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Leaving Berlin due to problems with racism

Experiences with neo-Nazi and skinhead types

Toytown Germany > Discussion forum > North Germany > Berlin > Life in Berlin
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streamline
QUOTE (chipbag @ Jan 24 2008, 12:33 pm) *
If you look at a comparison of international crime statistics (as difficult as they sometime are to compare) it confirms what most people experience in Berlin ie that the level of what you might call 'street contact crime' is significantly lower than in english-speaking countries

I do agree with that!!
canaryman
Streamline, thanks for the link, I will be ordering this:
http://www.thorsteinar.de/product_info.php...mvs82orrlfpbdb1

Its my colour!
xman99
QUOTE (streamline @ Jan 24 2008, 12:14 pm) *
Picture quality is way to low to identify somebody on that picture.

Amazing how some ppl will ovelook clear evidence. the pics is clear enough and the person who took it is writing along side the picture. How come there is so much doubt about the picture?
Are you suggesting the poster is a liar?
fRe4k
QUOTE
Be aware of Thor Steinar ! This is NOT a regular clothing brand!

Maybe true, but sometimes people wear that without any knowledge or intention. Also, some people still use swastika symbol representing other things. Like, the theosophical society has a swastika symbol on its 'Coat Of Arms' or a lot of people in India use that as a holy symbol. Indeed, Hitler and his troupe of Nazi's just copied that from some other source.

But anyways, its a thing that we should be aware of. smile.gif
VenusInFurs
Yeah but the indian one is more horozontal and the nazi one is diagonal.
matthewsmith
I was spat at by a group of young Turkish males in Kreuzberg once and shouted at by a middle aged bloke in Prenzlauer Berg for speaking English into a mobile phone. The worst nazi stuff I've seen has to be Bavaria though. I saw blokes openly wearing 'skrewdriver' T Shirts in Munich several times which is basically screaming out to the whole world I AM A NEO NAZI.
streamline
Speaking of nationalism/fascism... Turkey is probably worse than Germany.

Actually you can get 22 years prison for making negative comments about Kemal Atatürk, the founder of "modern" Turkey (a character who inspired both Mussolini and Hitler). Nationalism and racism are state sanctioned in Turkey, hence a lot of Turks (not all of them, of course) despise all other nationalities.

Even thou a nationalism is a pretty new idea, about 150 years of age, it still has a firm grip around quite a lot of people, all over the world. Racism and xenophobia are logic result of nationalism (gone too far), and thus, you can find racists and xenophobia in every corner of our world. Particularly when mashed with local historic events and/or socio-economic factors and religion this mix can be really dangerous and explosive. Racism becomes a real threat when it transforms it self in to a political movement, like here in Germany. I think the best antidote for this is to unite, protest and take a stand.

As foreigners, organized and non-organized racist hooligans are threat and danger to us. A danger that we should be aware of, but not exaggerate.

The casual xenophobia and racism we might encounter on a day-to-day basis is probably best dealt with being witty and staying positive. There isn't much we can do about to those specific individuals, except try give so many positive experiences that they eventually change their minds.
VenusInFurs
QUOTE (matthewsmith @ Jan 30 2008, 3:02 pm) *
I was spat at by a group of young Turkish males in Kreuzberg once

Yeah I got spat on by some Turkish guys too once. Apparently because I'm a mouthy slut.
evilbill
QUOTE (matthewsmith @ Jan 30 2008, 3:02 pm) *
I was spat at by a group of young Turkish males in Kreuzberg once and shouted at by a middle aged bloke in Prenzlauer Berg for speaking English into a mobile phone. The worst nazi stuff I've seen has to be Bavaria though. I saw blokes openly wearing 'skrewdriver' T Shirts in Munich several times which is basically screaming out to the whole world I AM A NEO NAZI.

