Do you feel safe here as an American?

Ohhhhhhh. Quick OPEN THE PIT NOW!!!

Bavaria may be overwhelmingly Catholic but nothing wrong with a porking on a Friday.

Yeah !

Please, give us some specifics, stop posting so vaguely. If you want people to vote Democratic, you should be happy to tell them in detailed and specific terms why.

I have and I will again and again. Stick around and smell the roses.

Please refresh my memory.


Your interpretation of the foreign policy gains that a Democratic victory would bring are not as fool-proof as you make them out to be. Everyone was saying the same thing about the effects of a potential Kerry win in '04, yet those who didn't have their heads stuck in the sand knew that he would not have changed much concretely as far as policy in Iraq was concerned - apart from appeasing the anybody-but-Bush crowd and European public opinion in general.

You need to understand that regardless of the outcome next November, it will be manipulated in order to portray America as either weak, or mistaken in its aggressive stance towards global terrorism. It will, once again, be damn if you do, damn if you don't.

A Kerry win would have been better than more of the same bullshit and I didn't like Kerry one bit. You have to realize that anything is better than Bush/Cheney! The only way there can be actual change, even if it is only slight, is to elect a Democrat. That is just the facts of political life. It is a choice of roads. One road is hard assed from the outset and the other is only hard assed when it needs to be. Your choice if you have one.
If you are a Dem or want to vote in the Dem primary, then you can and it could make a difference. We will be holding our Global Primary February 5th-12th. Join us and make a difference! You can vote either in person, via mail and via internet. Want to make America safe? Then get involved and vote!

eurovol, I have asked you several times on this thread to discuss some specific foreign policy changes that you think should be pursued, yet you have failed to do so. I assume, therefore, that you haven't thought this through, and that you are simply speaking as a person who seems to be a party hack.

EDIT; if you have discussed specifics previously, feel free to point them out to me. I suggest this in the interest of getting information out there so people can think about and discuss the specific issues in some detail.

Oh I dunno about that. I'm not rich enough to own an IQ.

Not to worry, it seems that a BMW or an Audi A4 makes up for it here in these parts.

Dude, I can give you my ideas, but that is not the stand of the candidates. Stay tuned if you want to learn and be patient because as I have said foreign policy is not the mainstay of American politics. I can tell you that despite the unwarranted criticism, Obama's views are essentially the same as Hillary's on foreign policy and for that I fault Hillary for her crass attacks on Obama. As for experience, I didn't know that living with someone gave you the experience to be an expert. Since I lived my entire life with my father the pediatrician, then I should be qualified to be a pediatrician too? That is pretty much Hillary's claim to experience since she never ever served the people until becoming a Senator from New York like 7 years ago. A state she never ever lived in and was pretty much a cold calculation as a stepping stone to the WH.
It is time to move on from the Bush-Clinton-Bush years and Hillary does not represent change in my mind. That being said, she would still be better than any Repub candidate unless Hagel got into the race.

Hmmm do I look american?

definately

eurovol, I suppose a lot of people would be most curious about a Democratic president's policies on the following issues:

Iraq

Iran's nuclear capabilities

a successor to the Kyoto Treaty

global trade negotiations

relations with Russia and China

Where do you think Hillary and Obama stand? Since his background is strong in foreign policy, Biden's views might also be of interest. So would your own.

EDIT: I ask these questions in large part, but not exclusively, for the benefit of non-US citizens on Toytown. These are likely to be issues of great interest to them.

An article on a proposal to spy on the computer usage of German converts to Islam:


It's shocking to me that in Germany people could be singled out on the basis of being Muslim for the infringement of their civil liberties (freedom of religion and privacy) and I don't think it will be legalized, but what do others think?

let's see how things play out. It may become prudent the way things are going.

Whenever something like this happens, some CDU/CSU member steps forward and tries to sacrifice freedom on the altar of security and/or to garner votes with populism.

I bet Schäuble is happy.
I don't think that the Bundesverfassungsgericht would agree with Beckstein, though.

And exactly how would you describe freedom in your country? I haven't read most of this thread, but I think I agree with you. I'm still curious about my first question.

