No ticket barriers at S-Bahn and U-Bahn stations

Why does Berlin not have ticket barriers at stations, like the ones in England? Though I do get the impression that the vast majority of Germans are honest people who do not travel unless they've got a valid ticket or pass.

When I was on the S-Bahn last week, some ticket inspectors got on and caught one guy who didn't have a ticket. Who then ordered him to get off at the next station to take his details, etc.

Just wondering what the fine is if you get caught travelling without a valid ticket/pass? Just out of interest. Not that I do it. Though one day last year I did completely forget to buy a day ticket.

I believe it is 40 Euro on the spot.

And if your caught 3 times it goes in your police file (which sort of sucks I guess

Like said 40 Euros.

It's kind of at random that they check you, though I swear they rarely work in the summer, and never late night. they also seem to periodically never appear. I don't take public transportation that much, but I haven't been checked in about 4 months...

You can go months without a control , but then BANG , you get done 2 or 3 times in one week

Heh?

It#s a concept that has been used and is used in UK public transport and for which the legal framework is set.
EXACTLY the same as in Germany.

Tyne and Wear Metro
Croydon Tramlink
Trains into London Paddington (previously)
Low level bendy buses in London
Manchester Metrolink

are just a few examples that spring to mind.

I use public transport on a daily basis and would say that on average I get checked twice a month. Sometimes you can go weeks without a check and then have 2 in one day. Inspectors are most active at the start of the month - naturally.

If you can speak German all you have to do when you get pulled over is give them a fake name and address and all will be ok, explain you live here, have a monthly ticket and just forgot it today and then give fake details. If you don't speak German they'll assume you're a tourist, can't be trusted and will demand 40 euros on the spot.

I think the system works because essentially when it comes to this type of stuff Germans are honest. It's the same with running tabs in bars and their tax system, it all runs on the honesty principal, which we as English speakers would just exploit at home so we have to have a more regulated approach.

Me and my x-gf were in Berlin and brought a ticket but forgot to stamp it.

Ticket inspectors were wandering around in tandem with the police (Can ticket inspectors NOT demand to see ID, but coppers obviously can?)

They caught us, they thought we were repeat offenders and explained that we were visiting from Stuttgart. But we then recieved a letter some weeks later, saying that it was going to be investigated ( a process against us).

But nothing happened in the end.

So maybe they can prosecute at any time

German Criminal Code - Section 265a Obtaining Benefits by Devious Means

(1) Whoever obtains the benefits of an automat or a telecommunications network serving public purposes, conveyance by a means of transportation or entrance to an event or institution by devious means, with the intent of not paying the price, shall be punished with imprisonment for not more than one year or a fine if the act is not punishable under other provisions with a more severe punishment.

(2) An attempt shall be punishable.

(3) Sections 247 and 248a shall apply accordingly.

Concerning ID, I always see them ask for ID and if the person doesen't show them then they call the police to "confirm" your adresse (I guess since they don't want to get a fake one and by law you are required to carry ID on you at all times)

But in Hamburg it's the same, no one checks for about 3months, then wham, 3 times in one week

There have been various discussion about carrying ID AFAIK there is no "Mitfuhrpflicht" i.e. you do not have to carry ID with you.

Sorry forgot that. But it beats taking the cops to your house to get some ID.

"Hi mum/boss, don't mind the cops, they just want some ID cause I was caught riding without a ticket".

Yep. sometimes even 2-3 times in one day.

I got checked on the S-bahn, U-bahn and a tram on Sat. I must admit it was my first time getting checked on a tram.

Have heard of other Ausländer here getting caught without a ticket and being let off because the inspectors weren't able to speak English and vice versa.
The one time I got on a tram without a valid ticket (thought my schönes Wochenende ticket might cover it) was a Saturday night when the ticket inspectors are more like army guys and patrol in large groups. They were going to take me to the police station ( I don't carry my passport around with me and don't have a drivers' license) but luckily my friend had €40 on him to pay the fine.
Considering at the time I earned €100-150 a week, it was the best birthday ever...

One time I was going out to Zeuthen and forgot that it was in the C tariff area so since my AB ticket didn't cover it, I got busted. I don't carry German ID but I told them my address (I am a horrible liar) and they gave me an überweisung slip to pay the 40 euros later. Didn't have to do it on the spot.