Skrewdriver? Wasn't Mark Radcliffe (BBC Radio 2 DJ pop pickers) the Skrewdriver drummer in an earlier pre-fascho incarnation?
Blackadder
I lived in Scarborough North Yorkshire before I came here 6 Months ago. I met casually through my working day a few times over the previous year a English man who had lived in Berlin for the last 25 years, he was a skilled "Handwerker" and ran a Pub in his latter years. From what he was saying without saying is maybe it´s not the best place to be right now. He said it was really cheap to rent accommodation. When I was reading an in flight magazine on the way to Germany I read an article saying if you were an investor interested in property Berlin was the place to go. Not for quick returns but a slow investment over the next ten years.
shane-o
Evil Bill"Skrewdriver? Wasn't Mark Radcliffe (BBC Radio 2 DJ pop pickers) the Skrewdriver drummer in an earlier pre-fascho incarnation?"
Nah, he was in The Fall though. Skrewdrivers drummers name was Grinny, later to drum in The Nips/Nipple Erectors and er, back to Skrewdriver(fash era that is)
Ssur48
I have lived in Berlin for 4 and a half years and have only experienced racism...by being called "Ausslander Mist" However I have experinced 2nd hand racism if ya like at the place where I work...There was a chap from the Cameroon working there, and from the first dax there complaints about his body odour and the fact that his German is not very good.
shane-o
Maybe he did smell and his German wasn't very good? I fulfill that criteria most of the time
VenusInFurs
QUOTE (Ssur48 @ Feb 15 2008, 4:54 pm) *
I have lived in Berlin for 4 and a half years and have only experienced racism...by being called "Ausslander Mist" However I have experinced 2nd hand racism if ya like at the place where I work...There was a chap from the Cameroon working there, and from the first dax there complaints about his body odour and the fact that his German is not very good.

Name a place anywhere in the western world where people wont complain about BO and I'll give you a gold star...
horseshoe7
I've never seen or heard of neo-nazi problems in berlin that posed any immediate danger to anyone. i would like to assuage any comments in this thread that make berlin sound unsafe. i put it in perspective with any major city in the world and think berlin is extremely safe. in comparison with other german cities, perhaps it is relatively more dangerous, but i mean we're comparing 1/10 with 2/10 on a danger scale. of course, whenever discussing issues of race, it is important to indicate one's own, so to show how my data would be skewed, so therefore yeah, tall lanky white guy from canada, with pretty good german (you know with only a slight, but cute accent and all), and i never get mistook for a tourist, because personally I think that if you speak better than crap german, people are going to assume you live here. Of course you get asked where you come from, it's simply curiosity, not racism.

i do however experience a bit of the xenophobia, particularly from older ex-east germans who miss their beloved DDR. my baker was a bitch to me for as long as i can remember, because people like me rub salt in the wound i suppose. now she's beginning to warm up to me, but I'm moving out, to Kreuzberg. I live in Prenzlauer Berg at the mo. I get to trade anti-social punk/skinhead types, for loud, unrefined turks. Same sh*t, different smell. (Please note, these turks I speak of are a minority and not a general comment about a good group of people -- sensitive topic that - the berliner turks...)

In terms of neo-nazis, they seem more of a nuisance, like street vermin, than a danger. i've seen many treat their dogs like shit, i.e. full-on abuse, and i've seen others be great. i've seen aggressive, 10-in-the-morning-sternburg-drinking-degenerates as much i've I've seen the "Nazis Raus!" versions. From time to time yes, there is an a*shole in the street, shouting, throwing beer bottles at police stations. in the bigger picture, low probability.
snaark
I've had two encounters with Nazi-types which I'd prefer to forget. The first was in the Reeperbahn in Hamburg one Saturday night. I was with some friends from Germany, Italy, France and Bulgaria. My Bulgarian friend was refused entry to one club for no other reason other than he was Bulgarian (he showed his passport for i.d.). The second incident was in the S-Bahn in Berlin, when I was coming home with some friends (a fellow Australian and an American couple) early in the morning after a big night out. We were speaking english, probably too loud. A couple of skinheads sitting in the same carraige started abusing us. One of them stood up and hit the American girl in the face, and smashed the Australian guy's head into the window.
shane-o
"Kreuzberg. I live in Prenzlauer Berg at the mo. I get to trade anti-social punk/skinhead types, for loud, unrefined turks"

Plenty of punks and skins in kreuzberg
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