Beckstein's proposal is reported differently in this "Handelsblatt" article . According to this, not all converts should be surveilled, but security services should check whether the convert is affiliated to a more liberal or more islamistic version of islam and then decide on further measures. But that's bad enough.

Beckstein and other security experts argue that german converts are ideal targets for terrorist recruiters because they blend in well and because they are more susceptible to their ideas due to the typical religious zeal of newly converts.

The vast majority of converts have personal reasons (a muslim partner, a longing for a different set of values than that of secular society), and it's pretty sad to cast suspicion on all of them. It will not help to integrate muslims into German society.

What puzzles me is how the German government will know a German has converted to Islam, since Muslims do not pay the "Church Tax". AFIAK, an adherent of Christianity or Judaism who is paying church tax but leaves their religion doesn't have to report to what they are 'converting', including the case of conversion to Islam, and certainly no person who is not an adherent of Christianity or Judaism is going to report a conversion to Islam to the government. Not all converts to Islam change their names.

EDIT: I recall reading in one German online article that the elder German plotter had converted to Islam 10 years ago. Can't remember where I read that, though.

Exactly. Mosque communities usually register conversions at the Islam-Archiv, but they don't have to. If there were a community with a not-so-peaceful agenda, they wouldn't register. There are no reliable statistics about the number of German converts; according to Islam-Archiv about 18000, others say up to 100000. The security risks are judged quite differently. Compare this article in the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung online Von militanten Islamisten gelockt with an interview with sociologist Monika Wohlrab-Sahr in Die Tageszeitung "Radikale sind nicht überrepräsentiert" . The latter states that rising numbers of converts are not alarming, but a normal development in a plural, multiethnic society.

Actually, I think now is the time to feel a little more unsafe. Iraq is a quagmire, Afghanistan isn't going so peachy, The Coalition of The Billing are creeping out, and now they seem to have dumped the little fat Osama Bin Laden and have found a new Mr. Bean Laden to go "WOOGA-WOOGA-WOO!" and make all the bed-wetters and pant-shitters sit back up and tow the line again. Still, credit where credit is due: they got the hat right. I'd advise anybody to stay well away from any War on Terrorismâ„¢ training exercises. My gut feeling is that it might be Paris this time. Dubya has a new hound, and this one's a poodle.

Sin, can you point us to a link which is your source for the allegation of the 7/7 training exercises?

No. I can't be arsed. If you don't know about it by now you never will. Now go away and stop wasting my time.

Loosely related to the topic of conversion: I just read that in his latest video message, Osama Bin Laden kindly invites people all over the world to convert to islam. hmmm ...

Thanks for the above links, RainyDays.

Your're welcome

Just seeking a clarification.

Is this the retread of Kerry trying to explain how America would be safer if he were elected? Setting aside the fact that there hasn’t been a terrorist attack in the US since 9-11, how does one prove the current situation is less safe? Didn’t work to well for Kerry.

There have been terrorist incidents in the US since 9-11. Fact!

From that list, it looks as if it's dramatically increased...shocking, I know *cough*

More beer needs to be drank, then no one cares about "security" ...fuck it all.

what worries me is that most western and southern EU countires are being flooded by Muslims...so far only Central European countries are pretty free of them...I'm mean look at the UK? this has got to be a good reason for why the Brits are leaving UK and going to Australia, US etc...

Nothing to do with standard of living, more money, bette beer etc etc

Ok, i'll out myself, i left the UK because of Muslims possibly bombing my house.

Relax dude...add taxes, big bro watching etc etc...don't tell me that rag heads all over the place are not making you wanna get the fuck out of your little stuffy land? please..

Was that spoken as a Polak or a Yank?

Just need to know who to take the piss out of.

take a pick...either one will piss on your toothless face with joy

Don't you sound like an uneducated, redneck fucking racist...

I'd like to see you use that kind of language in real life... face to face with one of the individuals you are referring to...

how about using, niggers, gooks and any other racial slur you can summon up from that white trash, trailer park sludge you call a free thinking brain...