I am surprised to hear that people got caught on trams. I thought they wouldn't have inspections on trams or buses because the stops were too short?

I think i've been checked at least twice a month every month since I've been here. Even got asked 3 times in one day! You never know really when they are going to spring out at you so i dont think its worth travelling without a ticket.

I've never been checked on the S-bahn ever, in more than a year and half and was starting to think that they don't run checks on the S. I've been checked on the U tons of times, but on the strassenbahnen only once.

They have this same honour system in Vancouver, but I believe that they are phasing it out (installing turnstiles).

I have been caught with friends 3 times (they were visitors). Each time they had a ticket but was not validated. They kicked them off at the next stop to get it stamped. Considering all they were pretty nice about it. I didn't attempt to speak German, just let them show a US license so they would believe they were tourists. "Sorry" seemed to work.

Miwild - where did you find the legal code in English? (or did you just translate it?)

Good luck to all, getting busted for an honest mistake after playing by the rules is a bummer. But it is nice to be in a place where most people can be trusted with these basics.

J

Here ... scroll down to

Full law texts

* German Strafgesetzbuch (in English)

thats soo wrong, you do not have to have it with you, you just have to be able to produce one, so if a copper asks you where it is and you tell them its at home in your desk draw they can ask you to get it or come with you, but usually they just say ok fine bring it for check up within that and that timeframe to here or there... and it doesnt matter if its an ID card or your passport... i never carry my passport around with me and i dont even have an ID card..

anyway, i get checked allllllll the time i dunno y they seem to have razzia on a regular basis where they stop the tram block all exits with their ppl and check everyone always on weekends and evenings, just get the usual "tickets please" in the morning but probably 3-4 times a week, since months!

You got it. It's called the HONOR SYSTEM, unfortunately in many places people are DISHONEST which is why it wouldn't work everywhere. It is also used in the Netherlands, and in the Czech Republic. It may be used in other places that I have not visited.

AS someone else posted. The German people are honest for the most part, so the system works. They have the inspectors to catch those, who might abuse it.

I also have lived in Seattle, where at least ( back in 1993) then you paid upon leaving the bus. So you were taken at your honor, that you had the money to pay the fare. This made for quicker loading, during rush hours. However it was a real problem, when someone way in the back of one of the double buses wanted to get off somewhere before the last stop! They then had to push their way up to the front to pay

I just got back from Bangkok - which has become sort of my second home - and they have a closed system there for both the BTS/Skytrain and the MRT/Metro/subway which is both extremely fair and very secure from fare dodgers.

You either have to buy a credit-card-sized ticket which you pass through the machine to get through the turnstyle and again when you leave the system, or you have a stored value card which works on RFID; you only have to hold it near the sensor. You pay only for the actual number of stations you're travelling, meaning it's much more fair than Berlin's flat rate fares and monthly passes. The farther you travel, the more you pay. You can't get into or out of the system without paying, and if you're paying cash you have to decide on your destination when buying your ticket.

If Bangkok - in a supposedly "3rd world" country - can afford this high tech solution, why can't Berlin? I'm sure the increased revenue would soon pay for the capital outlay. I know a number of people in my small circle of acquaintance alone who consider it a point of honour not to pay for transit rides, and just ante up the 40 euros when they get caught. It would also save having to pay for all those ticket inspectors. And it would elminate all the homeless people and assorted bums who use the transit system as a hangout, drug sale and begging opportunity. By the way, the technology is close at hand: it was provided by Siemens.

@ billp:
sounds like the oyster card dealie they have in London.

I remember once heading home from partying around Alexanderplatz some inspector jumped aboard the U-Bahn at some ungodly late night hour. The rush of people getting off was ridiculous as well as those playing it cool and walking calmly towards the other end of the train.

Once in the UK 3 guys got on the tube and started to inspect tickets. For a second I felt transported back to Germany!

The ticket inspectors (at least those in Berlin) are usually not direct employees of the U-Bahn or S-Bahn authority. They are people hired by some other security company, and the S-Bahn employs that company to do ticket checks. That's why not all of them are professional. Some are just street goons who used to live by depending on their muscles, and now get a chance to earn a bit more by working as a "legit" goon. They have relatively low qualifications, get paid by the number of people they catch red-handed without a ticket, and don't care much about the image of the S-Bahn or U-Bahn.