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U.S. Presidential Election 2008

McCain-Palin vs. Obama-Biden

Toytown Germany > Discussion forum > Themes > International affairs
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BadBob
O' Hail the Messiah Lord Obama



The only thing more annoying than listening to Hillary herself is reading how many times eurovol writes:"post-Wisconsin." Anyway, Phase I of "Operation K-os" is complete...Hillary is out, completely out of the running. Now for Phase II...
cinzia
eurovol, I am curious as to why you want Hillary to go on tour to support Obama to begin with. You hate her. Presumably other Obama-leaning voters also hate Hillary and might be swayed the other way by her participation in Obama's campaign. She couldn't even run her own campaign properly, according to you.

Surely she'd only say the wrong thing, or cry, or laugh insincerely, or something. Surely she'd only be trying to grab the spotlight from Obama.

Why do you think it would be helpful to Obama for Hillary to heavily support him?

Seems to me she's damned if she does and damned if she don't, in your book. It's her fault Obama's campaign is foundering (not an exaggeration), either way.
BadBob
Just Biden Our Time



Joe Biden is a loser! laugh.gif
MonksTown
Seeing Madge made a pretty clear statement when she openend her tour in Cardiff:

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/politik/711/307662/text/
eurovol
QUOTE (cinzia @ Aug 25 2008, 8:21 pm) *
Seems to me she's damned if she does and damned if she don't, in your book.

It is her fault that she allowed Republicans to use her to hurt the Democratic Nominee. Yes, she owns that!

Did you read the Times about her visit to Florida? Her own supporters are begging her to do more to unite the Party and do more to support Obama. There may even be a concerted effort by her most ardent supporters to disrupt the Convention. I know of a few of them there already and they are not promoting "unity".
gatzke
QUOTE (eurovol @ Aug 25 2008, 8:36 pm) *
It is her fault that she allowed Republicans to use her to hurt the Democratic Nominee. Yes, she owns that!

Is it her fault she pointed out the obvious points lacking the background of BHO? His lack of experience, his lack of specificity?

Those are legit points that would be made even if she had not brought them out.

Although it makes for a good spot showing her and Biden digging into BHO (and Biden praising McCain).

There is no swiftboating needed, just a youtube clip show!
eurovol
Legit or not, there is a huge difference between a Republican being shown saying it and Clinton being shown saying it. Clinton was the one praising McCain while tearing down a fellow Democrat.
BadBob
But Hillary did win the popular vote in the primary. Nobama dissed her and her supporters by not picking her for VP.
cinzia
QUOTE (eurovol @ Aug 25 2008, 7:36 pm) *
Did you read the Times about her visit to Florida? Her own supporters are begging her to do more to unite the Party and do more to support Obama. There may even be a concerted effort by her most ardent supporters to disrupt the Convention. I know of a few of them there already and they are not promoting "unity".

Surely you're not concerned that Obama can't bring all these rogue Democrats together.
eurovol
Fuck that. Hillary did not win period! That is the first thing Hillary needs to set the record straight on.

Watch the convention online here: http://www.demconvention.com/
eurovol
QUOTE (cinzia @ Aug 25 2008, 8:55 pm) *
Surely you're not concerned that Obama can't bring all these rogue Democrats together.

Bring women feeling scorned back into the tent to elect a male? hahahahahahahahahahhahhaha God himself couldn't do that! GET FUCKING REAL! wink.gif
BadBob
QUOTE (eurovol @ Aug 25 2008, 8:58 pm) *
God himself couldn't do that! GET FUCKING REAL!

I'd be careful about what you say about the Lord if I was you.

God Unleashes His Almighty Fury Upon Democratic Convention


QUOTE
Yesterday, throngs of insurgent liberals, communists, homosexuals, deviants and all around ne'er-do-wells descended upon to the fine God-fearing city of Denver, Colorado to pay homage to their new savior in a four day festival of depraved debauchery...At least three tornadoes touched down Sunday afternoon southeast of Denver...
cinzia
QUOTE (eurovol @ Aug 25 2008, 7:58 pm) *
Bring women feeling scorned back into the tent to elect a male? hahahahahahahahahahhahhaha God himself couldn't do that! GET FUCKING REAL!

