Bavaria's non-smoker protection law now passed

Well the new law has just been passed. The Bayerische Landtag has voted 140 for, 18 against and 8 abstentions. Roll on 1st January.

Translation via Bayerischer Rundfunk:

Roll on sleepless nights for anyone living near a bar and massive stress for anyone owning one.

Roll on big headaches for the police. Roll on a KVR clueless as to where people should be sent to smoke.

Oh yeah, Roll on January 1

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

So, I guess now the bartenders and waitresses in bars and restuarants are protected from working in a smoking environment but the rest of us (little worker bees in offices) are not (because the law as it stands can be interpreted in different ways and my company allows smoking in the hallways, kitchens, bathrooms, etc, just not in the actual room where my desk sits). That sucks.

But, hoorah, for the new law!!

So is everyone just gonna keep cheering about it without giving a second thought to how it's supposed to work in practice?

Where should a bar send it's smokers for a cigarette?

That doesn't matter to the anti crowd. They now have their selfish wish fulfilled

Smokers have had their time long enough. Now they have the choice of going to bars or not.

Doesn't change the fact that it's very one eyed and selfish.

Roll on sleepless nights for anyone living near a bar - then move somewhere else!

and massive stress for anyone owning one - why? It works fine in other countries. A downturn in business has occurred due to strict controlling of the drinkdriving laws. Most people are otherwise pleased with the ban.

Roll on big headaches for the police. - why? They've not much else to do here. In Ireland police weren't required to police the law anyway. And in this law-abiding country, it shouldn't be any different. It wasn't much of an issue in Ireland as many predicted. In a while people will wonder what all the furore was about. Just deal with it!

Roll on a KVR clueless as to where people should be sent to smoke. - Outside.

Oh yeah, Roll on January 1 - Yeah, bring it on!

I do take issue with the idea that anti-smokers are "selfish". Is polluting the air with toxic fumes not also somewhat uncharitable?

And who would that impact the most???

Small business owners.

Thanks for not caring. But hey, as long as your clothes don't stink, who gives a fuck about other people's livelihood...

You don't like it, stay at home. After all that's been the smokers attitude all along hasn't it. Now the boot is on the other foot, for the benefit of all.

It's selfish in the way that the owners of premises have to conform to the antis' wishes, whether they want to our not. It's selfish in the way there is no provision for a smoking room or any middle ground.

I don't care particularly, from my on POV as I don't smoke, but I completely disagree with the way the law has been implemented and the lack of middle ground. There are non smoking establishments and they were on the increase. The antis could have voiced their opinion with their money, but no, they go running to mama and spoil it for a giant part of the population. But anyway, anti smoking nazis have got their way. Well done to the lot of you.

Irrespective of the other rules, I think the fest is gonna be a fucking nightmare for everybody as a result of this - popping outside a tent simply ain't quite like popping outside of, say, the Arc.

Those small business owners had the chance to care about my health and their employees' health and didn't.

What a fucking dumb thing to say


Have you read any of the posts about the difference in noise restrictions in Munich, with say, London or Dublin??? Do you have any solutions (apart from making people abandon the city)


Noise complaints...are you pretending to be stupid or what?

What a crock of shit. People know what they get themselves into when working in a bar, this is a particularly common & weak argument

A chance to do what exactly?

So what? If my office is any indication, there are far more non-smokers than there are smokers out there.
And when are you smokers gonna get over it already? Yes, it will be nice that my clothes don't stink but more importantly, when I go to a restuarant, I don't have to sit there and smoke passively which is what I do for hours on end when I go to a bar!

Go outside to smoke! And while you're at it, keep your mouths shut to not disturb the neighbors!

Oh Timmeh, Timmeh, Timmeh. Hazza too. So many pages on this already. *shakes head*

I do the same Gen. If there are so many pages on this, why did you feel the need to add to this one?

Good news.

Let's hope for Sunday shopping next.

Well they wont have to worry about it for much longer - can't see any of them lasting very long after the ban. One of my friends called me from Frankfurt at the weekend and her bar was doing brilliantly, since ban came in there on 1 October, she's lost 70% of her customers and will now close on 31 December.

I think over 7000 pubs have closed in Ireland since the ban, the drink driving laws have been in place loooong before that. The only person who's making any money out of it is Rupert Murdoch - subscription to Sky sports has gone through the roof in the last couple of years...

It's very naive to say small pubs wont be directly effect - I don't smoke and relish the idea of having the choice of going into a non-smoky environment, but why can't we have smoking rooms like they do in Italy and Australia? That way everyone is happy...

