IT hourly contract rates around Stuttgart

Hi

I've been contacted about a contract Unix Admin job near Stuttgart and asked what I hourly rate I would expect. I've not worked as a contractor before so I have absolutely no idea what the going rate is at the moment. I've looked on Monster etc but hourly rates and salaries never seem to be mentioned and I also can't find anything here on TT to give me much idea.

So, could anybody please give me a rough idea on what would seem reasonable for someone with a good few years IT experience.

Cheers
POD

Could depend on what you are being asked to do. Are you looking after a couple of Linux servers or do you have a multi-node cluster based on E25k servers and rooms full of storage on your hands?

Good question.

I don't have much detail at the moment. All I know is that it is an HPUX site, they use OpenView, Service Guard and have a SAN, so I assume it is more than just a couple of servers and the odd PC lying around.

Well as the old saying goes, "There is no harm im asking", you shouldn't ask for less than 75 Euros an hour. There aren't many contracting jobs for less than 55 Euros per hour. Remember that you have to pay everything yourself. Stuttgart has some of the highest wages in Europe and there are shortages of engineers.

If Unix contractors are all getting 75 Euros an hour then I'm being underpaid here as an SAP consultant I'm getting a rate here close to what I was getting back in London. This is rare as mainland Europe traditionally paid quite a lot less, although the strong Euro means that when I convert it back into Sterling it's now similar to UK rates.

However, one thing I didn't count on is how expensive it is here. I spent a year in Frankfurt back in 2002 and it didn't seem that bad. Even simple things like toiletries and small electricals such as headphones, shavers etc are all quite a lot cheaper in England. Traditional German "bargains" such as decent camera equipment are now all cheaper in London.

However, one reason for working abroad (for me, at any rate - oh, what a pun!) is to experience a different environment. Jumping on a train and quickly being in Munich, Frankfurt, Zurich, Strasbourg etc are all things I can't usually do. Plus the beer, and generally being in a nice part of Europe (Black Forest etc.) So your hourly or daily rate really comes down to a trade off between what you could get elsewhere and whata advantages being in Stuttgart offers you.

One piece of advice though ... if you're only here for a few months, like me, then furnished apartments in nice convenient locations don't come cheap. Check that out first before negotiating a payment rate. If they don't seem to be offering enough (the Germans often sign very long leases for totally unfurnished apartments) just mention how much an apartment will cost you. They'll look shocked, and then may realise why you need so much dosh All this is assuming you're new to Germany, which you may not be. Still, my waffle may be useful for other readers. Maybe.

I would have to agree with adrianlondon. I've been contacted by agencies for support roles in various locations in Germany and the going rate seems to be around €45ph for Sys Admins and €30 for desktop support. Obviously if you have specialised unix/SAP knowledge or work in the investment banking industry then you can expect more. It will also depend on the length of the contract, shorter contracts seem to have higher rates as people are less likely to take a shorter contract.

Hi Warsteiner77, I didn't mean to imply I was on loads less than that Unix rate, just that usually I expect to be paid much more than a Unix admin for SAP Basis consultancy ;)

Even though for someone who hasn't contracted before a rate of 30-45€ an hour looks great, by the time all the expenses are taken into account (especially lack of holdiay and sickness pay - and I've no idea about German taxes as I pay all mine in the UK), it's really quite low. By the time you've rented a furnished apartment and had a few nice meals out, you'll realise that you're not making a profit ;) This is just Stuttgart though; I'm assuming other German cities are cheaper. Even Frankfurt is cheaper than here!

There could be a glut in general Sys Admin and PC/Net Ops; I don't know. Or maybe the agencies in Germany earn a fat commission.

UK rate trends can be found at http://www.contractoruk.com/market_stats/index.html although the hourly rates don't match the daily rates for some reason.

Adrian - Sorry if I came across as arsy YGPM by the way

PrinceOfDenmark - you might want to have a look at cwjobs.co.uk as there are normally quite a few contract roles in Germany advertised there and you should be able to get a better idea of the amount this contract should pay.

Hi - not arsey at all! I just didn't want to be misunderstood

Having hit the shops in Stuttgart properly for the first time today, "rip off Britain" seems to be a mistake. Books here are so expensive; they all seem to go at RRP. I looked at hair trimmers, bicycle pedals, and camera straps and candy lollipops - a rather random collection of stuff. Every one of those (same brand, model, everything) is cheaper in London.

I'm going to stick to spending my money on beer and sausages. A man can survive on that. If it weren't for the apartment rental, I'd be rich.

They have to, by law (Buchpreisbindung). At least non-imported stuff.

