TT Paddlers - canoeing and kayaking group

hi
Just to let anyone no i have a nut allergy should not affect any of you unless group meal are involved
james

Many thanks to all for making yesterday at Augsburg such good fun.

Has anyone got any photos to share?

JG

BTW the details of the guide book that I had are:
Title: White Water North Alps
Author: Pete Bandtock
Publisher: Rivers Publishing U.K.
ISBN: 0-9519413-9-9

Some further info to follow up on some of yesterday's conversations:

The Blue & White (aka LaOla) on-line store

Or if you prefer you can visit their real store near Rosenheim:
Eichenstraße 3
D-83083 Riedering
Deutschland

Prijon are also based in Rosenheim, you can find them here:
Prijon GmbH
Innlände 6
D-83022 Rosenheim

And whilst I'm on the Rosenheim theme - here's a date for your diary:
The International Kayak Film Festival is held annually in Rosenheim, the next will be the 10th event and takes place on the 17th February 2008. The international label has more to do with the locations and content of some of the films, the majority of people attending come from Germany and Austria and as such the dominant language is German but nevertheless it's good fun.
Anyone interested?

JG

Got 'some' pics from yesterday, slight technical hitch with the camera. Seems I need to organise a training session with the camera too but I'll leave that one for now. Not sure what I can post here I think we're limited in pic siza and resolution. will do what I can but let me have you email addresses and I'll send the originals.

Agree with JayGee excellent day yesterday, can't wait for the next. Already got my eye on a plastic boat. Anyone know anything about an Eskimo Kendo, no I'm serious, I know it sounds like the start of a joke.

So where we going next?

Doh! The 10th IKFF at Rosenheim was this years event - 2008 will be the 11th and as far as I can tell the date hasn't been confirmed yet.

JG.

Posted a few pics of yesterday in a gallery. Will try and sort out some more l8R. Not sure if it's possible to enable the gallery to allow anyone to post to it. If anyone knows let me know. Also is it possible to post video clips?

Guys, I put a couple of photos onto my Flickr page, got a few more to come later. It was great to get out in a boat again, and now I'm fired up for some more I think the water levels yesterday must have been on the low side, it wasn't as bad as I remembered it to be.
-Colin.

It was a great day (even for those of us who stayed dry ). Really looking forward to trying out on a calm lake.

I've not sorted out my photo's yet... I'll post when I have.

Thanks everyone for making yesterday a fun event.

Where we mostly eating or paddling?

Some of you are already arranging to spend some flatwater training sessions with me and we will get those going asap. Also, I will look into what we can do to book the pool at the DKV at Augsburg for some rolling sessions.

Colin, what was the river you wanted to go do? we should plan that soon, perhaps next time it rains? Richard & J, are you up for that? I`d also like to go look at the river running out of the Brenner, that looked like a long stretch of continuous WW, and its not so far from here. For an intermediate trip, we could look at the Loisach one day to...thoughts?

Anyone willing to pitch in now and again with coaching for novice paddlers once in a while?

J, I like your idea of a TT Paddle Club ! It may also help us as a group with booking pool sessions, discounts on Eiskanal use etc, again, anyone with thoughts on this?

Finally, I did set up a "Pro Deal" with www.robsonpaddle.de for gear at almost wholesale prices, including boats if anyone needs gear.

Look forward to the next group outing. Was it an Indian food theme next?

Dave

Just in case anyone hasn't noticed I'm a long way behind the standard of you pros - but if you think it's within my reach (perhaps with a portage or swim or two) then I'm more than willing to give it a go.


I think the idea of a club was more of a collective thought than anything else but I think it's worth looking in to see if formalising things would offer any tangible benefit to the membership - discounts on gear/facilities being good examples of this.

JG

I'm definitely up for going out (even in the rain, since I'll be wet anyway)... I'll have a car as of the 1st, so if anyone needs a lift somewhere just give me a shout. Even if it's something I can't do (since I'm the totally newbie), I'd still want to come along for the day out, and to help.

A club would be a good idea, I think. At least, we should be able to negotiate discounts on pools etc... hopefully

I've gotta take a look at getting at least the gear to wear in the water, suggestions for what to get ? I'm hoping that I can at least use some of it with my scuba diving

Richard

Yeah, with so much enthusiasm, I think progressing this into a club is a logical progression. Apparently there was at least another English speaking paddler at Augsburg yesterday who was struggling with some German tuition. Count me in for a river trip, as soon as I get a suitable boat and if you want help with flat water training or pool sessions, evenings are a little difficult but Friday and the weekend should be OK.