Sorry, haven't we ladies been electing males now for 88 years?

What is the point of Mr. Yes We Can, again, if he can't even get a reasonable consensus among like-minded people?
MonksTown
<<Yesterday, throngs of insurgent liberals, communists, homosexuals, deviants and all around ne'er-do-wells descended upon to the fine God-fearing city of Denver>>

Passport. Check.
KY. Check.
Alexis Carrington shoulder pads. Check.

All I need to do now is start a thread on the best MVV ticket combo to the airport. laugh.gif
gatzke
QUOTE (cinzia @ Aug 25 2008, 9:15 pm) *
Sorry, haven't we ladies been electing males now for 88 years?

What is the point of Mr. Yes We Can, again, if he can't even get a reasonable consensus among like-minded people?

Don't feel bad, conservatives still don't like McCain.

He has been soft on the border.

He did McCain Feingold which some people says limits free speech.

He has said some bad things about unbridled capitalism.

He certainly has not inspired the Republicans...
kitty_kat
QUOTE (BadBob @ Aug 25 2008, 8:52 pm) *
But Hillary did win the popular vote in the primary. Nobama dissed her and her supporters by not picking her for VP.

Are you 100% certain about that?

There was no dissing...just a figment of the GOP imagination, which runs rampant these days.

Who knows what arrangements were hammered out between Obama and Clinton during the close of the DNC primary run. For all we know, it was Clinton that may have suggested Biden. I wasn't in the room and I highly doubt you were. What I don't see is Clinton fighting back against claims she was. That irks me.
BadBob


thefirelane


gatzke
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 9:52 pm) *

Did you even read your own link? Two of the totals show HRC with more votes than BHO, depending on how you count it.

To a rational observer, you could argue HRC had more of the popular vote than BHO.

Of course there would be an asterisk. BHO was not on the MI ballot. Some states do caucuses, so votes are estimated. Etc.

But the crazed women do have a reason to be angry. She was so close but she eventually lost by a very thin margin, assuming you count the popular vote purely democratically. No super delegates or crazy caucus rules.

If I were a rich right-winger, I would be donating to all the angry PUMAs to help get them to Denver, just to see operation chaos keep rolling.

Maybe the local conservatives should get out and voice their heartfelt support for HRC? I think i just threw up in my mouth a little bit...
BadBob


kitty_kat
Badbob ... you have yet to contribute anything of substance.

If all you plan to do is post idiotic you tube clips...shouldn't you start your own thread?

That way you can indulge all you want.
BadBob
Joe Biden On Barack Obama


How's that for substance!
Conquistador
KK, with "contributions" like the below conspiracy theory flat out lie you aren't in a secure place to be panning anyone else's posts. I am sure it's just a coincidence you didn't pan McCain critic TFL's YouTube postings. rolleyes.gif

QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 12:33 pm) *
BOY is is not? It suits you.
Please ... The reason Cindy McCain hasn't been fully exposed in the media is because of some under the table cash exchange at the networks. Um, the internet has been on fire with her for months! Cindy's been a bad girl... Should we go there?

You really outdid youself with this whopper, KK. I recommend saving your imagination for that novel you're writing.
kitty_kat
QUOTE (gatzke @ Aug 25 2008, 10:08 pm) *
Did you even read your own link? Two of the totals show HRC with more votes than BHO, depending on how you count it.

To a rational observer, you could argue HRC had more of the popular vote than BHO.

Of course there would be an asterisk. BHO was not on the MI ballot. Some states do caucuses, so votes are estimated. Etc.

But the crazed women do have a reason to be angry. She was so close but she eventually lost by a very thin margin, assuming you count the popular vote purely democratically. No super delegates or crazy caucus rules.

If I were a rich right-winger, I would be donating to all the angry PUMAs to help get them to Denver, just to see operation chaos keep rolling.

