Germany is seeking to ban Scientology

There are lots of contradictions in the bible because not only was it written from a collection that was largely developed by word of mouth, but also it has been rewritten throughout history several times, often to suit various regimes. I know that most sensible christians use it more as a guideline rather than for cold hard fact. I'm not talking about fundamentalists here.

Where it doesn't exist, the churches expect you to both pay an annual membership and donate to both the weekly collection basket and special causes as applicable.

You can donate a dollar if you want to. It's not mandatory like the membership to scientology nor a set percentage, and yes they do need some money because they need to be able to clean the curch, replace the bibles every so often, etc. Give me a club or activity that does NOT need some sort of financial assistance to keep running. My point is that they are not asking for a HUGE donation and when one is offered it's appreciated but not expected, nor do they require a set percentage of your income as most cults do.

2) The bible is not meant to be taken literally. People that do so are fundamentalisms and I agree fundamentalism should not be condoned.[/i]
Sez you. Fundamentalism is nothing but religionists following their books to the letter. I have more respect for them because at least they're honest and make fewer excuses. All religious books claim their authority and all religions demand total adherence.

Who says that one can't use the bible as a guideline and take out messages such as 'love thy neighbour as thyself', etc? Most Christians I know do this and they live very peaceful and non judgemental lives. In fact I believe there is a part in the bible that explains that god is supposed to judge, not people, and I know a lot of christians decide to follow that one closely. They may not agree with what you do, but it is not up to them to judge you. You, on the other hand, are offering up the exact same behavior you seem to dislike.

> 3) Religions have mostly changed according with the times.
Examples?

Isn't it obvious that modern Christianity and Judaism are different from former times? Lots of Christians have sex before marriage, or eat meat on fridays, or other things that they are not supposed to do. Lots of Jews cut their beards, etc. If you can't see that religion has adapted with the times, you probably don't know a lot about religion in the first place.

"There are very few practicing Hasidic Jews"
In relation to what exactly? Hasidisim itself is a relatively young branch. Kaballists are also experiencing a resurgence, and if you want to read some whacked-out shit about magic, look no further than the origins of Judaism.

There are also very few Orthodox Jews. My point is that the extreme factions of the religion are a rarity compared to modern Judaism.

This is coming from an atheist.
You don't help the cause by being so ignorant of religion and its interpretations among believers.

I'm ignorant? You're the one that seems so bent on condemning people's belief systems while knowing VERY little about them.

Buddhists consider their belief system to be a life philosophy over a religion.

Exactly.

they can't - it belongs to the Church of England and the Lutheran Church is renting it from them, however all maintenance work has to be paid for and carried out by the LC.

I don't think that would work (re apartment building) the old graves would scare off most potential buyers

Anyway, I wouldn't stand for it

The churches in Germany do, trying getting anything done with the church if you're not paying church tax.

what do you 'get done' with the church? just curious...

A-ha! Perfect. If it was my apartment then the graves would scare off most potential burglars. Dead people ain't the problem. It's the live one's that can hurt you. However, having graves in the garden might be a very good cause for haggling the price down. Thanks.

Married, children baptised, children confirmed and I have heard getting a kindergarten place in a church run kindergarten, although that isn't my experience.

A notable exception: The LDS Church (Mormons) "requires" a tithe of 10% of its members' income. Technically, you don't HAVE to pay it, but in all the LDS churches I have been around, if you don't pay it (and people do know) then you are looked down upon, and often spoken to by the church leader. It is called the Law of Tithing. With 13 million members worldwide, and an estimated net worth of $30 billion, I'd say they are doing pretty well.

Ah yes, duh. I think it also depends (amount of difficulty involved) on what church...they all seem to have varied practices concerning the amount of paperwork required.

Read my previous posts. I am aware of the church tax in Germany. I meant most Christian nations.

By the way, the church tax is on my list of 'tax write offs' in Germany. In a lot of countries church donations can be written off your income tax.

Arent they your friendly local Mormon representatives? Naught to do with old mother Hubbard...

Have to say they look fairly inoffensive, if bland. Apparently theyre required to live a very frugal life. No booze, sex drugs or rock n roll.. (guess you`d look bland if you had to keep to that regime!)

Mormons, Scientologololists, Kafflicks, Proddies, Jews, Muslims, Morons... all the same to me mate. Waste of human space.

Fancy being a non-drinking religious nutter assigned to the capital of beer, eh? Must be what they mean by Hell.

The capital of Bavarian Dünnbier ...

Why not ban those "Science Technologists"...

They ARE NO Religion and never will be!

Scientology is one of those American radical groups (like Jehovas Witnesses and the Moro...erm Mormons) who believe some american guy reinvented Religion because he said some angel told him to...dude you were just a bit too long in the sun...

But to become serious again: The great danger of scientology and those groups is that they come nice and offer you something...and bit by bit your in the whole machinery...giving all your money for taking courses you dont need...converting others...and so on and on

We had some group who believed in some artificial belief like this in Germany and we're proud to have gotten rid of them 61 years ago!...you know who I mean...

An angel told me something once too, but I didn't start a bloody religion about it.