So where and when next guys (and gals of course)?

Hey did you see that post about a body being pulled out of the Isar.

I've often wondered about how practical it would be to use air tanks whilst boating...

But I've come around to the conclusion that there are plenty of other advantages to being the the right way up on the water other than being able to breath!

JG

The river was the Riss, the section down to the Rissbach. That guide you had said it goes at about III/IV with perfect clear water. Found some photos on the web of the AKC doing the Rissbach. The first drop doesn't look too bad, just like something from the middle section of the Etive in Scotland, but the exit looks hairy as f--k. I'll hold the throw line & take photos;-)

Its RAINING...a lot

meh the weather is terrible... just got soaked on the way to work!

whats the plan for tonight (if there still is on ) ?

Yep, I`m still on to paddle tonight, rain has eased up some, although all the gear is now even wetter than it was after we hung it out to dry last night! What time can you get out here by?

Colin, that drop on the Rissbach looks awesome!! Is that the last drop or the entry drop? I think I`d like to do more mellow trip first until I get over the 3wk bronchitis. That one run in the main channel at Augburg kicked my butt on Sunday. Would you...or anyone else be up for a trip down the Ammer or the Loissach first? I could make either this coming Saturday or Sunday, or both! Ideas?

Dave

Dave,

That's the entry to the Rissbach. I think the mellow III/IV paddling is above this gorge.

Can't make this weekend at all.

-Colin.

I won't be able to join any trip this weekend - but I might try and get to the Ismanning bridge for a short session on Sunday morning.

JG

I think we are going to go up and do the upper Isar on Sunday and then take a look at the Rissbach...take a look

Dave

It's quite difficult to make any recommendations on what to get as there are a number of variables, including:
- what type of paddling you'll be taking part in
- what time of year you'll be on/in the water
- what you can afford to spend

And once you've figured out some of those things you've then got to figure out where you're going to get things from - are you happy buying on-line or would you prefer to try things on first.

Anyway all that said, here are a few ideas based on the assumption that white-water is the main activity:
1) Wetsuit
- If you're into diving then you're probably already aware of the types of wetsuits available and the different thicknesses. My preference is for a shorty in 3mm - when it gets colder I add warmth with a long sleeved rash-vest and when it gets really cold I switch to a drysuit.
2) Personal Floatation Device (PFD) - sometimes incorrectly called a life jacket
- A wide variety of PFD's are on the market addressing the requirements of various water sports, different budgets and different fashion tastes. For whitewater kayaking you should look for a PFD that is going to stay in place no matter what and at the same time isn't going to restrict your movement too much. You might also look for features such as a built in safety harness, secure storage pockets and attachment points for other equipment. PFD's should have a bouyancy rating which is given in Neutons (N), you should ensure that the bouyancy rating is appropriate for your size, but for an adult this would typically be 50N.
3) Helmet
- Essential for protecting your head. Again there are a huge range available to suit all budgets. The important thing is that you get something that fits and won't fall off - you might also want to consider one that you can adjust to different configs - i.e. with or without additional headgear, such as neoprene "earwigs" or "skull caps" which you may choose to wear in the colder months.
4) Footwear
- Another element of your kit which you need to tailor to your paddle-sport, for whitewater you'll probably need a balance between:
+ something that will keep your feet warm
+ something that won't impede a wet exit from the boat if necessary
+ something that won't be too bulky and restrict your comfort in the boat
+ something that will offer enough protection to your feet when portaging the boat
- I think most people tend towards neoprene shoes/boots with reinforced soles.
5) Spraydeck aka "deck" or "skirt"
- You may want to hold off getting a deck until you have a boat but it seems to me that most boats seem to have a "big deck" cockpit so if you do decide to buy I'd recommend that as the size to get. Of course you also need to make sure it's a good tight fit to your waist as well. You can get both neoprene and nylon decks - for whitewater kayaking I would recommend the neoprene variety as they are more effective at keeping water out under the more extreme conditions.
- Things to look for
+ a good grab handle for getting the deck off quickly
+ additional protection around the edges where the deck is more prone to abrasion
6) Misc - Other items that you may consider
- Cag (waterproof top) - big range available but basically they break down into semi-dry and dry tops, the difference being the seals around the wrists, neck and waist, which drastically effects how wet you get when you enter the water, how sweaty you get when out of the water, and the cost. For touring I use a semi-dry cag, for whitewater I don't bother yet - I'll review the situation as and when I find my roll, at which point I might look for a dry-top.
- Head gear (earwigs, skullcap, ...)
- Gloves or pogies
7) Additional Equipment
- Whistle
- First-aid kit
- Throwline
- Knife
- Drybags
- Compass/GPS
- Space blanket

Hope that helps.

