Obtaining a German driver's license from abroad

I am a dual citizen of the US and Germany. I am 25 years old. I have never been to Germany, and I do not speak German (I'm currently first year in college German so I don't speak enough to get by). I plan on going to Germany twice in the next 12 months, and during one of my visits I would like to obtain a German driving license. The first time I will be staying for one week, the second for seven weeks. Currently I reside in Ohio and I hold an Ohio driving licence, and I read there was a reciprocal agreement that would exempt me from taking both tests, however, I do not know how that would apply to a German citizen who does not reside permanently in Germany who is seeking a license. How would one such as I, both a German and US citizen (I have both passports) obtain a German driving license? I would very much like to know exactly what must be done before I come to Germany, to ensure that I have all of the documentation necessary. I cannot find any information about this in English, so I am seeking your help. Most places say I need proof of residency, but I won't be a resident in Germany. I will be staying at a private home during my longer trip, will I need documentation if I decide to try and use that as my residence? Thank you very much for your help, if there is any further information that you need from me please let me know.

Allison

Since you do not speak German and don't have a Perm. German Residents or plan to stay for a long time
your best option is to apply for your German License as an US Citizen. Don't tell'em you have a DE passport etc.
it will just make matters more difficult. How do you plan to get your DE License if you don't have a Perm Mailing
Address in Germany? You will need one before you apply.

1. You will need to Register yourself/address with the KVR.
2. Take your US License to ADAC and get it translated.
3. Take the Translation,your US License, and a copy of your registration to the Drivers license office.
4. Fill out the forms and wait. (Usually a few weeks or Months)
5. When your DE License is ready you maybe required to give them your US License in Exchange.
So make sure that before you leave the US, that you get a Duplicate license issued to give the Germans.

Since the waiting time varies, you might not be in Germany to collect the DE License, so you might
need somebody to do that for you (With some excuse of why you couldn't do it yourself, If this is even possible)

When you register your address, how picky are they about requiring something like a landlord's statement, etc.? If I am doing a homestay with school, or staying at a hotel, will just an address be sufficient? Or a letter from my host family? When I register my address, won't they want to see my passport or a visa? What would happen if I did have to tell them I was a German citizen? Is there a way for them to mail the DL, or do you have to pick it up in person? Gahh, lots of questions! Thanks for your help.

Also, would I be able to get a German ID card without a residence in Germany? What is required for a person in my situation to get one of these?

Thanks so much!

Allison

Allison, are you prepared to surrender your US driver's license in return for the German one? They usually require that.

I suppose you could always go back to the States and claim to have lost your license to have it replaced, but all of this seems like a lot of fuss and bother for very little gain (or at least you haven't explained why you want a German license.)

You will have to pay to have your US license replaced, and you do realize that German driver's licenses are quite expensive even if you don't have to take the classes and exams?

Why do you want or need a German driver's licence?
I can't imagine that this will be easy or even possible when you don't actually live here. Germans like proof through lots of paperwork and I wouldn't want to 'lie' in fear of the consequences! Darknight gives a great list of what you need to do. I know they did photocopy my passport with my VISA in it to order and pick up my DL.
Good luck!

I have my purposes. I wouldn't lie about anything, I know that would make things work. Just want to know how I could go about it legitimately so that I am set when I get there, thanks!

I'm fine with surrendering my US license, it is very easy to get a replacement here. I have specific reasons for wanting a German one. How much is the license itself? It doesn't expire, isn't that right? Cost isn't much of an issue, just figuring out how to get it done in the limited time that I have out there. Thanks!

If you are only in Germany for a relatively short period of time, you can drive using your US license, but you mention having another reason. We obviously don't know what that is, but as pointed out above, the system here is not designed to accomodate what you apparently want to do.

You may want to go to AAA and get an International Driver's License to drive while you wait for your Germany license.

http://www.aaa.com/vacation/idpf.html

Basically, is the only problem being that I need to have a residence while in Germany? What documentation is needed to show I have a residence? And does anyone know whether or not they will mail the license to you when it comes in? Thanks!

You may need to provide a letter from your landlord or a formal rental contract when you go to Register.
If you do not have a valid residence in Germany, then forget about EVERYTHING else.
They will NOT mail you your license. You must pick it up in Person Sign for it, Sign The license, and turn in you US license.

Since you are here for a limited period of time, you may drive in Germany with your US license for up to 180 Days.
Since your Primary residence is in the US, You will not be able to use the Germany License in the US.
You do not require an International Drivers license from AAA to use your US license in Germany, but it does help.
You can only get a Germany ID card if you have a German Passport. (And permanent Residency in Germany)

Whatever your trying to do sounds very shady and iffy. Without more exact details of what your hoping to accomplish
we can't help you.