Maybe the local conservatives should get out and voice their heartfelt support for HRC? I think i just threw up in my mouth a little bit...

Absolutely...maybe you missed the total count line?
To a casual observer, you might assume yes, based on the emotional outcry of a few.
Obama withdrew his name after MI violated the DNC rules by running an early primary.

The crazed women are just that. There's not one concern about the Democratic Party, they're Hilliary groupies and as such, will never see beyond POTUS Hillary.
Jules Winnfield
The point is that now BHO can definitively take HRC's grassroots support and shove it up his ass because he is not going to get it and he doesn't deserve it either. He disrespected her and the people who voted for her, thinking he could just dismiss them and pull the wool over their eyes with his empty rhetoric as easily as he's done to his own supporters, and since that isn't the case, he's going to pay the price.

QUOTE
Obama withdrew his name after MI violated the DNC rules by running an early primary.

That's chickenshit. Obama astutely withdrew his name in a state that he knew he would lose anyway.
kitty_kat
QUOTE (BadBob @ Aug 25 2008, 10:20 pm) *
How's that for substance!

You've failed miserably. Unless you were attempting to make a point.
gatzke
Badbob ... you always contribute something of substance.

Please, plan to continually post idiotic you tube clips...this is the right thread!

Please indulge me all you want.
BadBob
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:27 pm) *
You've failed miserably. Unless you were attempting to make a point.

How about this one then?
Passed Over

kitty_kat
QUOTE (Jules Winnfield @ Aug 25 2008, 10:26 pm) *
The point is that BHO can take HRC's grassroots support and shove it up his ass because he is not going to get it and he doesn't deserve it either. He disrespected her and the people who voted for her, thinking he could just dismiss them and pull the wool over their eyes with his empty rhetoric as easily as he's done to his own supporters, and since that isn't the case, he's going to pay the price.

That's chickenshit. Obama astutely withdrew his name in a state that he knew he would lose anyway.

Please, they are hardcore for Hillary and care nothing about the Party. They can either shut up so the Party can move ahead to get things done. Or take their votes elsewhere, because at the heart of the matter they never were providing support to the DNC in the first place. It was all about Hillary for President.

Wrong, Obama was the only candidate during the campaign that ran things legit when it came to delegates. Pulling his name off the ballot as required by the DNC was the right thing to do. So who's calling in the bs?
Conquistador
I don't think you average Democrat gives a hoot about "supporting the Democratic National Committee" nor do they wake up every morning with that on their agenda. Furthermore, there is no reason to believe HRC's grassroots supporters aren't loyal Democrats.
gatzke
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:23 pm) *
Absolutely...maybe you missed the total count line?

Your link has four different "total count" lines depending on how you count the votes. BHO won twice, HRC won twice.

QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:23 pm) *
To a casual observer, you might assume yes, based on the emotional outcry of a few.
Obama withdrew his name after MI violated the DNC rules by running an early primary.

18 Million votes are just a few? When Barry only beat her by a few hundred thou? If I liked her I would be pissed. Actually I was tranced by BHO for a bit. I love that "yes we can" stuff. But then the "God damn america" sorta covers that up.

So Obama is a quitter than can't bend rules to get things done? Oops, twising your words. Apologies.
kitty_kat
Then I suppose there would be no need for the Public surge to join the Democratic Party so they can vote in this election. So people are supporting the Party.
BadBob
But seriously, you've got to watch "The One"
The One

Conquistador
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:40 pm) *
Then I suppose there would be no need for the Public surge to join the Democratic Party so they can vote in this election. So people are supporting the Party.

You don't have to be a registered Democrat to vote in the general election. A significant number of people registered Democrat to vote in the Democratic primaries in states which require voters to be registered as members of a party to vote in that party's primaries.

I suspect most people were interested in supporting a candidate, rather than the DNC. It's common sense, really. Only the eurovols of the world dream of "supporting the DNC".

