Rugby: England vs. South Africa, Fri. 14.Sep.2007

Ok folks, been years since I played, but Mike Catt as fly half? Andy Farrell as kicker?...surely this is desperation choices?

Yes.
Next?

You've not been keeping abreast of things have you?

England are 6-1 but my cash is staying right in my pocket thanks.

6-1 is great odds , I'd have them at 3-1 max.

if you can name another fit player in the England squad better at playing outside half then you win a prize.

When you lose two outside halves and only picked two in your squad, you do get kinda desperate.

I'll give you 3-1 if that helps?

england 6-1 to win?...cant see that or 1-6 to loose?

It's called the odds man, the odds. England are worth a fiver at that price but I reckon the bookies have called it right.

Some of mine might just wander behind the bar.

6-1 seem like realistic odds to me.
SA are generally overrated at the moment, they are not the force they were. And Burger is out. But I can only see this going one way.
Of course I shall be happy to be proved wrong.

6-1 is worth it. Who knows, Catt at 10 and Farrell just off him could work. I think Catt could be a good fly half - he has played everywhere else in the back line (bar 15) hasn't he?

He's already played fly half too

At international level? Didn't know that, thanks.

Catt is a good lad but he is regretfully a bit older and a bit slower so will get dumped on I reckon. Frankly I do not see any way of us pulling a rabbit out of this hat. I think there is a chance we may get PROPER PROPER walloped. Like 40 points the wrong way walloped. In fact I might go and stick some money on that.

Yeah, he set up some good running attacks if I remember rightly, it's not all that gloom and doom.

To me Catt has a bit more creativity than most of our players, which is why I think 10 may be a good idea. More to the point, what the fuck is Sackey doing anywhere near the England team?

Yeah JE, I reckon that's the reason why Catt is a desperate choice. Not because of lack of experience but too much of it!

Some interesting odds from Paddy Power. I reckon for the wild optimists backing England at 15-2 to win by 1-10 and also at 33-1 for 11-20 is kinda fun.

I am currently trying to figure out how to back SA for about £40-£50, so that if they just win I get my money back but if they cream us then I do better.

Looks like I may need to cover the 21-60 range?

I truly think it won't be that bad JE, but this post may come back to haunt me . . .

Rearrange this well know phrase or saying: "fucked we're".

SA to win by 21-30 at 7/2 is pretty decent too I think.

Or keep it Yoda Styley.

i reckon todays SA v Eng score will be right up there with NZ vs Scot. i dont know if thats a good or bad thing though

My beautiful beautiful Bokke.

SA by 15 to 25.

Schalky enjoys the game and relaxes. Fit as a fiddle and rearing to go for last group game v. Yanks and quarters.

Amandla!

Right. Here is my bet:

21-30 @ 7-2 £10
31-40 @ 11-2 £10
41-50 @ 11-1 £10
51-60 @ 25-1 £9
61-70 @ 100-1 £1

Bit of fun!

can we actually use paddy power here?
Well, and actually get paid off etc.?

Which mod changed the title of this thread to:

Football: England vs. South Africa

Jesus wept.

Just saw that myself JE, who is the mod in control at the moment?

I think one of the mods is having a laugh.

First the football thread title gets changed to rugby then the rugby one to football.

currently 20-0 to the bok.

33-0

The next drama is gonna be Samoa. I see that as 50-50 at best for us.

So how much did you win in the end? (betting)

Total schoolboy stuff, the basic problem is that if you have no connection between 10 and 12 you are gonna get stuffed as proved tonight.

I thought the pack did their stuff and Robinson was awesome till he got the career ending hamstring injury but otherwise they were shite.

Farrel proved what we already knew, too slow and no ideas.

The injury list is building nicely, Samoa now look a problem.

BlueDave:
Just to let you know that you drew Georgia in The Arc sweepstake.
Keith

Is it worth commenting on this?
Except perhaps the the connection problems started at no. 9 in the first half.
Woeful.

I got a PM from EB...so guess he is not a rugby fan

the bit that England didnt even kick a couple of points ...can anyone remember a defending world champions lost with a 0 score, pride at least makes you kick at least.

Sadly Farrell hasnt been properly fit since atleast 2004. He knew he didnt have the fitness level to run around on his knee in League and why for his last 2 years in League he played but a handful of gamea
Union came knocking offering him millions-what he received is way more than whats reported as he got hidden cash for a new house, Kids Schooling , Property venture etc he took it like most would! The fact that he never had played Union really and that his Knees and Shoulders are in a bad way didnt seem to mind. He has hardly had the best coaching at the England setup. The fact that the rest of his teammates cant pass, catch or tackle is beside the point-Faz is to blame for everything. Faz is probably Englands best passer and why Ashton thought of sticking him at 10-but with little experience at 10 or 12 to be honest especially at International level it was suicide. Defending is absolutely woeful as can be seen when S.A run in 36 points to nothing!

