gopher
Apr 5 2008, 2:47 pm
Is gutbürgerlicheküche translated as 'fine middle class' cuisine' or is the good referring to the class?
Any help much appreciated.
A good civil kitchen. So my Mac tells me.
MonksTown
Apr 5 2008, 3:02 pm
I think the gut refers to the class and not the level of the cuisine per se.
Though the implication is of course that those of higher social class eat better food.
I'd play around with adjectives such as premier, refined, quality and traditional coupled with cuisine or food style to arrive at something not too contrived.
" home style food" for example.
gopher
Apr 5 2008, 3:02 pm
What does that mean? civil kitchen? The people in the kitchen are civil to each other
eurovol
Apr 5 2008, 3:17 pm
Good home cooking is the answer.
gopher
Apr 5 2008, 3:28 pm
Thank you!
miwild
Apr 5 2008, 5:09 pm
QUOTE (MonksTown @ Apr 5 2008, 4:02 pm)

... I think the gut refers to the class and not the level of the cuisine per se.
Though the implication is of course that those of higher social class eat better food ...
Indeed ... "gutbürgerliche", (
bourgeoise) Küche means traditional, classic middle class recipes
Definitely not what the Bildungsbürgertum eat, no. Except in a pinch.
eurovol
Apr 5 2008, 5:33 pm
QUOTE (miwild @ Apr 5 2008, 6:09 pm)

Indeed ... "gutbürgerliche", (
bourgeoise) Küche means traditional, classic middle class recipes
The English translation is "good home cooking" and forget the hype. Of course what is "home cooking" here in Bavaria will differ to what is home in other parts of the German speaking world though they use the same term.
what about family style.
or home cookin'
miwild
Apr 5 2008, 6:02 pm
"Bürgerlich" describes a 19th century class distinction ... between upper class (
nobility) and working class
Bürgerliche KücheQUOTE
Der Begriff Bürgerliche Küche wurde zur Zeit der Industrialisierung geprägt und bezeichnet die Küche des bürgerlichen Mittelstands. Damit unterscheidet sie sich von der herrschaftlichen Esskultur einerseits und von der bäuerlichen Küche, sowie der durch materielle Einschränkungen geprägten Küche der Arbeiter andererseits ...
gopher
Apr 5 2008, 6:10 pm
Thank you, that helps a lot. But the term refers to good home-cooking nowadays doesn't it? Or is there still the sense of upper class associated with it?
miwild
Apr 5 2008, 6:20 pm
"Gutbürgerlich" always was and still is the opposite of "upper class" ... the "herrschaftliche Küche" across Europe was and is quite clearly dominated by the French cuisine during the past 400 years
gopher
Apr 5 2008, 6:32 pm
I guess the question is, does the term still have class associations or does it now simply refer to home-cooking?
It's just home cooking nowadays. If you're translating something you'll need to get more specific about it but if you're just wondering what it is, it's good old-fashioned home cooking.
Of course it's probably different in Austria.
gopher
Apr 5 2008, 7:01 pm
Thanks again, Gen
eurovol
Apr 5 2008, 7:07 pm
QUOTE (gopher @ Apr 5 2008, 7:32 pm)

I guess the question is, does the term still have class associations or does it now simply refer to home-cooking?
Although there are rich snobby pretentious restaurants, to advertise as such would defeat the purpose of being a rich snobby pretentious restaurant.
MonksTown
Apr 5 2008, 7:23 pm
I think the phrase in English "good home cooking" while certainly valid as an answer, refers to "good" in the sense of known, "what everyone eats" , something pleasant, rahter than the social implications of "gutburgerlich". Mince and tatties or Irish Stew is "good home cooking" but not "gutburgerlich".
eurovol
Apr 5 2008, 7:32 pm
So now there is class warfare in the kitchen? Seriously, we are at least 100 years past that. Don't you think it is time to get over it already?
miwild
Apr 5 2008, 7:51 pm
Who is "we" ?
eurovol
Apr 5 2008, 8:32 pm
The good civilized kitchen world.
I suppose that the English equivalent would be advertised as "hearty" or "good wholesome" cooking.
eurovol
Apr 6 2008, 7:05 pm
That would do.
MonksTown
Apr 6 2008, 7:08 pm
QUOTE (eurovol @ Apr 5 2008, 8:32 pm)

So now there is class warfare in the kitchen? Seriously, we are at least 100 years past that. Don't you think it is time to get over it already?
I'll let you known the next time I bump into Deutsche Bank Vorstand Ackerman in the queue at Penny Markt.
Whether purely in relationship to the means of production or socially, food is a huge class issue.
eurovol
Apr 6 2008, 7:44 pm
Only if your a pent up fool!
Look, I am a chef and have worked in numerous restaurants. I know what good food is and I know the difference in the stars. I know what makes a good meal and what makes a crappy meal. I know that cooking is all about timing and presentation and that the latter takes more time than the former. Whether 1 star or 5 stars, I can put the same meal out in 6 minutes! You are not a chef or a cook if you can't put out everything on the menu in 6 minutes! Any restaurant that takes more than 6 minutes to prepare something had better have a good reason or they need the extra time to baffle you which basically mean they need the time to sell you overpriced drinks. Most restaurants don't make a profit on the food, they make it on the drinks and sometimes on the apps.
garibaldi
Apr 6 2008, 7:51 pm
Good finger-lickin' burgers.
QUOTE (eurovol @ Apr 6 2008, 8:44 pm)

Any restaurant that takes more than 6 minutes to prepare something had better have a good reason
Risotto is a good reason.
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