Sarcastic and rude replies posted to the forum

Since I don't have a trawler and have to wade through to find other examples, I thought the above 3 might just about illustrate my point. As a newbie, I had once wondered why is there a tendency among some TTers to give sarcastic or rude replies to first time posters who are concerned about an issue and might be looking for help on a website such as this one with tremendous potential to offer such help.

Is it outmoded to use all those lovely phrases that we have to ensure respect for the original poster's (sometimes first time posters) concern - and disagree instead of summarily dismissing a point of view?

What do other TTers feel about this?

Maybe you have to balance your perception with the amount of good advice and help gleaned by many, ( newbies and oldies alike ), from this forum?

Well, first point is that I wouldn't consider you a newbie, second is that we were all newbies at one point, and third, yes there are some experienced old timers who have probably seen the same regular questions pop up again and again and rather than just not commenting, I agree, they do tend to come back rather harsh. I try to reserve my sarcasm for where it is more deserved, in the same way that I give learner drivers space and understanding on the road. Sometimes though you (meaning all of us) do get a post from what appears to be a newbie that is either full on troll or just too damn stupid a first post to withhold sarcasm. The boyfriend with nudie pictures of an ex-girlfriend being a case in point.

It controls a lot of the dross and controls it well. Hopefully it makes people think twice about posting aimless dribble. It forces people to actually use the Search function before posting something. Ultimately TT is a "living organism" so it has become what it is. If you don't like the heat, get out the fire.

Actually I should correct the above. I obviously post plenty of aimless dribble, but am happy to accept any backlash I deserve.

I think it has a lot to do with how users interpret the results. I just read through the first few replies to Foxglove's post and I don't find them either derisive or sarcastic. She asked for opinions and that's what she got. Sure, BadDoggie sometimes doesn't put things quite as subtly as one would perhaps like, but he was answering her question and the point was valid.

Maybe I should start a thread about why newbies consider responses to their questions to be sarcastic when usually they aren't. Foxglove asked a question and people took the time to post responses. To dismiss them all as "derisive and sarcastic" is frankly pretty rude.

I think the vast majority of TTers are sympathetic and helpful to all posters of genuine problems and the knives only seem to come out when they smell a rat. Sometimes it can get quite ugly but I find it amusingly entertaining.

I think Bad Doggie's answer on that thread was meant to be funny and sarcastic and not rude and sarcastic. I guess some people have no sense of humor?

Right. I am gonna get shot to pieces here but...

In my humble opinion the vast majority of people that get defensive about the replies they receive are FEMALE and AMERICAN. I think it's a culture clash.

There are some people on TT that not particularly nice. A small, but sadly vocal, percentage.
But the rest of us are really nice!

At the end of the day, should it really matter what rude of sarcastic people say on this forum? I think it's very easy to lose sight on what really should matter in the scheme of our lives as evident by the motivation of the OP to even start this thread.

@JE: Agreed.

There are rude people in the real world there are rude people in the electronic world. It's a lot easier to hide behind a keyboard though.

I actually find the creatively sarcastic replies pretty funny, even when they're totally snotty and disagreeable. It's actually the only reason I ever came here in the first place, because most of the information we get here isn't usually THAT hard to figure out on your own. I sometimes miss a good cat fight between people who know how to use the English language and TT fills that gap, with the added bonus of being from an expat perspective. There are plenty of other places online to find happy sparkly carebears holding hands and skipping every day.

It does seem like you have thrown out an innuendo, quite in line with the title of this thread but nevermind, I'll spend the rest of the weekend giving a thought to what should actually matter in the scheme of my life although I do believe that in the end everything is null and void but I'll leave that for the philosophers' Stammtisch

I am glad I started the topic - it's sort of helping me understand why people respond the way they do when it comes to electronic communication where you hardly get any cues from body language, tone of voice and other non-verbal features. It's just confined to use of words and perception of these words in different 'cultures' and 'contexts' !

@sin: I didn't say 'I wonder as a newbie' but 'As a newbie, I had wondered' - that explains it, doesn't it ?

Also the words written on this forum are stuck in time left to be read over and over again and interpreted, misinterpreted, or even misunderstood and for some reading all of this is a sport and a good source of entertainment. What's written is also subject to people's perceptions and sensibilitites. In a way, I'm glad you started it too as it is food for thought and fodder for those who thrive on sarcasm and rudeness.

@Sweetypie, this is a common problem with forums that invite public opinion. Other forums suffer from this although a car forum that I am a member of does not seem to suffer the same fate. I put that down to them sticking just to the facts .

IMHO the medium is still so new that people are still trying to learn how to use it. But you are right that is hard to tell the tone of a message in written form (especially without smileys).


Source: Wired: The Secret Cause of Flame Wars

Yes I know the sample size of the study was not so great but what they say makes sense.

