Scientology van spotted in Munich

Jaime, since your very first post it looks more like your personal campaign against them rather that honestly looking for debating their points.

Enjoy your beer

Just taking some photos. Have a look at their exhibition if you get a chance and tell me what you thought yourself. Honestly, I have no personal experience with the Scientologists, but I know a cult when I see one, these people give no indication of their motives or real identity. If they dishonestly pose as "The Citizens Commission on Human Rights" then I think I was only right to tell people that it was the Scientologists. Now I really must get to the beergarden!

jamie is not alone here in germany in wanting to see this group stamped out Sinderbox. They are just not welcome here at all.

Lame excuse. Please try to engage the brain before you post shite.
Let me know what the issue is?
Yes, I'm in Munich

come on, g, don't be a jerk! he just appologised!

But looking for a Swastika would be like going after Al Capone for tax evasion... oh well...

good to see we have a spokesman for the people of munich here at Toytown.

No, it is not illegal. Scientology is not recognized as a religious community, though, and it is being monitored by the Verfassungsschutz.

ah great thanks for the tip.

think I will take my kids there for a lesson on how religion is used to divide and conquer.

Number 1
I just happened across it on my way to Subway (a much better place to spend a lunch break!)

What I don't like is the fact that their business rivals are effectively the stae government.

If they want to stop the scientology space cadets, stop Ratbag & Co too.

Scientology is engeged in a private war against the head of the Psychiatric Clinic of the university here in Munich. I saw a TV interview with Prof. Möller just a few days ago.
Last weekend they had also set up a portable "information desk" near Sendlinger Tor.
I cursed at these stupid ignorant people who passed out leaflets. But they are too brainwashed and clueless.

Anyone seen the film "The Profit" (2001)? It is (depending on your point of view) either a thinly fictionalised account of L. Ron Hubbard and the foundation of the Church of Scientology or it is the random story of one Leeland Conrad Powers a charlatan and madman who creates a cult (the Scientific Spiritualists) as a moneymaking and tax avoidance vehicle, committing several criminal acts along the way. Anyway, the CoS hates the film and has an injunction against its release. A copy has somehow escaped and is on the web. They had production problems part way through when the CoS picketed the set but the producers were able to find some none union people to complete the movie, albeit at a lower quality.The copy is clearly not an official release as it seems to be tape quality, but it is well worth watching. It also gives an interesting viewpoint of why the cult dislikes Psychology so much.

Concerning this thread's subtitle (Scientology claiming that "psychiatry kills"), didn't the Nazis outlaw psychiatry because it was perceived as a threat?

no.

The "exhibition" has finished now anyway and the place is empty.
Advert closed.

I'm pretty sure I saw a Dianetics stand near Marienplatz last Saturday morning/afternoon.

they had one outside of Heidelberg Hauptbahnhof the Saturday before last too.

Sas, I saw one around the corner from the Rathaus the other day too. They occasionally have a stand at PEP too. Got short shrift from Garibaldi one day when they came up asking him what he most wanted in life and he told them, "For you to carry my shopping to the bus stop".

What a shining example of people being afraid of something different.

What about a 75 yr. old woman having church tax taken out of her €400/month pension?

It's all a choice, I reckon.

FF

You've not spent much time reading about what they are and how they work have you?

fraufruit your first line of you reply is completely wacko, while you certainly made valid comments in the rest of your reply.
Anybody even tolerating Scientology should be stripped of his/her rights to vote.
This also applies to anybody paying to see wacko Tom Cruise starring in any movie.

oh my god z-man are you actually saying someone should be stripped of their right to vote for going to see a movie which happens to have tom cruise in it? you're about as messed up as these scientologists.

Pas,

Read about them.

Know a few.

They don't skeer me.

FF

Did you happen to miss Operation Snow White?

Dang, I didn't know they were operating like the government.

Again, people get to choose to become a Scientologist or not. People get to choose whether to join the Ayrian Brotherhood or not.

Look how many people voted for George Bush.

There are worse groups and there are better groups in my opinion. I get to choose to belong or not.

What is all the scaremongering about? If there is something I can do to make the world a safer and more pleasant place, please let me know. No need for all of us to worry about the same thing.