JG

On the above topic:

Class Five in Augsburg, at the Eiskanal, has a good selection of gear and occasional used boats (right now a Redline for 450 & what looks like a Prijon Hurricane) The owner, Peter, is very helpful and speaks good English.

www.soulboater.de is a good source for used boats and other gear, although much seems to be in the North of Germany.

I have a trade account with Robson & Hiko (www.robsonpaddle.de & www.hiko.cz) We will be collecting some Sea Kayaks for next seasons touring courses from Robson in a couple of weeks if you want anything from them. If you take a look at the websites and see something you want, email me & I`ll find a price. Robson has some great paddle tops & pants + boats.

Ebay.de...kajaks...also, but we should perhaps share info if anyone from here is bidding?

Dave

Phone number for Class Five (0) 821-550055

JG- Wow, thanks for the awesome list! Gives me something to contemplate

Someone looking for a kayak?

looks like a floating tank!

Looks like Jon & I are going to go to the Ammer & Loisach on Sunday .

I would be up for a couple of hours flatwater coaching for anyone on the lake in Eching on Saturday afternoon...

Dave

Hey that looks slightly smaller than my last boat. How much is it going for?

Nicely presented list on what gear you need for kajaking these days JG!

Started out with old pair of jogging bottoms and several thin sweaters under a thin nylon cagoule. Waterproof containers forget it! Sweet jars with plastic bags inside. Total budget 2 & 6. Did it work? No! After 20 mins too cold to do anything else so retired to the pub.

JG, Dave I'm sorry but you can't leave that there. What about the catering requirements for the modern paddler, the gas BBQ, the Harrods hamper. Celebrity chef etc. ...

hi
i would be up for a paddle saturday afternoon
what time were you thinking about
james

Isn't this why you have the floating luggage trailer open boat?

JG

Partly!

Times were hard as a kid in the North of England. Used the canadian to transport coal down the river Trent to the power stations. Couldn't afford a motor barge. :-)

Next 'flatish' water trip I'll bring it along. It'll be a bit like taking the Ark Royal down a river

Hey...Lay off my Harrods Hamper !...the rest of you may eat like peasants from the ground...but I intend on being civilised...even when paddling.

2 years ago, I paddled the Talkeetna Canyon in Alaska over 3 days. Two of us flew in in two flights with a Super Cub to gravel bar at the put in. We had two boats slung underneath and minimal gear, very minimal, just paddle clothing, no sleeping bag, no mat, no tent, stove etc. The only non-paddling related items where my short barrel 12 guage for bears and a bottle of bug dope for the mosquitos...which are worse than the bears... For food we had half a dozen candy bars, a bag of jerky and caught Grayling from the side creeks...

As I think about it, 20 years boating in Alaska, most of those trips where the same...So now...I LOVE MY HAMPER

...and carrying coal down the canals...give me a break!...when I was a lad...

And just in case you`ve not already noticed...it RAINING...river levels are`a`risin

I'd be up for a flat water river trip in the tourer sometime - any recommendations on suitable stretches?

PS if anyone else is interested there's a spare touring boat available

classic comedy - you were lucky...

Hey guys, I've got a plan wrt to the coal barge. 'Chantilly!' I saw her paddling in a kayak at the weekend. With all that Dragon boat training. I'll get her paddling the front of the barge and you guys can water ski off the back, and we'll take all the hampers :-)

Great day yesterday Dave. Not quite what I had in mind before but it seemed to do the trick. Just had a quick look at this Addidas Sick line competion next week. Looks absolutely awesome!!! I've just gotta go... and watch, please note. Check out the web site and the pictures of the course.

http://www.adidas-sickline.com/

Dave, I'm it won't look as big from the water and it looks to flow out OK at the end, eventually if you don't mind a few bits of broken plastic.

is anyone going to the white water worl championship then
James

i meant world

check out this link. I'm pretty sure this is the section that they're 'racing' down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsNMRdzizJg

"Always looks bigger from the bank" ...OK...I`ll eat my words on that one...not really sure who I was trying to fool!!! Anyway, yesterday was awesome, I think we did the TT paddling crew proud...all upright, no blood and much fun. The quintessential alpine kayaking day, awsome scenery, snow on the lofty summits, the color in the trees, the clear, cold, alpine whitewater...and good paddling company! Even the drive back down the valley was awesome, I had the sounds and heater up full, the windows wide open so I could smell the woodsmoke in the chilling air...Now I remember why I love kayaking!!!