In some cases, I have seen that one person has misread a sarcastic message as a personal attack which then just escalates to such an extent that threats of physical violence occur. I put that down to 'self-control' issues - been guilty of that myself a couple of times in the past but learnt from it.

Caveat to my earlier response: when people write idiotic sarcastic replies, it's just annoying.

It would be interesting if we really could throw flames at each other. TT would take on a Roman gladiator dynamic. I would love to see a couple TTers running around like Michael Jackson with his hair on fire (remember when that happened?) LOL

After awhile people will generally leave you alone. You just get used to it. Keydeck used to annoy me with his sarcasm, now it's quite endearing and I've come to expect at least 30% of his post to be pure sarcasm. If he's nice to people for too long, I feel like something is missing.

In all seriousness, sarcasm is just part of the TT tapestry. You basically have to accept it and thicken your skin up a bit or move on. We can't change other people or control who else uses the forum.

the ignor button works great, if there are people that just annoy you. I use it.

Ah, you mean the low blood pressure function key. Actually, I can't imagine being so bothered that I would actually ignore someone. It's just the internet, after all; I don't walk around with a giant white sheet and throw it over the heads of people I think are idiots in real life, partly because it's also entertaining to see what else they will do. Anyway, idiocy isn't necessarily a communicable disease. People are really interesting, including the ridiculous ones, and I admit that sometimes I like to see them do ridiculous things, and sometimes even to egg them on in real life. Probably not a very karmically-rewarding activity, though it sure is fun sometimes.

there are some people that just correct grammer and add nothing to the thread, so I found it best to put t them on ignor, there is enough crap here on TT.

Point proved, No ? Thanks Jay

Wrt my initial post, a first time poster doesn't necessarily expect a rude or sarcastic reply.

"Grammar" and "Ignore" am the correct spellings. Speaking and writing English is a art. One can go fast without but far with.
Take care,
space

This thread is digressing fast .

~ I happen to be FEMALE and AMERICAN..and no one's response to anything I have posted has bothered me a tiny bit. I just assume that those rude posters are YOUNG and IMMATURE.

I don't think that Keydeck comes across as sarcastic based on preconceived expectations.
If you want to get psychological, let's go:

An expectation is a psychic event that is a result of conditioning. If you expect something, you know that there is probable cause to expect some occurance based on past stimuli (some stupid post stimulates Keydeck in this example) and a past response (Keydeck is so adept at wry sarcasm that the TT community coined the phrase "to be Keydecked".

Now, being on the internet is not landing on a different planet. The same rules that govern human behaviour off the net are relaxed some but still, on the whole, remain.

In "real" life, if you walk around with your neck exposed always shocked that some stranger was rude or sarcastic (because you don't expect it) you will waste alot of your time complaining about the unexpected occurrence or rudeness or sarcasm.

That's a waste of time and useless.

There have been so many threads on TT about this subject that most people have lost count. Fact is, not everyone is always nice (read timid) and that's a good thing.

Some of the "nicest" people I know are also the most self-absorbed. They aren't nice out of some sense of altruism. They are nice because they are so self-absorbed that they worry all the time about how others will think of them. It's not you they are being considerate of, it is the image they want to project that they are looking to protect.

So I respect strait-forward people of all inclinations. Be it Baddoggie, Keydeck or Eleanor Rigby (who has a different style but is no push-over).

Basically, again..people have to get over it. Deal with it or move on. No amount of whining is going to turn Baddoggie into a lovable puppy (I'm sure some tantric naughtiness would do the trick though). Just accept it as it is and get on with posting and enjoying yourself.

That's absolutely nothing to brag about .

HA! Busted! Your post is neither Sarcastic or Rude! or is it? Dang, I be confoosed now.

take care,
space

Okay, Let's go. Now that I have heard so much about Keydeck, if I were to meet him in person, and in the knowledge that it's Keydeck, I would interact with him in the knowledge that he's a perpetually sarcastic bloke who I would not particularly want to make friends with or confide in and would politely hear him out making sure I didn't expose myself to his venom dripping with sarcastic drool and wouldn't touch him with a barge pole for times to come!

Oh, almost forgot the smiley - here it is

Sweetypie as long as you use that login name here it is going to be impossible for anyone to take what you write as sarcastic or rude.

It seems sarcasm suits you. Shall we move on now to discuss irony? Welcome to TT, you'll fit right in. May you soon be Keydecked and enjoy it.

IMHO, if someone asks for help or advice, especially a newbie who is not accustomed to TT, that's what they should get, help or advice, unadorned with insult or reproof.

If someone states an opinion or challenges someone else's statements... well, then, no holds barred.

(I of course never engage in such silliness. For example, I would never simply state that the rightwing nutballs who seem constantly to lurk here, glorifying greed and bloodshed, are rightwing nutballs. I do not engage in sarcasm, rudeness, or name-calling no matter how dumb, ugly, and scrofulous their mothers are.)