Fuck me... I cannot stand intolerant, brainwashed, small minded rednecks!

[was that too hard?]...

From your Link.

This article needs additional references or sources for verification.

Here is a sample of “Facts� from your link.

1983 - The list includes these attacks but does not place the US flag next to the event.

April 18: U.S. Embassy Bombing in Beirut, Lebanon kills 63.
October 23: Marine Barracks Bombing in Beirut kills 241 U.S. Marines. 58 French troops from the multinational force are also killed in a separate attack.

1995

November 13: Bombing of OPM-SANG (US Military Complex) building in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia kills seven
June 25: Khobar Towers bombing -- In all, 19 U.S. servicemen and one Saudi were killed and 372 wounded, by Hizballah Al-Hijaz (Saudi Hizballah) with Iranian support

Want more “Facts�?

1985 – The list does not include this:

- August 8, 1985 Rhein-Main AB Bombing injuring 22. Responsibility claimed by two groups, the Red Army Faction & the French Direct Action.

But, the list does include these as “Terrorist attacks�.

2002

May Luke Helder injures 6 by placing pipebombs in mailboxes in the Midwest. Motivation to protest government control over daily lives and the illegality of marijuana and promotion of astral projection

2007

March 5: A Rikers Island inmate offered to pay an undercover police officer posing as a hit man to behead New York City police commissioner Raymond Kelly and bomb police headquarters in retaliation for the controversial police shooting of Sean Bell. The suspect wanted the bombing to be considered a terrorist act.

Based on these “Facts�, I have attached the attacks connected to the US Flag since 1993. I have further broken down the list into two periods.

The Clinton years

1993 – 3
1994 – 1
1995 – 3
1996 – 1
1997 – 1
1998 – 1
1999 – 2
2000 – 2

Total 14 attacks, does not include the 2 attacks on US Military installations in Saudi Arabia in 1995. I don’t want to change any “Facts�

The Bush years

2001 - 3
2002 - 3
2003 - 0
2004 - 1
2005 - 0
2006 - 3
2007 - 4
2008 -?

Total 14 attacks – still don’t know about 2008. Does include the 2002 “marijuana terrorist� and the 2007 New York police commissioner terrorist.

Still with all these “facts�, exactly how is America less safe? Or would be more safe?

I’m not stating Bush did a better job than Clinton. I would just like to demonstrate that the statement “make America safer� is not going to wash. Attempts to portray the US as somehow less safe will not work. This retread of a Kerry strategy failed him – fact.

Thanks for the link. I should have clarified my earlier post, as “there hasn’t been a terrorist attack in the US since 9-11 as an orchestrated Al-Qaeda type attack.

Who's intolerant? We all need to look in the mirror.

Want to make a Gentleman's bet that the anthrax attack was an Al-Qaeda terrorist event and is being covered up so that Bush and Co can say "there have been no terrorists attacks since 9-11"? I am being absolutely serious here!

As to the other "facts", you know as well as I do that Al-Qaeda grew out of our foreign policy during the Reagan-Bush years and so did pretty much Saddam. I sincerely believe Clinton's policies reduced that threat and great strides were made in N. Ireland and the Middle East among other places. Clinton pushed for peace everywhere (Clinton's policy toward Libya in '98 paved the way for Libya to rejoin the International community and not anything Bush did although he takes credit for it)! I also know that Clinton's policy towards N. Korea (known as the Agreed Framework which Bush tried to sabotage but has actually come back to) has made the world safer, but only because Georgie is preoccupied elsewhere with an elective war he started. I also know that the war Georgie started is creating and training more terrorists and this cannot be disputed. Just google "Iraq Terrorist Training Ground". Saddam may have been a threat to his own people and possibly barely to his neighbors, but never to us. Now his country is a real threat to us and everyone everywhere! Foreign policy does matter and it has consequences that occur today, tomorrow and a generation later. Your kids and my son are not safer! The promise of the world coming together after 9-11 and properly addressing that horrible crime has been broken and I know exactly who broke it and I will bet that deep down inside you do too.