I think it was the price.

My point, illustrated:

Starting and ending at the same point there are only 5 matching names, two of which are the start and end points. Of the remaining three names, Matthew says 1 is the grandson/great-grandson of a father/son pair while Luke says no, he's the great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-grandfather of that pair. None of the rest of the names match. Both of these are found in a supposedly infallible book. I await an explanation.

What pisses me off the most about religionistas is that in order to hold onto their impossible beliefs they'll look for the tiniest hole or unknown in any scientific explanation and immediately dismiss the entire theory in order to hold onto their "God of the gaps", yet they ignore the plethora of inconsistencies and outright contradictions in their book.

If God is so great, WHY THE FUCK DID HE CONDONE SLAVERY? For all its evil, at least $cientology never condoned slavery.

woof.

I agree with this. I also believe that most people understand and accept Christianity by God's grace. I have seen enough evidence of God's power to believe that Christ walked on this earth and that he lives.

I forgot to mention slavery in my post.

A lot of people who dont believe in a God etc use the 'if your God is so great why does he/she/it allow...' question.

However, if you do not believe in said God how can anyone answer you? Its like asking someone who believes they were abducted by aliens (while you dont think its possible) to explain why the aliens only poked around a certain part of their body.

As you dont believe in the thing you are asking abut, why botrher asking? Makes no sence. I dont go around asking people who believe in faries and leprechans about why said do not wear orange belts saying 'I am real'.

If you do beleive in a God etc then the question of why such things are alowed is for you to ask and answer (as part of your faith).

As I said before, we do this stuff, we condone this stuff and we do nothing to stop it.

However Baddoggie has a point regarding his point from the post above. However I have tried to trace my family back a way using modern tech and its not easy. As I find out more I tend to have to change what I have written down before. I expect that should my kids find out more, they will also change stuff.

We also have to note that some relgious people take the bible (or their book of choice) more seriously than others.

I have little proble with religious people unless they try to bother me with it and decide I need to be enlightened. I also have a problem with political people who come to my door and decide I need to be enlightened as to why their party is better.

If they both leave me alone and alow me to make up my own mind about stuff, I am fine.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/sla_bibl2.htm

Scientology critical sites:

www.xenu-directory.net
www.scientology-lies.com

Scientology associated deaths:

http://factnet.org/Scientology/memorials.htm
http://www.whyaretheydead.net/

Why are they dead ? Because they talked too much, they knew too much or they wanted to report some details to the police or wanted to leave the organization... also possible.

Fuck you, Lavender Rain. Fuck you up the ass with a rusty chainsaw.
There is no justification for slavery!
YOUR god supports and defends slavery. This is in both the Old an New Testaments. You cannot defend the indefensible.


BULLSHIT!
This is one of the most despicable defences of slavery it's ever been my displeasure to read. "Well, Paul figured JC was coming back soon and didn't want to contrdict him, even though JC HIMSELF apparently had no problem with one human owning another. And the guy spreading the word (in actuality, the guy who made it all up to begin with) was somehow "demotivated".

Go die in a fire.

woof.

Scooby Do, do you have heart worms again and didn't take your medicine? "My" god? Whose god? I've never discussed my religion with you. Secondly, my posting that link wasn't to defend, justify, support, or even condone slavery and that's why there was no rhetoric posted with it. It was intended to just be what it was, what the bible says about slavery since you mentioned slavery and christianity.

Btw, for your flea infested information, I come from an ancestry of slaves.

I suggest you call a vet stat to help cure what pains you so you will stop flying off the handle and over reacting. Futhermore, you've worn the chainsaw line out, can't you think of something else?

Meow!

All this religeon nonsense will go out of fashion in time. Not before a few attempts to revive it. But the newer generations will have no need for such mechanisms.

While a lot of what you say makes sence I don't believe this to be true.


The other problem with what you are saying you all but answer yourself. Religion is the product of people and is basically the current groups interpretation. The fact that so many groups interpret the bible in so many different ways is clear evidence of this. The little spat above about Slavery is a good example. People can use the bible to justify or defend just about anything.

And yet you posted a link which sought to mitigate Christianity position on slavery. You didn't rip the sites content a new asshole and I can therefore only conclude you condone and support the site which you saw fit to reference. Why else would you have linked to it? You didn't denounce it and you didn't deconstruct it. I can only assume you meant to use it as a backing up of your own position which, in this context, could only be construed as pro-slavery.

Until Christians can explain away their god's condoning of slavery (yes, in the New Testament as well), they can all go die in a fire. Or they can admit they've been misled by their parents, friends and peers to believe in the absurd and unconscionable. Either way, as long as they're finally honest with themselves. Only then can they even begin to be honest with others.

woof.

Scooby Doo, you know what they say about assuming and in this particular case it's right on. But it's only making an ass out of you. With this post, don't try to justify your obnoxiousness and your propensity to over react, it only further diminishes you. Just because I didn't denounce slavery doesn't mean I support, that's idiotic. Just because I didn't say anything negative about the site doesn't mean I condoned it. Again, I posted the link and didn't say anything because I just wanted to post what was said about slavery in the bible. Many people are unaware it's even in the bible until you mentioned it. A friend of mine sent that site to me over a year ago to ask me what I thought. I was going through my archives today for something else and saw it and thought I would share it because of what you had written.

