Most dangerous city districts at night

Hi, i've done a bit of research using the search function on this forum to see what areas are 'dodgy' parts of Berlin at night, and i'm surprised with what i've found. People have mentioned P-Berg as dodgy - I thought this and Mitte were supposed to be the swankyest areas! I've booked accommodation in Charlottenburg and P-Burg for my week-long stay because I thought they were good areas. I want absolutley nothing to do with any neo-nazi's at all! Funnily enough, I am blonde and do have blue eyes, but I dont want a knife in my back for speaking English walking down some street or on the U-Bahn one night...

So basically, could anyone give me a definatative list of definate no-go areas at night, I can re-book my accommodation if necessary (all I want is to be able to go out for drinks and a meal close to where i'm staying in safety, really)...

I would say anywhere deep in the East can't be good, I personally find Prenzlauer Berg dangerous for a foreigner, maybe not a blonde one... maybe also Moabit, Lichtenberg, Wedding, Pankow...

Berlin in my opinion is a safe city. of course there are bad areas.
I would probably stay clear of Lichtenberg, Neukoeln and Marzahn, why you would want to be there in the first place.

If you deem "a little bit of alternative" as unsafe then half of Berlin will not be for you.

I just dont understand why P-Berg is an expensive part (property wise) wise, but is one of the more dangerous bits of the city - does it really fall into the catorgory as 'deep in the east'? Maybe i'm asking the wrong question - which bits are the safest for a native looking, but-not-really-native such as myself? In terms of going out at night etc...

Yes Prenzlauerberg IS East and used to be a very rough district but due to the cheap rents it attracted lots of young students, in recent years it got redeveloped and started to become trendy for those looking for a cutting edge, alternative scene, lots of bars and clubs started appearing everywhere and the rents started going up.
It is a bit like let's say Bethnal Green in London, which used to be a rough no go area like Hackney but that due to high rents everywhere else, got done up and marketed for the young trendy professionals working in the city, it isn't yet as safe or posh as Hampstead but it's aiming to be just as expensive, most of it is just marketing...
So again, Prenzlauerberg isn't a posh place, more like trendy with a rough edge, for a blonde person should be safe enough.

I used to live there and went back a few times with friends on nights out, I have had nasty experiences with neo nazis there as have my friends even in recent years, groups of skin heads still walk the East Berlin streets from time to time looking for trouble, if you are unlucky you might encounter such people but it is unlikely, besides most surely they wouldn't attack white/blonde people...

Mitte is a lot safer as is Schoneberg and Charlottenburg, you can also find nice places in these areas, maybe not as 'raw' but that's the way I like it, it depends on the taste...

Schoeneberg is nice coz it is mostly gay. However if you are blond I would also avoid the Potsdammer strasse/Kufurstenstrasse part of Schoeneberg, full of prostitutes!

May I ask a question what is you definitiion of safe? coz I find P/Berg safe.

My definition of safe is basically somewhere where you can go out and not have to worry about being mugged/stabbed/beaten up, basically. Somewhere where you can go into the local watering hole and not going to glassed for no reason. And somewhere where you can walk home from the above watering hole and arrive home with the advantage of being alive...

Then area i would recommend are: Prenzlaurberg, Freidrichshain, Kreuzberg, Mitte all of these fall within your definition of safe. The are relativly alternative/studenty/arty types there, including punks, but I have never had any problems with them. Plenty of "watering holes" and popular.

More upmarket/snobby (devoid of atmosphere in my opinion) is Charlottemberg. Nice resturants but a bit too sterile. Schoeneberg is a gay haven.

Hmm, always tricky this one...

Like some people have said, some districts - for whatever reasons genuine or apocryphal - do suffer from a bad rep (the Marzahns and Lichtenbergs of this world because of high unemployment and seemingly random, casual alcohol-induced violence and the Neuköllns and Weddings because of their down-at-heel aspect, high unemployment and high Turkish populations). Does that mean that Neukölln, Wedding or Moabit (?!?) are unsafe? If you're looking for a like-for-like comparison, they're a great deal safer than most British towns of a Friday or Saturday night.

After much thought, I'd suggest you simply just stay in and bolt your hotel door: order your meal and drinks from the safety of your hotel room for that genuine "Berlin" experience. The restless natives outside will only sour your visit.

