leaders is important to you?

He is a set netter, he only works during fishing season anyway!

The BBC has created a kind of vox pops of Republican voters to get their views before, during and after the convention. But with this note:


Because I'm not really in a position to judge (I don't really know enough about the topic, nor wider US public opinion), are these readers a fair cross-section of the Republican voter?
Would be nice to get some feedback on this, thanks.

Isn't he also an oil production operator on Alaska's North Slope?

Is McCain going to impose martial law if he is elected?

first of all, in my view, good leaders are born that way, so to suggest that Obama would not be a good leader because he didn't receive "leadership training" is not that valid. McDonald's managers also receive training. I'm sure they have steadfast control over their own destiny and the lives of their McCrew.

It's the ones who aren't deeply entrenched in the system who could likely affect change, because they haven't allowed themselves to be warped by the corruption of it. In this sense, Obama's "inexperience" works in his favour. His message is change, so why are you holding him to "old rules"? He's the first one to point out that those rules have gotta go. the old way of doing things, of thinking, has gotta go.

Tell me someone, does all this finger pointing actually lead to something or is it about venting frustration? I mean, for the more hardcores on either side, it sounds like nothing would sway your vote. You're indoctrinated. I know you'll try to avoid thinking about it by fighting back at me, so I'll just save you the time and say I'm not quite indoctrinated, but I would vote Obama without hesitation. For one reason - if what he says is true, that sounds like the best bit of crap to come out of a politician's mouth in decades.

What do the republicans want again? I only seem to catch them talking about why the other guy isn't good. I don't really know what their message is.

Perhaps. But these are funnier.

I don't think graduating from Harvard Law School is something to bat an eye at...

on experience, or lack thereof:

"...the anecdotal evidence of Abraham Lincoln to prove that experience does not matter: "I mean, the most famous example, of course, is Abraham Lincoln, who is probably our least experienced president, who was sandwiched between our two most experienced presidents, Buchanan and Andrew Johnson, both of whom were failures."

source: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/kyle-drennen/...ency-not-really

It's certainly far more difficult and a rarer achievement to become editor of the Harvard Law Review than it is to command a Naval Air Wing. In other words, it's a far greater distinction. There's only one editor of the Harvard Law Review. There are lots of naval officers (most of whom were far better scholars than McCain, as has already been pointed out).

So, to answer your question, yes, I think it beats it. By a long shot.

Yeah, you can command a naval air wing if you are almost dead last in your class, getting into harvard and being law review editor (even with the rampant grade inflation) at least requires some kind of basic competence.

uhhhh...

she wants to be the vice president of the united states of america - she has no more privacy. and, anyone who wants to be in celebrity status should expect criticism and mass-mobbing - just goes with the job

gotta know what kinda person you're trying to get to run the country, right?

i have no problem if a woman wants to get involved in national and global politics but if she has fires burning at home, that has more of a priority in my opinion. same if it were a single father with little kids. he has no business running around the country and the world and being on every wierdo's hit-list.

but that's just what i think

I didn't say Obama would not or is n ot a good leader, just that McCain is a better leader. That's my opinion based on both my experience and education.

You're right that leaders are born, but leadership training enhances their effectiveness and makes them better, just as with any skill or talent.

Anyway, I think we have different opinions on leadership.
Edit: as shown by those who think being editor of student publication shows leadership

*applauding going on in my head*

no you do have good points, though as a leader you need a vision to lead people towards. There has been a lot of bad press lately about McCain being more or less the flip-flop king. (or is that leader?)

Without it descending into a completely petty debate on flip-flopping, I could tell you what Obama wants for America. I couldn't tell you what McCain wants. If I don't know that, it's irrelevant to me how good one's leadership ability is. "Hey Folks! I can lead you to... wherever you want to go, so long as I get to drive! Even brought this perty lady with me because I thought you guys would like that..."

Then why are Ayers, Rezko and Auchi off limits?

On the leadership issue, you might compare the running of the two campaigns. Obama's campaign has been a model of organization. His staff relaxed and happy with united goals and Obama obviously quite firmly in charge. McCain's has been split and marked by infighting and he's been seen to be constantly swayed by one special interests group after another.
No contest there either. McCain may be able to lead a bunch of soldiers that have to follow, but can he lead people who have a choice? Obama obviously can.