Peace out,
Fruity

The Scientoligists have been in Munich for many years , they have an office \ Church in Schwabing (Fendstrasse I think) , more than an office really its a whole building . Up until a few years ago they used to openly solicit on the Leopold str . They would stop people asking if you would like to take an IQ test or a personality test. As a young man out with my missus we thought why not ? and went along with these nice people and took their test , of course it was immediatly clear that we both had personal issues that could only be sorted out by joining up (according to THEM), we went along with it ! We were given seats in a sort of auditorium and were told that we would soon be joined by other interested people, we waited and waited nobody else came, somebody started banging on the window shouting about wanting their money back and how their life had been ruined, the guy that was looking after us was a bit perplexed and suggested we start the Presentation ,this was about an hour after we had been shown into the room ! and we were still the only two people there. The talk started and we were told to concentrate on a point on the wall ( an imaginary point that is ) then another and another all the while keeping every point in our heads. after 2 or 3 points you start to feel a bit funny like getting gas at the Dentists, as I realised that this was an attempt to hypnotise us both I managed to conjure up a coughing fit and was able to warn my missus (we were seated back to back ) .We listened to the crap and were told that by doing this thing they have called Auditing we would find a way to put our lifes in order. Anyway if we had been AUDITED it would have cost us money , then for every level you move up it costs more and more cash. as I say we were young and maybe a bit naive and looked upon it as a big laugh at the time, but I can imagine that quite a lot of people fall for it !

PEOPLE BEWARE !! THEY ARE AMONGST US...

We got a DVD in our postbox ' by mistake ' we checked it out , it was a whole bunch of these guys exalting the good things that have happened to them since they became members of the 'Church of Scientology' , I watched it with my Thirteeen year old son , I wanted to try and explain about media manipulating people, we watched it once then a second time , I mentioned to my son that something was not quite ' koscher' with the people shown in the film but I could,nt put my finger on what it was . We looked at it a third time and it was then that my son pointed out that , from maybe twenty minutes of people being interviewed close up they all had the same facial expression and whilst talking not one of them had blinked . It was as if they had been switched on and were repeating a kind of Litany, maybe I am wrong but they gave the impression that they were not talking their own thoughts . I was thinking about what godber had said about attempting to Hypnotise him and his Wife , maybe there is a connection ??

I found this website which seems to confirm my line of thought ?

http://www.cosvm.org/hypnot.htm

check it out !!

So you're not so dim after all.

I say that people who fall for this crap are already dangerous.

FF

I think a lot of people get sucked into stuff like this for many different reasons , The common denominator being that everybody likes to think they are one up on everyone else, and that they have got their ticket to immortality, I can remember the 80,s when all these Bahgwan (Bagwash) people were running around in their pink gear , all looking smug in the knowledge that they were the enlightened ones (Happy Slappy was not the word) . That turned out to be a con as do all of these so called religions re. The Moonies ,Hari Khrishna The Manson Clan , Catholics , Prodestants and so on, in fact all religions prey on the common Human fear ' there has got to be something after Death this can't be the end of me' . all the other species on this planet don't have that fear , maybe thats why you don't see them going to Church on Sundays ?

pffft...the "scientology scare" in germany is no more than a poltically motivated riff raff that renders those who are so publically opposed as whining, ignorant idiots. Like all religions, it is full of hypocrisy, idiosyncricies and some bullshit agenda. Under terms and with accordance of the EU, UN and Helsinki Accord, German officials representing the government should remove themself from commenting on any religion and/or organisation, unless they have absolute proof or case of fraud, civil liberty violations or crimes. Personal opinions are just that and can actually mean political suicide. focus on things that are higher priority: like German economic failure, over taxation, high unemployment, poor reunification planning, etc.

What ! wait till it jumps up and takes over you mean ? see : Lenin, Mao, Kim ill Sung, Hitler,Osama bin Laden, David 'Wacko', Pol Pot , Maggie Thatcher and many many more !
I think we should always have one eye on this type of thing.

I dont think there is any real threat or fear of it takin over...certainly not on the scale that the Catholic church did in the 14th to 17th centuries. unless they are under shawdow of doubt proven to be doing something that is illegal, we are to live and let live. I dont buy into any such bulla...including "the established" religions.

I don't think cults and pseudo-religious movements spring out of a fear of death; rather, they breed within populations who would in some way prefer not to think for themselves, and who expect someone to take care of them. More specifically, I think people who join cults are not stupid (generally) but they are afraid, and therefore don't think through to conclusions, only riding the hope and possibility of a free reward. They have a feeling there is "more," but they are unwilling/unable to discover "more" entirely on their own, which makes them susceptible to cult recruitment.

Actually I think higher education in Germany suffers much the same delusion, but that's another topic.

My sentiments exactly 'chat'

I bet the peasants got a real shock back then? (or a piece of hot iron up their areas if they did,nt agree )

Wow.

"Live and let live" is a very dangerous policy when you're dealing with organizations as powerful and rich as Scientology is. What an incredibly naive attitude, no matter what the corporation or organization is. Has nobody read about them?