Less seriously, I'd suggest you've got some funny ideas if you honestly think walking down the road speaking English will see you lying in the gutter with a knife in your back.

"Dodgy" is as "dodgy" does my friend.

Hmmm, I can see the point you're making, but its the funny ideas of others i'm more concerned about, rather than those of my own. I've read stories (on here) of mindless casual violence by nazi thugs, and I'd consider it good practice to try and limit such a thing happening by finding myself on the 'wrong side of the tracks' - does that mean i've got some weird ideas or am being overly cautious or paranoid? - I dont think so...

After all, I would'nt advise a tourist to wonder to down some of the more dubious areas of London...

I hear what you're saying. But my 'orrible grumpy ole man facetiousness aside, the problem (if there really is one) of neo-nazi attacks can more or less be restricted to Lichtenberg, Marzahn (which, with all due respect to the people of those two districts, I doubt you would want to visit in the first place) and, to a lesser extent, Friedrichshain and Prenzlauer Berg (by virtue of the fact that they border the first two). You will not encounter any problems in Charlottenburg (well, apart from boredom).

I think you are just being paranoid.

I go out n berlin every weekend. I have never been attacked. I have never had a bad experience here getting mugged or jumped on. (not like the many times in Glasgow, Manchester...)

Just be sensible (do not ask the big group of skinheads for a light ) and enjoy your time in Berlin coz it is a great city with a great night life.

Berlin much more safer than London!

Thats not saying much! Seriously though, will take on board your comments, and 'may' even end up staying in P-Berg after all...

How ironic this all is seeing that people in P-Berg won't come to Xberg as "it's scary and dangerous"

Well you are right thinking that way, but seriously as a foreign white person I doubt you'd have much trouble, unless you are dark skinned like myself you really wouldn't know the extent of danger from Neo nazi attacks...
I lived in London for many years, mainly Muswell Hill and for a short period of time in rough places like Tottenham and Wood Green where knife attacks happen nearly daily and nothing ever happened to me even when I used to walk back home alone at 3 a.m., here I have had 2 incidents with NeoNazis, once really hairy in broad daylight and once around 9 p.m. when out with female friends, a close friend of mine was beaten up as well a few months ago, all of this happened in Prenzlauerberg and surrounding areas in a typical night out, but neither me or my friends are white and I'm pretty sure it wouldn't happen to you.
Overall Berlin is probably safer than London for an average white person, only in my case I find Berlin more dangerous than London.
Anyway, personally I think that Kreuzberg is a bit safer than Prenzlauerberg and as already stated Charlottenburg and Schoneberg...

I'm a white woman who's lived in central PZLberg for 7 months, all alone, aside from about 2 months with my Jewish ex-boyfriend. I regularly go out with men of color but the majority of the time I'm out there all alone with my Northern European face and not very good German. I have never had any even slightly negative experiences in PZLberg or Berlin for that matter. Of course people do look at times, but don't even stare very much (it's impolite). However, I would comment that I know immigrant men living in Lichtenberg and further east who've experienced vicious attacks, including a Nigerian man with a car who's had DWB experiences (sorry, American term -- means Driving While Black -- referring to police harrassment). Is Germany racist? Sure, it's racist as hell. Is it racist against whites? F--- NO. Don't be paranoid, enjoy your time here, & avoid Germans if they make you feel uncomfortable (there are plenty of foreigners to hang out with).

Many of the answers above depend on from where they came. All of Germany is better than some of the most notorious districts in the good ole US of A.

What a lot of bullcrap! I reckon Germany is a lot safer than the UK. They (Germans) are much more tolerant than most think. They may call Anglo speakers "Tommies or Amies" depending where they're from. I would not have second thoughts going anywhere in Berlin. If you are scared, don't travel, wrap yourself in cotton wool and live a happy life don't mix with nasty foreigners.

There has been a few comments on this thread like this. It seems the people go into some kind of defence mode and lose grasp of reality. These statements are ONLY true in the entirety but in specific situations they are NOT necessary true. Berlin is generally safer than London maybe but parts of Berlin may be more dangerous to a Black person than London Or some Rich Londoner from a nice part of town (Richmond or the leafy suburbs) may find themselves hanging out in a more earthy part of Berlin than back home etc...