I for one am really happy with this. After watching similar legislation being brought into affect twice before, and hearing the same concerns and such about how it will negatively affect business's and such, only to see those business's actually see an increase business in the end.
It should be interesting to see how it goes here in Munich! I hope it turns out as well as most other places!
To the smokers, please don't label all anti-smokers as "selfish" and such. When hanging out with friends that smoke, I am usually gracious in accepting that they are allowed to smoke, and appreciative that they make an effort to keep their smoke from blowing right into our faces.
So please be as gracious when its you going out to have a smoke instead of us going out to get some fresh air : )

Provide more non-smoking areas?

So what? So what is that it infringes on the liberties of people being able to engage in a legal activity within their own privately owned places.

Pubs in Ireland have a number of factors to contend with, the most serious being the increase in the price of drink.

It's not going to work. The current law is not going to work as it's been implemented.

I know other people in other countries said this before, but in those countries, smokers can go outside. The non-smoking law and the noise restriction law are at complete odds with each other.

Either the law will have to be changed or it will be ignored. It is unworkable as it stands.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

Before that happens cats and dogs will have evolved into rulers of the world. Bow before your canine and feline overlords human.

IIRC from all articles I've read about smoking bans in every other country all the doomsayers' predictions of closed bars and ghost town streets have been proved wrong. Smokers still go to bars where they can't smoke in the same way that non-smokers always went to bars even though they couldn't breathe. And how much noise does smoking a cigarette make FFS.

Peoples' clothes won't stink from noise on the street, their eyes won't go watery from noise on the street, they won't get lung cancer from noise on the street. People outside a bar having a smoke and a chat will always annoy someone. Too bad. But it won't endanger their health though... I didn't choose to live near a bar or restaurant.

Your arguments are very tiresome...

Bring on January 1!

It's alright, that's already banned!

I'm sorry Yeti, but the price of pint in Ireland goes up with every budget, and the drink driving laws have been around and enforced for years.

Suddenly there's a massive drop in sales and pubs are closing all over the place (including two big landmark pubs where my parents live) which just happens to coincide with a ban on smoking and next thing you known we're being spun a story from the govenrnment about "other factors" being involved.

You can hold me to what I say. It won't work because the noise laws stop anyone from hanging outside in front of a pub.

Nobody has given a sensible working solution. Nobody...

You find them tiresome because you have no practical solutions.

Everyone should move away then...yeah...

You silly person you...

Fantastic news - best Christmas present ever!

separate smoking rooms are the answer.

For the tiny stuberls, I'd say let 'em smoke away - all the staff and customers in these places do anyway and it's not like anyone from Toytown is going to be effected by it...

Indeed, but that's not good enough for the antis.

Exactly!

That is pure bollox. This is Germany. People don't disobey or ignore laws.


Noise on the street is hardly a big problem. It never damaged anyone's health. Only upset a few cranky frustrated whingers.

The practical solution has just been made law by the Bayerischer Landtag today.

Bring it on!

Let's just wait and see what happens...

My money's on Hazza.

You're fucking kidding me.

That statement alone tells me you have no idea what you're talking about...Yeah mate, you're the fucking expert.

I'd like to ask in all seriousness why people don't acknowledge that I might know what I'm talking about, given my personal experiences with noise complaints from a pub I owned??

From what authority do you speak?

Remember, this is Munich, 90% of the residents are 100+ and exactly as you describe above

Course it's good enough, so is the concept of a smoking club. It's the polilticians who were tired of every group clamoring for an exception so they said nüll points for no one.
I say lay this and every thread connected with it on ice until the end of January 2008, then we can talk about facts and not conjecture what might/may/could happen.

Because they're sheer and utter fuckwits who truly believe that whatever they say must be so irrespective of the reality around them. It's just another facet of the "Ejukayshin is stoopid! Doant lissin to expertz bcuz they just wanna sho u how smrt thay r" attitude so many display.

I agree with you that the anti-noise and anti-smoking laws are at odds, but I disagree with you on the outcome. Both will be enforced. Smokers going outside will get the bar in trouble for repeated noise violations and those unlucky enough to be having a cigarette when the Noize Kops do arrive to take the report may well be issued tickets or warnings for making noise.

woof.

Mine too.

I guess there's more tolerance for noise on the street than there's for smoke in the pubs judging by the amount of support for this ban.
In a few months the naysayers will shut up.
Like I said, nobody disobeys laws in Germany.
Bring it on!

and that's even IF there will be a big problem with noise on the streets.

Tim,
Let's not forget that smokers are in the minority and heavily outnumbered by non-smokers and the people who brought this in are politicians, not whingeing antis as you imply. It doesn't matter whether you smoke or not, or agree with the law or not, it's passed now and we'll just have to see how the police and the kvr deal with it (and please don't say 'it can't work, it's going to be ignored' again, folks - I heard you the first hundred times)