Oh dear, I wasn't being sarcastic at all but you perceived it so - see? You talked about preconceived notions and conditioning in your previous post. I gave an example as to how I have now developed a (preconceived) notion about Keydeck from your info on this thread, info that I consider reliable. And so armed with this info, I would have 'conditioned' myself (no, I don't want to go into Pavlov) to believe that I should be cautious while dealing with Keydeck because he has a tendency to hurt with his sarcasm (my interpretation based on my cultural input and background).

But I think now that I know, I will survive being keydecked and even enjoy it! And that`s more because I am now accustomed to TT but as a first time poster or a newbie, if I had been Keydecked, I would have been upset. In the quotes that I found (see initial post), at least one was a newbie and quite surprised to have received a sarcastic reply to a first post.

Now, as a 'seasoned' poster, I have come to realise that in electronic communication of this kind , one should indeed expect sarcastic and rude replies as my experience was limited to support groups where one does indeed find support, sympathy and help and does not get insulted or dismissed .

I love quoting this bit of the registration terms and conditions:


I think that counts as Godwin's Law for this kind of thread.

Well spank me on the ass and call me Judy, I's getting talked about behind the bike sheds. Interesting to note that, of the three examples given, not one related to a thread on which I had said anything at all to the initial poster.

Note to self: Must try harder.

Sweetypie, see you around

Hey Keydeck - You have said nothing to me but I wasn't the one who referred to you. It was Saint for she used to find your sarcasm annoying until she got used to it. If you aren't 'keydecking' first time posters, I am quite okay with that:-)

There must be some poets around. Doesn’t sweetypie rhyme with hairypie?

As far as I'm concerned it's got nothing to do with someone being a first time poster. I believe in equality and will direct my attentions to one and all in the same quantities. Fuckwittery is far from being limited to newbies.

We should all be nice to each other and show tolerance and respect! Arse biscuits!

Note to BB: Must try harder.

I personally don't mind that some people will make witty or sarcastic replies, though some sure are unnecessarily harsh or mean. Especially with new posters, that might not teach them to use the search function next time, but to ask in another forum next time. * And it will definitely not teach other new posters to use the search function, because regardless of what it says in the rules, it is unlikely that newbies will stick to that if they have a question as they will probably want an answer now, not after a week when they have become familiar with the way people write here.
Besides, I wouldn't even be surprised if people do not even read the rules anymore, every time you sign up for something online you have all these rules and conditions to read, does everyone of the regular readers here read through them every time? Or have you just gotten used to checking "I have read and agree to the Terms of Service"?

* Obviously excepted from this are people who are clearly trolls and I know there have been a lot of them lately, though not every story that appears troll-ish is really written by a troll, because sometimes shitty and unbelievable things do happen to people. And the last thing a person like that would need is rude replies on a forum when they were asking for help.
Some posters here really seem to not have been around when God** was distributing the ability to be empathic.

** Or whichever Deity you believe in.

I don't think he was asking for permission



BLT ONO.

I never read the rules and conditions of forums or the like. But then I also don't have a problem if someone points out to me that I am in violation of those rules. If I'm not going to bother reading them myself then it's fair enough if someone picks me up on a breach of them.

Jesus, reading the rules would be like reading instructions, when any true geek wants to run in there, rip off the packaging, plug the damn thing in and watch blue flames come out of places where blue flames were patently not supposed to come out of.

(I will admit to reading the odd instruction booklet these days though, not only have the toys become more expensive to risk frying but I am not sure than I enjoy electrical shocks as much as I used to. Other shocks of course being an entirely different matter.)

I usually do not read instruction booklets, only when I cannot figure out how something works... never had any bad experience with that either though, no blue flames for me.

Instructions are not only very important but also enlightening and clarifying, one should always read them

[img]http://www.singletrackworld.co.uk/mod/submit/images/967-2.jpg[/img]

You haven't lived until you've watched ether igniting through the ventilation grill of an old amplifier.

Well maybe you have lived, but is your life richer, are your eyebrows less singed?

@Sinderbox:

Was that a quote from one of Bush's speeches? It reminded me of "And we've had leaks out of the administrative branch, had leaks out of the legislative branch, and out of the executive branch and the legislative branch." Sept. 30, 2003.

Sarcasm: the last refuge of modest and chaste-souled people when the privacy of their soul is coarsely and intrusively invaded. Dostoyevsky

space, my darling, Carm's posts are some of the most interesting on the forum, forcing you back to a high level of concentration just trying to figure out what the hell she means. Now, that may have been rude - but to whom? Did you get a tongue-lashing, or did I cross the line of politeness towards Carm?

Funny, I always know what I am talkin' aboot.

more sarcasm and rudeness please. all this hippy dippy 'all is love' shite makes me want to set fire to pandas