Do I feel safe here as an American? I did until Bush told the world to kiss his ass with all hat and no cattle style. The war in Iraq has made the world less safe. I do not feel safer today than I did 7 years ago and even if we elect a Democratic President I am afraid the damage has already been done and can't be corrected. For National Security (and my and my family's own) reasons, I want the next President to be humble on the World stage and strong at home. I want a leader with courage, humility and the smarts to dig us out of "The Imbecile and the Damage Done".

FYI. The goal of Al-Qaeda is global domination by Islamic fundamentalists. Anyone or any government that stands in their way is the enemy. Regardless of who or what political party controls the US. To mention that Al-Qaeda grew out of Reagan-Bush and then call the Clinton years a détente is simply - fantasy.

One could equally say that Clintons push for peace allowed Al-Qaeda to flourish. Consider that the following events, which occurred years after the start of your so-called “Clinton push for peace�. Clinton’s time in office (1993-2001)

- Nov 1995 US military Complex bombed in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia
- Jun 1996 Khobar Towers in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia
- Aug 1998 US Embassies in Kenya & Tanzania Bombed
- Oct 2000 USS Cole Bombed

The point is there can be no peace with Islamic Fundamentalists. Look at the recent events in Germany. Germany’s political leaders & press are very vocal against US foreign policies but that doesn’t stop terrorists from planning to attack them. The planned attack on Frankfurt airport would not just have killed Americans. It was targeted at western society.

Look at Islamic terrorism in the world. They just want to kill – the only discriminator they use is whether you agree with their vision for world domination by Islamic fundamentalists. There are no innocents, no women, and no children, just a species to be eliminated. This should sound very familiar to students of German history.

'You are either with us or against us' (G. W. Bush) ... sounds familiar, doesn´t it ?

Since both sides seem to use this logic which side do we hope is victorious?

Which side of Bush’s for or against us is Germany? The events of this past week seem to indicate what Islamic Fundamentalists think.

The events of this past seven years seem to indicate what American Fundamentalists think ...

What? That American Fundamentalists do not want a world in which women must be covered from head to toe when out in public, that women cannot drive a vehicle, that women cannot vote, that women cannot be doctors, that women are property of their husbands, that non believers in their American religion can be beheaded, that infidelity by a women is punishable by death by stoning. These things that American Fundamentalists do not want don’t seem so bad, considering the alternative.

The statement made by miwild on Aug. 29 is not true. Those who have read what else he posts about the US won't be suprised in the least by that.

With regards to Americans feeling safe in Germany, the German government has said that the would-be bombers were motivated by a hatred of the US. I fail to see how it can be beneficial to the safety of US citizens in Germany if one or more persons is spreading false statements about the US.

The action taken by the US in Afghanistan and Iraq has, as far as I can tell, nothing to do with Islam. Those who perpetrate beliefs to the contrary bear the burden of proof- real proof, not some conspiracy theory or hearsay. Those who hate the US, whether or not they call it that, should deal with their problem rather than creating others. Support for action in Afghanistan and Iraq does not make one anti-Islam, nor does opposing it make one 'pro-Islam'.

Nothing of the above applied to pre-war Iraq ... but may well be the result of America´s impending defeat in the disastrously failed "Operation Iraqi Freedom"

Make that fundamentalists of any kind.


Look at terrorism in the world of any kind. You're right, they just want to kill. There are no innocents, no women, and no children, just a species to be eliminated. "Kill 'em, all and let God sort them out"


Yes. Spot on. One wonders if Muslims are the new Jews.

Remember, not every single Muslim is a fundamentalist, not every Muslim is a terrorist, and not every American is a racist cunt.

...OR if Muslims are the new Nazi's and everyone else is the new Jew...

this may have already been said, but my mom had brought up a very good point...the main terrorist cells will probably hold out on an attack until after the u.s. elections are held...they want the new guys to take troops out of iraq and then they will strike...they know that if they do something now then the troops won't be taken out. made sense. my grandmother was due to come here in november but now thanks to these three she refused to "borrow trouble" i actually felt pretty safe at home...wasn't worried at all.

We're not Heck, you haven't met my pa then ...