It's unnecessary for me to denounce something as painful in history as slavery. Not only for my ancestors, but countless others and unfortunately even to this day forms of slavery still exist. What kind of idiot would support slavery anyway? But there's so many things, including murder, that's in the bible. So why are you just harping on slavery. Should I wrongly assume since you didn't mention murder and only slavery, you condone and support murder?

Meow.

I had some mormon friends in high school and it even goes beyond that. You're not allowed to go to dances until you are 15, you are not allowed to kiss until you are married or something like that (or maybe it was you're not allowed to kiss until you were 18...something pretty ridiculous anyway.)

A friend of mine in the US is very Christian (Southern Baptist, not Mormon) and she did not want to kiss anyone until her wedding day for the same reason that many do not have sex before marriage. I would never be able to do that, I find the physical too integral a part of a relationship, but if that is what she wants to do, and she finds a man who goes along with it, that is her right and her choice. At least she is more consequent than those who say no sex before marriage and then have a Bill Clinton-like understanding of what is considered sex and what is not. I am not sure if she stuck with it, because she told me about it 3 years ago, but she is getting married in March.

And won't sex be such a huge disappointment for her after building it up like that for years and years

http://www.bcbsr.com/survey/sgosp1.html

Read it in full before you answer.(if you feel compelled to).

There are things that you do not know sir.
Just like me.

Are there little green men from outer space or not?

What about the slavery Dino? Do you think it's cool that Jebus was down with owning other humans? Or does god just work in mysterious ways?

Not like I haven't owned tons of humans and Kiwis on this board over the years... are Kiwis humans? Did Jesus have an opinion on Kiwis? How about Jerry Collins?

Oh the wit Tater.

Jebus and the Kiwis.

No. but there are other kinds of being all around us


We are all slaves.
If you talk about slaves without payment,--> Not good.
If you talk about "slavery" as in the case of torture..etc --> Not good.
If you talk about servants, as in helpers, with pay and dignity-->OK.
But remember we are all slaves of some kind.
God also works in much higher ways than us.

(not much time today, since I have to actually do some work, even though I am at home )

Is that why he/she refuses to reveal himself/herself to us?

If you were God , would you want to reveal yourself to Garibaldi?

I was saying the same thing out loud the other day, and then someone much smarter than I pointed out that radical Islamists and to some extent fundamentalist Christians are less progressive in relation to their time than were the Inquisition or Salem witch trials. But even if fundamentalism (of any religion) were less influential, we'd still have cults and businesses capitalizing on the more marketable aspects of the New Age movement and the "rediscovery" of ancient Asican traditions. People just need their religion too much.

I think the one and only antidote is science and tons and tons of therapy for everyone, so that those who choose to follow a religion can do so without all the crazy that so often goes along with it.

Is God a flasher?

When a star dies it burns big and bright before exploding. This is what we're watching now with religion.

has God even got a willy and nads to flash?

Dunno. Ask Parnie. He's seen 'im.

The question we should be asking is not whether God has nads and a willy, the question we should be asking is what does he do with them at the weekend.

Uh... you lot need to watch some movies...

Enigma : God is Alanis Morrissette , also according to Chris Rock in said movie , he/she plays both sides of the fence - think enormous penis and very tight vag.

The prophecy : Angels are hermaphrodites

At weekends question is most interesting:

Meet Joe Black:

Joe Black: So you get the concept. While part of you is doing one thing, another part of you is doing another, perhaps even attending to the problems of your work. Correct?
William Parrish: Of course
Joe Black: So you understand the idea. Congratulations, Bill. Now multiply that by infinity, take that to the depth of forever, and you still will barely have a glimpse of what I'm talking about. [Bill stops, Joe keeps walking, Bill takes Joes arm and stops him from getting hit by a car...again]

This suggests that God is the ultimate porn star , bow down and worship bitches.

And if so, is he an omnipresent flasher?

Now I may be getting my physics mixed up a bit here, but if he goes far enough away then he can only actually drop his strides and open his dirty mac to one side of the planet at a time... which kind of buggers up the omnipresent feeling just a bit... unless of course there is a monster holy mirror located at a distance somewhere behind the Earth in space... in which case God has mastered cloaking device technology, the cunning bugger. The only bit he's really failed in so far then is in the dirty snigger so everybody looks up at the same time and can concur if he does or does not actually have The Holy Swinger and The Blessed Nads.

didn't God create man in his image?
so therefore he would have a willy and nads.

so where did he get the idea for woman-bits then? cuz he made us chicks from one of Adam's ribs.
perhaps, when he was just sat there with the rib and a load of play-dough, he was just looking out his holy window thining and he saw big red velvet curtains around the windows (think they have loads of them in Heaven) and was inspired.

I dunno about God, but it's certainly inspiring me Miss Boot. Carry on. I'll go find some Kleenex.