Sorry to wake some of you guys up there is crime in Germany and if someone wishes to investigate the safety side of their trip it's not necessary being paranoid. When I visited Wiesmar in the North Germany I didn't visit Rostock because I didn't want to take the risk; despite being curious about the city. Now I come from Manchester but I perceived the risk for me as being too great in a city like Rostock. You can call me paranoid but the problem with crime is - being unluckly despite the relatively low level of crimes wouldn't help my sorry arse if I ended-up stabbed/beaten up whilst I nurse myself in hospital. Nor would my wife forgive me!!! ... So unfortunately Rostock will have to wait...

One time, I forgot to warn a friend about the NeoNazi (Skin heads what every you want to call them) and when he visited me in Munich he unfortunately ran into a group of them on the train from Salzburg. I never expected them to be problem in Bavaria/Salzburg... Luckily nothing happened accept for some name calling; would such a incident likely have happened in Manchester - from my experience NO... So was that bullcrap...

So, in your experience you were never wearing the colors of Chelsea or some other Asser group?

@Eurovol,

Call me thick but I don't understand your question...or if there is a point behind it that either!

Ok, you're thick.

Hmm, I moved here from New Orleans, and while I never had any trouble myself, I was very careful about walking in non-crowded areas at night, and had "The Club" on my car's steering wheel all the time. The university I taught at provided regular "BOLO" (be on the lookout) updates on people getting robbed at gunpoint within a mile of campus. (It was an economically and racially diverse area, and the high crime rate in NO was dominated by other neighborhoods.) It was usually at 1am outside a bar, but occasionally earlier in the evening, so I tried not even to walk home from campus after dark. By contrast I feel much safer in Europe, although I did, as in the other thread, get my mobile phone stolen by a pickpocket.

However, I am a white man, so I'm not a target for the racial or sexual harrassment people have mentioned.

I am a 24 year old girl living in Prenzlauer Berg for the past 2 years, have been going out with friends, and also alone, until 2,3,4,5,6, O'clock in the morning, coming alone home and have NEVER had any bad experience. I hope this comfprts you. P'berg is really a great neighbourhood to be staying in, and, as all big cities, has risks, but I am in general very sensitive to dodgy areas and feel completely safe in P'berg... hope it helps!

In p'berg, they rob you with the rents.

I'd rather be pickpocketed, its less expensive.

I think its silly to define places as "safe" and "non safe". It doesn't work like that in Berlin. Its not black and white. If you are in a so called "posh" area at night, walking alone, you could still get mugged. A lot of enterprising thieves come to the posh areas just for that reason.
I think you should stay in Pberg but USE YOUR WITS and that goes for everywhere in the city. Ditto in all European capitals!

Tips...
Don't walk alone on deserted streets late at night or esp. if you're drunk and not at the top of your game.
Don't carry lots of cash on you.
Don't be fooled by sketchy casanovas who want to borrow your phone/cash/cameras etc

P-berg is large like many Berlin neighborhoods so you can't paint it with a broad stroke. If you are staying near Kollwitzplatz I can't imagine you'd have any problems as it is full of families and is busy at all hours with people walking around, eating or drinking at the many cafes or bars. It's a great place to stay and enjoy the atmosphere of Berlin. The idea of running into problems in this area seems totally unlikely even if you were looking for trouble.

But I have noticed that there are some less trendy areas of B-berg that have a distinct feeling that prosperity has left them behind, that might house someone with too much time on their hands. I had to take the M2 one time about 2 kilometers north of Dazingerstrasse and I was surprised at how dreary the area appeared, although it was broad daylight I was actually nervous having to go into this rundown building to pick something up and there where these two skinhead looking guys in the lobby, they were fine to me but then I am white and had a child with me. It is the only time in Berlin I felt nervous.