Had a great day today with Chantilly & Ken...more budding whitewater addicts !! going through the basics and beyond, and they are both now ready for the moving stuff!!! Way to go guy`s, you did great!!

Annette & I go tomorrow to scope out the upper Isar and soak up a little more of out fall mountain scenery.

Shall we all try and all get together for a flat water session next weekend?

The pic doesn't really do it justice Dave.
It did look bigger than that from below. I will vouch for that plus the fact that you are in your Kayak not walking down with your paddles.

Did any of the other pics come out OK?

Did the deal for the Dagger and the gear yesterday. Just gotta get it back over from the UK now.

Sunday is an option for a paddle.

Still smiling about the Loisach, and the fact that we didn't get any pictures at all from that river. Next time maybe!

Nice photo ... Mmmmmm!

So is there a plan for this weekend ? My loaner car turned up, so if someone needs a ride thats fine!

How about a pre-breakfast session at the bridge at Ismanning on Wednesday?

Other than that I'd be up for a paddle on the weekend - Sunday would work better for me than Saturday.

Hey that's keen, seriously keen. Me not quite that keen.

Sunday sounds good but would prefer 'after' breakfast. Some time after breakfast or could meet up in a beergarten half way through or tell me where you plan to take out and I'll paddle back from there. Slowly

BTW, will be in Oktoberfest tomorrow afternoon. Anyone get a pass signed and fancy joining me for a quiet jar or maybe even two?

If you do, call or txt me on 0160 975 47 460

I spoke with a colleague yesterday who, it turns out, has an open boat and would be interested in joining us on any suitable trips (up to and including grade 3).

Hi All, just checking for somewhere to paddle. Found this link for a place running tours in Europe.

Video of the Rißbach, Loisach and Ammer.

http://www.drkayak.com/content/view/41/42/

hi
My internet is down so can not recive e-mail\pm froom now unitil thursday please text.
James

So yesterday we took the dogs boating...Went down the Isar, putting in just below Wallgau & taking out at Vorderiss (below the Rissbach) Its an awesome float, very scenic, no whitewater as such, but quite a swift current. It could be a great first timers moving water run and we should for sure use it next season. It would also be a great overnighter as there are ample gravel bars and campspots and some great looking hiking on either side of the valley. The whole trip is framed by the Zugspitze. With the color in the trees and snow on the summits, I reminded me of many similar Alaska floats...kept expecting a Grizzly bear to appear on the shoreline! It would also be a good open boat/canoe paddle, a little thin in places, but mostly good, I`d happlily paddle an open boat with gear for the kayakers if we do a trip or two there next year (or even this) We also checked out an awesome looking gorge and another suitable open canoe route into the Sylvertstein lake that would also be worth a trip.

Went back up to look at the Rissbach falls. The water was down a little from when Jon & where there on Sunday, but that fall still looks wicked. The first drop seems quite benign, but everything below could be mega dangerous if you get off line (you can see in that video Jon posted, what happens if you over river left and into the cushion off the left wall) It seems super hard to protect to. We climbed down as far as we could without ropes. Anyway, will want to see that at several water levels before I would contemplate running it. We talked with the folk down at the Post Gasthaus in Vorderiss, who told of "many" fatalities in there each year...quite sobering!

I`m contemplating paddling this afternoon if anyone wants to meet, may be a bit late for Augsburg now, but Issamning bridge or even the lake...

Also the weekend, we are thinking we will go down to the "Sick Line" comp...may even take a boat!...Are you still going to go Jon? Anyone else want to go...?

I also would propose another group meet (Sunday?) This time at the lake. I most everyone could benefit from some more flat water experience. We could structure some specific tuition for beginners and some of you better paddlers could help with the progressive ones. I would also like to spend some time on some basic safety & rescue stuff also if anyone is interested in that. I am sure we can muster enough boats and gear, and we could also get the open canoes out on the water to.

I`ll bring my Hamper again!

Dave

Annette looks a natural in a boat!

I am going to the sick line event for sure but will head down direct from Ulm. If anyone wants a lift from Ulm ur more than welcome.

Look forward to a paddle Sunday as well, after seeing the vid on the Rißbach, safety practice session seems a good idea. I haven't ruled it out yet. But let's be honest. If you get it wrong, it could be the last thing that you do get wrong! BTW the beer and company at Oktoberfest were spot on