German embassies around the world issue German passports to German citizens ... wherever they reside

"We," eh? I didn't know that you spoke for everyone on this board. I think I have given very specific details on exactly what I wish to accomplish, the reasons behind it are not shady, nor iffy, nor anyone's business but my own. I appreciate *your* attempt at helping me--even though you advised me not to tell officials that I am a German citizen (a route which seems a little shady and iffy if you ask me). If anyone else has insight I would welcome it, but please do not try to pry into my business of the specifics of why I need a certain document. Nothing personal. Again, I do appreciate your advice. It is rather an unusual situation I would think, one many people wouldn't have experience dealing with, and if anyone personally knows of any way for me to do these things I would appreciate their help. I have already emailed the German embassy here in the U.S. but I believe it will take them a while to respond. Thank you.

Allison

You are correct, MiWild, I recieved my German passport without ever setting foot in Germany.

Depending on what type of residency permit is stamped in your US passport by the KVR will be the determining factor. I'm not an expert but I can't image they would allow you to get a driver's license for stays of only 1 and 7 weeks.

Besides with visits of that duration you don’t even need to go to the KVR, just passport control at the airport.

Just a clarification to an earlier post. As a US resident you are allowed to stay in Germany for 90 days, but you are authorized to drive in Germany with a US license for 6 months.

Have fun trying to convince the German bureaucracy of your need for a driver's license.

As far as I understand the reciprocal agreement, when you hand in your US driver's licence to the German authorities, it is sent back to the original US issuing authority. So in order to regain your US driver's licence you will have to hand in your German licence again. Presumably this is all also detailed on a computer server somehere, so I'm not sure that keeping both at the same time will ever work.

But your initial question, which MiWild didn't answer, was about getting an ID card.
I think most people know that you can get a passport in a different country - many ex-pats living here have already done so.

@HazelStone
You asked for advise from the people of this board and you got it based on your orig. post. If you want to change your story
later thats up to you, but without knowning what exactly your after, the info. we can provide is limited. I'm not trying to pry into
your life as you put it but it you want correct info. on what your trying to do you need to provide exact details of what exactly
your after. Without a Perm. registered address in DE you may find all your attempts at whatever your planning worthless.
On a 2nd note If/When you do manage to Register an address at the KVR you will be in the "System", and may also be
liable for paying German Taxes. Seeing as you don't plan to stay in German long term, (Or get a job) this could be a problem.
Anywho, seeing as you think you know everything already I'll leave you to do whatever you want.. Good luck

@Sackgasse
You US License once turned into the Germans is NOT sent back to the US. It stays at the Drivers license office until you
hand back your German License and get the US one back (If/When you leave germany) However, you can try to get around
giving p your US license in exchange for the German one by trying to convince them that in the US a DL is a valid form of
ID and you will need it on your frequent travels to the US. Either they will let you keep it, or tell you to exchange licenses
before your trips. In the end you may find it easier just to get a Dupe US DL and hand that into the Germans instead.

US residents holding German citizenship are allowed to stay in (or enter and leave as they choose) Germany for the rest of their lives ... no visas/permits etc. required

Just to clarify the handing in of your US drivers license to get a German one.

My wife and I just received our German licenses. I picked mine up a week ago Monday. We both turned in our US (Texas) license when we started the process. We both simultaneously received our US Licenses back when they handed us our German licenses.

Was it a mistake - maybe? But I'm not giving it back.

Exactly, but he has to play the US card to try his end run attempt at getting a German license.

So as long as they also hold a German Passport. No DE Passport, No go..
I don't know what the US Govt. is doing now a days, but they used to make you choose 1 citizenship/passport
or the other by your 18th birthday. However the entire US Dual Citizenship thing is still a huge Grey area.
US Citizens don't need a Visa to enter Germany, but they do need the Permits to live/work if they want to stay past 90 days.

I have been reading up on it, it all really depends. If they were born with both they never have to give one up. I also read something about the military, if you serve in one military voluntarily you lose one citizenship.
I also read you can still have a passport but may be treated like a foreigner for certain conditions, I think this all depends on if you were suppose to choose by a certain age and such.

I also thought that you couldn't get a German license anymore, only an EU license. I am going for mine whenever I can figure the way over there soon, and I know I will be issued an EU driver's license not a German one now.

My son passed his driving test a couple of weeks ago and got "Führerschein, Bundesrepublik Deutschland"
Looks German to me

heh, ok...everyone I know who has a new drivers license has the EU one...except my fiancee, he still has the German paper one that is falling apart, but he doesn't want a new one because on the new one he can't drive vehicles as heavy as the ones on his German license...funny but...naja...

The current US policy on dual citizenship is that it is "tolerated".

EU driving license ... German version

It was a mistake. The same mistake they made with me 10 years ago. You will get a phone call or a letter asking you to return and hand it over. I blew it off and still have both DLs, although my TN one expired last year.

As to the OP, those must be some mighty powerful personal reasons to go to so much trouble to have a German DL. My guess is that you speed way too much and are about to lose your stateside DL and you need a German one to hand to the cop'ers the next time they pull you over. What ever it is, you sound like you are up to something no good.