I think it's quite cheap here, but it just depends how you go about things. Rememember that you can claim double-household costs if you are working under the UK-German double taxation treaty. This means you can offset all your rent, flights and other costs like buying furniture against earnings. If books are expensive order them online? My total monthly commuting cost here is 65 Euros. This also covers the majority of my leisure travel. I use car sharing on which I spend less than 1000 Euros a year, this includes all petrol, insurance etc.. My total house-hold running costs are less than Uk too, city tax is less. I generally find eating out cheaper than England although I realise there are lots of good bargain places to eat in London too. I spend less going out because I drink less, enjoy the beer more and don't have to get expensive taxis due to the excellent public transport. A recruitment agent I spoke with last week told me he is bringing people here from the UK because approximately they will earn double what they will in the uk, this having improved recently with the exchange rate movement.

I work through my UK limited company, so can also offset all expenses (including flights, rent etc.). Of course, things can be bought online, I'm just pointing out that if you travel back to the UK regularly, it might be beneficial to make purchases there rather than here in Stuttgart.

Public transport is good in London too, and doesn't shut down at midnight ;) The time keeping (if infrequent) and cleanliness of the U- and S-Bahn is lovely, though! I don't have a car any more in the UK having sold it just over a year ago, but I'm missing it now I'm here. I'll look into the car sharing option - it sounds good.

As for earning double here what they can get in the UK ... this would imply a Unix contractor will get around 700-800UKP a day here. If everyone is getting that then yes, I can see Stuttgart being cheap.

Of course, it isn't really expensive here, it's all an issue with the exchange rate and the way my brain works. The Euro is very strong against the Pound right now, and I convert in my head my daily rate here back into Sterling. I then feel I've done well! Of course, all my expenses and living costs in Stuttgart are paid in ... Euros. So it's all in my head. Don't misunderstand me - I'm really happy here (despite the rain, I spent most of this weekend riding sedately around central Stuttgart and it was a real pleasure). I feel like I'm on holiday, and I'm getting paid.

I fully recommend working (or studying or even just chilling) abroad.

I live and often work in central London. If offered a contract in central London then I usually take it. If offered one in another city, then I would always pick the one abroad rather than the one in the UK. Going abroad feels like a holiday to me; working in, say, Manchester, Leeds, Guildford, wherever, just feels like I'm working away from home. They both have the same meaning, but the former leaves me smiling and the latter leaves me driving/training back to London whenever I can. As is my usual disclaimer ... apologies for the waffle.

well I guess I'm talking engineering more than 'IT' but I have known a couple of unix based integrators earning very good money too, but not quite as much as that!

Phew! Otherwise I'd have to find my Unix admin department and start begging.

Although the market is kind of quiet at the moment, so it may be hard to actually find a contract (as most banks aren't exactly expanding at the moment, and they tend to drive the IT contract market in London), I'd guess the going rate for a decent Unix admin in London would be around £350-£400 a day depending on relevant experience as always.

are those pre-tax rates?

I'm talking business-to-business rates, so yes, pre any tax you or your company might need to pay before it gets into your wallet.

I´ve been an IT consultant most of my working life but never in Germany where I arrived without speaking a word of the language at the beginning of June. I had been working in England (unusual for me) and got head hunted by an agency. Feeling rather dissatisfied with my previous client I eagerly accepted a telephone interview. Within hours I was offered a job in Baden Wurtemburg as a firmware programmer in the automotive industry.

I asked for €60 per hour but was talked down to €47.5 because, I was told, I would need 6 weeks training (for a 6 moths contract). However the client would throw in accommodation free. I´ve been working for 3 weeks now. There´s been no talk of any training and I seem to be carrying out my duties well enough not to require any. Fortunately I had the foresight to insist that the training be added to the contract - but they only committed themselves to 3 weeks in writing. The agency has admitted there is a problem but obviously they are hardly enthusiastic about resolving it.

Another agency problem was that they only announced the requirement that I was obbliged to use an umbrella company registered as an employer here in Germany after the rate had been agreed. They cream off a further 5% commission and pay taxes and social security contributions on my behalf. Not very ethical. Does anyone else have this problem?

On the other hand the accommodation is acceptable. It´s a studio with private bath room about 15 km from work. There´s a shared kitchen, dining room, washing and ironing room, but there is nobodz (yet) to share with The bought quite a few new domestic gadgets to keep me happy (microwave oven, vacuum cleaner, dryer, iron etc.)

Bill

I pay around €1300/month for my apartment in Stuttgart, so you can factor that into your rate before thinking how bad it is. However, I don't share it with anyone and it's not in some village in the middle of nowhere ;)

I don't work through a German umbrella. Assuming one works in Germany for 6 months or less it's acceptable to continue through your UK (or whatever) company. However, this is an EU thing, so if you have some dodgy offshore company based in, say, Dubai, then things differ. Once it goes over 6 months you're meant to go the Umbrella route, although they are unlikely to check this if you're not here for much more than 6 months.

It's unusual for one to be offered a freelance/contract IT role which includes training. Usually, companies only train those who are going to stay a long time. Also, the whole reason they hire contractors is to get someone skilled to fill a temporary gap. Hiring a contractor who doesn't have the skills sounds a bit odd. But that's all in your favour, so no problem.