Its naive to think that organisation is as threatening and large as paranoid old school germans whine. Sure Ive read about them, both sides of the coin, enough to know, its just some other type of BS organisation that is a bit better organised than other cult businesses, schemes and semi-political organisations. I have read about the Linkepartei and NDP too and I see them more dangerous, but I would certainly not encourage banning them, unless they are infringing on other's rights. One can simply not ban or forbid something because we dont believe the same way personally, or we become what we hate.

"I do not like Neo-nazis, nor do I agree with holocaust revisionist, however I am not about to do what they would do, deny them their rights to freedom" - Henry Kissenger

Just make the personal decision to not get involved and keep your head above water. Too many other facets of life that are interesting, regardless what some back woods bavarian boobs say.

Strangely enough, some of the same concerns over the Jews, Islam, Homosexuals have been raised. How far should this be taken?

Not keeping your eye on them is incredibly naive, religious and political sects can be very dangerous to gullible/ venerable people and the government has a duty to protect its citizens. Henry Kissinger was quite keen on forbidding communists in South America I seem to remember.

wow this quote sounds strangely familar to one that Hermann Goering made in the early 30's.

I dont keep my eye on anyone that isnt any threat to me...but i do keep them on the politicians who pose a bigger threat with their corruption, lies and complacency.

Chat, do you honestly think politicians and corporations (including organizations like this one) have different interests at heart? A corrupt politician is like a corrupt business person is like a corrupt evangelist, the only discernible difference being that one studied law, one got an MBA, and the third one is overcompensating for his forbidden homosexual urges (sorry, sorry, I couldn't help myself). The playing field & mechanisms are the same, whether you are putting the money in an offering plate, towards self-improvement courses, buying products you don't need, or handing over your tax dollars or campaign contributions. This is not an altruistic society, period. It's all business.


The threat and the perceived intolerance that you seem to be reacting to is directed towards not your cousin John who happens to be a totally nice and normal scientologist (and feels that people should not only support his right to psuedo religion but also convert to it if they want to be redeemed), it's the corporation that is slowly and methodically relieving John of his life, livelihood, and life savings. In other words, having a problem with a gravely unethical corporation is not being intolerant of the people being targeted by it, it's being responsible for your fellow sheeple.

Oh please the old nazi stuff, is that the best you can come up with? If you don't keep an eye on these loons, how can you know if they are a threat? Keeping your head in the sand isn't going to stop them recruiting your teenage son and screwing up his life. Of course the kafflicks and the protestents are guilty of indoctrination as well, so they should be kept in sight as well, otherwise their kiddy fiddling won't come to light, or do you think thats harmless as well. Any organisation needs to be kept an eye on, doesn't mean you have to do any thing aout them, but to ignore them ends up with things like Waco and those mormon weirdos that have been shagging their kids.

not old nazi stuff, but horribly frightening similarities...who keeps their eyes on the people who are keeping their eye on everyone else? they are the real danger. FREEDOM...in religion, beliefs, poltics, speech can not be debated.

If these scientologist are so dangerous and threatening...why has not one inccident to date been examined and brought forth? To me, they are just selling their drivel to those who are naive and gullable, not unlike christians. Its all the same to me.

I only offer the voice of freedom...as long as it doesnt infringe on other's rights.

Freedom can only be achieved with openess, both with government and organisations, therefore secretive organisations need to be watched. This applies to religion, masons, and nut job sects. I don't personally have any real objections to scientology, much of the critism raised agianst them could equally be raised against the regular churches, especially the financial ones, but that doesn't mean they should be allowed to do what they want, with out any answerability.

Wrongful death settlement

Operation Snow White


Operation Freakout

Just in case you weren't convinced... more ways that you are incorrect.

Court cases involving "Fair Game"

I'm more afraid of the Deutsche Telekom spying. How many of you are contributing money to this organization?

Then there is the U.S. Dept. of Homeland Security. Yikes!

I'm pretty sure that my keeping my eye on what others do doesn't change anything. What does "keeping one's eye on" mean actually?

Again, no need in everyone worrying about the same things.

Fruity

I really need to just stop checking this topic.

Fruity, why are you more afraid of Deutsche Telecom's admittedly illegal procurement of executive business call records than on a self-proclaimed religion preying on the lost and mentally ill and draining them of family and funds? I'd say the DT case is positively civil and gentlemanly in comparison-- certainly they didn't plot to kill or commit anyone.

??

What makes you think they are praying on the mentally Ill?

They are looking for well off people who can generate wealth for them, not possibly be a burden. In general unhealthy physically or mentally people are the last people such organisations want.