I just got mine one week ago and it looks like the above post by "miwild". Could you explain how a "EU" license looks different?

I don't think they look different, I think they just have the same standards EU wide instead of just in Germany

I got one of those as well...
However, I believe that if one exchanges it for a new one (German old license => German new license) you have the same rights as before since you cannot be put into a worse position: Besitzstandswahrung.

There is however no need to exchange as old licenses are valid until 2032 (I'll be 80 then - if I get that far) - despite regular adverts from the local authorities claiming "there is no reason not to exchange" & conveniently forgetting to tell you this costs MONEY.

This is different for those getting a German license the first time...

To our original poster, the following from Wikipedia:

Ein Bewerber um eine Fahrerlaubnis muss:

* einen „ordentlichen“ (= ordnungsgemäß eingetragenen) Wohnsitz im Inland haben.

And if this is the case it won't matter what License you have, cause they'll have your history/record as soon as they run your name.
If your US Licenses is suspended and you try driving with a German one, your still going to goto jail when the background check comes in.

Actually my driving record is impeccable! I love the fact that someone who chooses to keep their personal business to themselves nowadays is automatically assumed to be doing so for nefarious purposes. Anyway, you can read into this all you like, maybe it is fun for you. Perhaps I am a spy? Who knows?

Anyway, you can hold dual citizenship for life if you achieve both by birth, and the US doesn't give a hoot about dual citizenship with Germany, provided you don't try to travel in and out of the States on your German passport rather than your US one.

HazelStone: You sound like a 12 year old, just so you know.

And the answer to your question, since you say you want to do it completely legit, is that you have to move to Germany, that's the only option.

I recommend anywhere other than Munich, as I never want to meet you.

I received my German DL last year and got the American one back, too. Have never been asked for it back, and as far as my relo. agent told me you can get your employer to write a letter saying that you require both of them (frequent business trips to the US, or whatever).

@Hazelstone, it took over 8 weeks to actually get the German DL from the day I brought the paperwork down and paid for it. IMHO getting the license is more hassle than what its worth for the short period of time you will be here.

Best of luck

Thanks LauKat! Most of you have been very helpful. It may indeed turn out to be more trouble than it is worth, so perhaps I will wait until I am living out there to do it. If I hear back something different from the German Embassy I will update the board. Otherwise if anyone else has experience with this I would be glad to hear from them.

RECIPROCAL AGREEMENTS

The German Ministry of Transport in conjunction with the German Länder has approved exemptions to the practical (road) and theoretical (written) tests for license holders from: ALABAMA, ARIZONA, ARKANSAS, COLORADO, DELAWARE, IDAHO, ILLINOIS, IOWA, KANSAS, KENTUCKY, LOUISIANA, MASSACHUSETTS, MICHIGAN, NEW MEXICO, OHIO, OKLAHOMA, PENNSYLVANIA, SOUTH CAROLINA, SOUTH DAKOTA, UTAH, VIRGINIA, WEST VIRGINIA, WASHINGTON STATE, WISCONSIN, WYOMING AND PUERTO RICO.

License holders from these states can submit an application for a German driver's license directly to their local Stadtverwaltung (Führerscheinstelle). An applicant will usually be asked to present the following documents:

• an official identification document such as a passport;
• a residency registration certificate from the Einwohnermeldeamt;
• the original U.S. license together with a German translation;
• a statement by the applicant that the license is still valid, and
• a recent photograph (35mm x 45 mm).
• Documentation of a recent eye test is also often required.

So here's my question about this: I have a Pennsylvania DL that I intend to turn in for a German one. My PA license is a class "CM", meaning it is valid for the operation of a motorcycle in the U.S. I know that the reciprocal agreement does not cover the motorcycle portion, so is there some way that I can argue to retain my PA license on the grounds that I will be motorcycling when I return to the U.S. for a short visit? Or will they say that I have to trade back for every little trip home? (This probably isn't too relevant, as I have no plans to make frequent--or at this point, any--trips home, but you never know...)

Also, my PA license expires in October 2008. I no longer have a residence in Philadelphia--just my parents' residences in California and Oregon. What happens when the expiration date starts approaching? Can I go back to PA and get an extension? Or would I have to go back to either CA or OR and file for a new one there (which itself raises a new question--neither of those states have the reciprocity that PA has--does that matter if I've already traded in the PA licence for the German one)? I've heard that it's not too good (for insurance purposes in the U.S., I guess) to have a lapsed licence.

I know this is complicated but if anyone has any idea I'd appreciate it.

@PIB

Tell'em you need to keep your US License for ID Purposes as you travel frequently to the US. Or get a Dupe License when your back in the US.

Your License will expire soon... Without a valid PA Address Prob. not. Goto CA or OR and get a new one. It doesn't matter as you already have a German License.
Depends on the insurance company. Its not true with/ about all of them. If it bothers you that much you can apply for a DL via mail. Some states will even let you
do it via a web site.