QUOTE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_National_Committee
The Democratic National Committee (DNC) is the principal organization governing the United States Democratic Party on a day to day basis. While it is responsible for overseeing the process of writing a platform every four years, the DNC's central focus is on campaign and political activity in support of Democratic Party candidates, and not on public policy

I have heard people say they support(ed) Obama or HRC. I have never heard anyone say that they "supported the DNC". The DNC is far from the average person's mind.
Jules Winnfield
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:36 pm) *
Please, they are hardcore for Hillary and care nothing about the Party.

And Obama's angry, hardcore MoveOn.org support really "cares" about the party? biggrin.gif They're the ones who all voted for Nader in 2000. They're the ones who are pissed off that he is moving towards the center. They're the ones who must be seething, if they are intellectually honest, that he picked a VP running mate who voted for the war in Iraq.

QUOTE
Obama was the only candidate during the campaign that ran things legit when it came to delegates. Pulling his name off the ballot as required by the DNC was the right thing to do. So who's calling in the bs?

He pulled his name from a state that he knew he would have lost by a landslide anyway - it's nothing to write home about.
kitty_kat
QUOTE (gatzke @ Aug 25 2008, 10:38 pm) *
Your link has four different "total count" lines depending on how you count the votes. BHO won twice, HRC won twice.
18 Million votes are just a few? When Barry only beat her by a few hundred thou? If I liked her I would be pissed. Actually I was tranced by BHO for a bit. I love that "yes we can" stuff. But then the "God damn america" sorta covers that up.

So Obama is a quitter than can't bend rules to get things done? Oops, twising your words. Apologies.

Take note... Popular vote (first line) shows the real count - minus MI (as is appropiate) because those votes were not counted, per DNC violations.
Sure, you can look at the Popular vote with MI now...but seeing as the delegates by Hillary will be signed over to Obama. What's the point in trying to justify Hillary's delegates?
No, Obama works on compromise to accomplish bipartisanship...have you learned nothing. rolleyes.gif
gatzke
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:49 pm) *
No, Obama works on compromise to acomplish bipartisanship...have you learned nothing.

You make me laugh.

Blinders on, full speed ahead!
Conquistador
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:36 pm) *
They can either shut up so the Party can move ahead to get things done. Or take their votes elsewhere, because at the heart of the matter they never were providing support to the DNC in the first place. It was all about Hillary for President.

QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 10:49 pm) *
No, Obama works on compromise to acomplish bipartisanship...have you learned nothing.

Hmm, demanding "people shut up or take their votes elsewhere" is not within the spirit of compromise and bipartisanship. Nor can Obama afford to lose too many previous HRC voters.
kitty_kat
QUOTE (gatzke @ Aug 25 2008, 10:58 pm) *
You make me laugh.

Blinders on, full speed ahead!

smile.gif
Absolutely...between the two they'll actually accomplish something. Can you say the same for McCain? He won't be able to much done without bridging some gaps. And the man hasn't proven that he'll be able to accomplish much without bipartisanship. Funny huh?
Conquistador
One indeed wonders what Democrats would do if they controlled both houses of Congress and occupied the White House.

Anyway, here is a potential starting point for further research into some questionable ethical activities by alleged reformer Obama and his wife:

QUOTE
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NmI0N...TJiNWY4YmYyYmI=
Michelle Obama, tonight’s big speaker, received a large payday in 2005 from the University of Chicago Medical Center — a promotion with a $200,000 annual raise. It came just after her husband became a U.S. senator. The following year, Senator Obama inserted a $1 million earmark for the hospital. Given that money is fungible, taxpayers are underwriting Mrs. Obama’s raise through 2010, thanks to her husband’s earmark (she is currently on leave from that job).


QUOTE
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/na...3598,full.story
After an unsuccessful campaign for Congress in 2000, Illinois state Sen. Barack Obama faced serious financial pressure: numerous debts, limited cash and a law practice he had neglected for a year. Help arrived in early 2001 from a significant new legal client -- a longtime political supporter.

I think we can infer what would happen...

As for the above statement by KK:

QUOTE
And the man hasn't proven that he'll be able to accomplish much without bipartisanship. Funny huh?