The sooner England have a clear out and sort themselves from top to bottom the better. The players are suppossed to be Full time-yet look in poor shape. The players cant pass, tackle or Catch-Basics. The blame has to go to the Coaches and the way English Players are taught both at club and International level. I dont follow Union very much but the SH look way in front both physically and skills wise. It seems as I have said before that players are in the gym and on the golf course but do very little skills work-where is the creative work? Where are the flair players? Where are the tries? England were lucky to win the last WC. I hope Somoa beat them and show them up for what level they really are at.

And buying Rugby League players isnt the answer as League is completely different and how you play and the skills you need for the two are also completely different. it took players like Jonathon Davies over 2 years to start making any impression at club level. Just because you are good in in one code doesnt mean you will be good in the other. The number of Union players like Terry Holmes and John Gallagher who failed in League is way more than were a success. A back might make it but a forward very very rarely-and Farrell is certainly not a Back!

also any one make money on this score line?...

no but we all had a good laugh

in my living memory ive never seen england fail to score. crazy.

Balls.

i think highlights are just about to come on DSF if anyones interested

What a fool I was to think that all of a sudden, after playing absolute shite since winning the world cup in 2003, that magically they were going to pull a rabbit out of the hat and transform into a world force in rugby again and whoop the yarpies arses good and proper, just what the fook was I thinking?

When you look at all the matches since winning the world cup, England have played 45 times, won 19, lost 26! Half of those wins were against real minnows. A lot of the defeats were real proper arse kickings from SH sides and Ireland as well. Leading up to the world cup in 2003 it was an entirely different story, England had a very impressive record indeed.

14 Sep 2007 England 0 - 36 South Africa (lost)
08 Sep 2007 England 28 - 10 United States (won)
18 Aug 2007 France 22 - 9 England (lost)
11 Aug 2007 England 15 - 21 France (lost)
04 Aug 2007 England 62 - 5 Wales (won)
02 Jun 2007 South Africa 55 - 22 England (lost)
26 May 2007 South Africa 58 - 10 England (lost)
17 Mar 2007 Wales 27 - 18 England (won)
11 Mar 2007 England 26 - 18 France (won)
24 Feb 2007 Ireland 43 - 13 England (lost)
10 Feb 2007 England 20 - 7 Italy (won)
03 Feb 2007 England 42 - 20 Scotland (won)
25 Nov 2006 England 14 - 25 South Africa (lost)
18 Nov 2006 England 23 - 21 South Africa (won)
11 Nov 2006 England 18 - 25 Argentina (lost)
05 Nov 2006 England 20 - 41 New Zealand (lost)
17 Jun 2006 Australia 43 - 18 England (lost)
11 Jun 2006 Australia 34 - 3 England (lost)
18 Mar 2006 England 24 - 28 Ireland (lost)
12 Mar 2006 France 31 - 6 England (lost)
25 Feb 2006 Scotland 18 - 12 England (lost)
11 Feb 2006 Italy 16 - 31 England (won)
04 Feb 2006 England 47 - 13 Wales (won)
26 Nov 2005 England 40 - 3 Samoa (won)
19 Nov 2005 England 19 - 23 New Zealand (lost)
12 Nov 2005 England 26 - 16 Australia (won)
26 Jun 2005 England 45 - 16 Argentina (won)
28 May 2005 England 39 - 52 Barbarians (lost)
19 Mar 2005 England 43 - 22 Scotland (won)
12 Mar 2005 England 39 - 7 Italy (won)
27 Feb 2005 Ireland 19 - 13 England (lost)
13 Feb 2005 England 17 - 18 France (lost)
05 Feb 2005 Wales 11 - 9 England (lost)
27 Nov 2004 England 19 - 21 Australia (lost)
20 Nov 2004 England 32 - 16 South Africa (won)
13 Nov 2004 England 70 - 0 Canada (won)
26 Jun 2004 Australia 51 - 15 England (lost)
19 Jun 2004 New Zealand 36 - 12 England (lost)
12 Jun 2004 New Zealand 36 - 3 England (lost)
30 May 2004 England 12 - 32 Barbarians (lost)
27 Mar 2004 France 24 - 21 England (lost)
20 Mar 2004 England 31 - 21 Wales (won)
06 Mar 2004 England 13 - 19 Ireland (lost)
21 Feb 2004 Scotland 13 - 35 England (won)
15 Feb 2004 Italy 9 - 50 England (won)

Does anybody remember when Rob Andrew was apointed RFU Elite Director of Rugby last year, all that talk about changing improving coaching amongst many things, he talked such a good job about what he was going to do that I was convinced it was the turning point in English rugby since the dire results after the world cup. Over a year later, England seem to have gone even further backwards. English Rugby is in very serious trouble indeed.

I have tickets for the final and I'm happy in the knowledge that I won't be watching England grind on playing lacklustre dull rugby. I hope to get value for my money watching two SH sides play entertaining, skillful and paceful rugby, something to remember.

Poor shape? We just battered the Aussies - overpowered them... Beating the Aussies twice in consecutive World Cups surely requires something more than luck? And surely that something wasn't aquired on a golf course?

I was pretty sure we'd win this one - no more crap about England from you till you know a little more about what you're on about, ok?