Uh, if this is in regards to McCain, I think having acccomplished things in a bipartisan manner is a feather in his cap, especially since the Democrats will control Congress. Obama hasn't accomplished much óf anything as a legislator.
kitty_kat
QUOTE (Conquistador @ Aug 25 2008, 10:59 pm) *
Hmm, demanding "people shut up or take their votes elsewhere" is not within the spirit of compromise and bipartisanship. Nor can Obama afford to lose too many previous HRC voters.

Obama need not worry too much about Hillary's groupies...their numbers are not so significant that they will make a noticable dent in his bid. Seeing as Hillary's people are mostly women...yet Obama has garnered the Women's vote overall Nationally over McCain, I call it as I see it.
BadBob
Debra



I call it as I see it too.
Conquistador
QUOTE (kitty_kat @ Aug 25 2008, 11:12 pm) *
Obama need not worry too much about Hillary's groupies...their numbers are not so significant that they will make a noticable dent in his bid. Seeing as Hillary's people are mostly women...yet Obama has garnered the Women's vote overall Nationally over McCain, I call it as I see it.

Interesting that you pooh-poohed McCain's relative strength among veterans, yet trumpet Obama's relative support with women. Democratic presidential candidates have done better with women voters than with men since 1980. Obama must win a majority of them to win the election. McCain just needs to minimze Obama's advantage among women to win, but that means doing better than he is now among women.

Anyway, here is some relatively recent polling by gender:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/108022/Candidat...ort-Gender.aspx

As for people "supporting the DNC", some may be interested in this:

QUOTE
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_con...partisan_trends
During July, the number of Americans who consider themselves to be Democrats fell two percentage points to 39.2%. That’s the first time since January that the number of Democrats has fallen below 41%
kitty_kat
QUOTE (BadBob @ Aug 25 2008, 11:14 pm) *
I call it as I see it too.

I see a brunette and McCain. Is that McCain's latest affair?
Conquistador
Nice smear, KK. You must be really proud of yourself.
cinzia
You really can't get a better explanation of why the PUMAs aren't going to give up so easily than this (part of an "Invitation to Democrats in Exile"):

QUOTE
Now that I am “unaffiliated”, I’m like one of those really attractive singles on hot dating sites. Obama is going to want my vote big time. When I was just a Democrat, I was completely unsexy. But I have shed that old skin, sort of like dermal abrasion, and I’m brand sparkling new and beautiful and so much smarter than I was just a few minutes ago. And my mind is suddenly unburdened. Yeah! I’m no longer worried about Social Security because that was the *old coalition’s” problem. Or universal healthcare because shared responsibility means that I might actually have to acknowledge the working class. Or high gas prices, because if people are spending too much on gas to drive to work, they should just buy a house closer to each of their jobs. Duh!

Any day now, Obama supporters will be knocking at my door and ask me to get a membership in their exclusive club. I will be treated like a queen once they scan the voter’s rolls in NJ and see my name. It will be like, “Oooo, Riverdaughter is a “creative class” unaffiliated. Well, we must really ask her to do a round of golf with us or share a latte.” I will be pampered and courted and made to feel better than all of you losers who comment on this blog.
kitty_kat
QUOTE (Conquistador @ Aug 25 2008, 11:33 pm) *
Nice smear, KK. You must be really proud of yourself.

Hardly.
Smears are based on lies...we've been over this.
McCain's affair is a well known and oft published, fact.
Conquistador
Suggesting McCain is having an affair with the woman in the video BB posted is a smear.

Speaking of smears of McCain, KK, you are very well acquainted with making them yourself.
cinzia
kitty kat, quit when you're behind. Seriously. You have no right to call Hillary supporters "crazed groupies" when you post shit like that.
kitty_kat
QUOTE (Conquistador @ Aug 25 2008, 11:42 pm) *
Suggesting McCain is having an affair with the woman in the video BB posted is a smear.

Speaking of smears of McCain, KK, you are very well acquainted with making them yourself.

Then save your words for Badbob, as the post was inappropiate then. Don'tcha think?
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