Well I just got back from Berlin lastnight. I stayed near Rosa-Luxemburg platz and did a fair bit of walking round Prenzlauer Berg. I have to say, to me, the whole area still felt rather run-down (I know its a poorer suberb on the up). At night it was definatley 'edgy' in my opinion, and I'm not sure about some of the 'bars' there (some of the ones I went into were more like poorly decorated rooms with anti G8 posters peeling off the walls and full of stoned students). I went into 'White Trash' (think its run by Americans) and that place seemed so contrived, weird for the sake of being weird - not my scene at all. I'm rather sceptical of this 'alternative' scene. Some of the buildings along Erberswalder and Bernauer had a soviet & souless feel about them, the area just didn't do it for me - but different strokes for different folks, as they say.

Think i'm definately more of a (dare I say ) 'Westside' person. I make an effort when I go out and appreciate places where others make an effort, so i've decided to buy in Charlottenburg. Thanks to everyone for your comments...

I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one that thinks this way, when I was a lot younger I was very into the 'alternative' scene, only in my country that meant being middle class with edgy taste in clothes and music, when I first came to Berlin (aged 23) I found the Berlin version of alternative, dangerous, scruffy, poor, dirty, I went off it soon enough.
In London I arrived at the birth of 'Brit Pop' the alternative scene there was a hell of a lot more glamorous, nice clothes, shoes, make up, cool trendy and expensive bars with an arty feel, I got into that easily.
For me & my London friends a great night out would be to be in a good trendy bar with a great DJ, cocktails in bright colours and you would buy a new outfit before hand just for the night, everyone looking their best.
On the other hand a good night out in Berlin for a couple of my Latin-American friends who love the Berlin scene, would be going as far east as possible, find one of those unlicensed 'clubs' (ex-abattoirs) with meat hooks as decorations where you need a torch just to find the entrance because it is oh so underground and 'alternative' and dance the night away having as background monotone electronic music amongst sweaty skin heads, 'cool kids' wearing oxfam gear and oxygen masks because they are oh so 'edgy', etc. I'm not imagining this, I have been dragged to such place twice as it seems to be the place to be.
As you said, not my cup of tea, different strokes for different folks I guess I'm also more of a 'Westside' person or Schicki-Mickey as they like to call us round here!

dwnb - you may want to re-consider buying in berlin.
munich may be a better match.
have you looked into that?

Yes, I have looked into that. Munich would be great - stunning scenery with the Alps etc (I love skiing). But what attracts me to Berlin is the the price of property at the moment - Munich aint cheap due to the desirability, obviously.
I could afford Munich just, but dont want to put that much money into Germany.

I'm definatley with Diane on this one, and agree wholeheartedly with everything she says. I'm a 29 guy, so this idea of 'alternative' is all rather tiresome to me - when I was 19, possibly. but not now. To me it means poor, dirty and pretentious. But I liked Charlottenburg, I loved the bars there (they actually resembled what i'd class as a bar), and if people's idea of 'atmosphere' is scruffy & deprived, i'll quite happily go without...

Give me a disco ball anyday

WTFF has been thoroughly slagged in other threads, but I have to say it never felt to me like it was run by Americans. More like Germans who are trying to be American. But they have fun with it, and I find it entertaining once in a while.

Schoeneberg is certainly not "mostly gay." The gay kiez is centred around Nollendorfplatz, but that is just one corner of a large and varied district. Winterfeldtplatz, Goltzstrasse, etc. straddle the line between posh and bohemian, other areas are more Turkish etc. Overall it is probably more generically middle class than anything, though it has a lot of very nice cafes, shops, etc.

I must say that I love Prenzlauerberg. I am American and have lived here with my German hubby for a year now, and nothing has happened at all to me. I have been out in the middle of the night, even in Mauer Park ALONE and nothing has happened, and I haven't heard of anything happening to any of my friends that live here either, even the English speaking ones. Everyone is so nice. PBerg is actually the district with the most children, also. Hope this helps. My hubby has lived in Berlin all his life and since he is not here right now, I can not ask him what areas to stay out of, but there are a couple which I can write to you later if you would like.

Aha, so just another "Grundstückshai".

There's something fairly dispiriting about people who've never set foot in Berlin buying up properties in the city because they're a sound "investment". If I were a Berliner, I think I'd resent the current property development trend which is seeing Brits buying up properties purely for a short or long term easy buck.

As a result, this place is really going to rack and ruin - and that has nothing to do with "dangerous" city districts or otherwise. We're all Kollwitzplatzers now it seems.

Dispiriting? Oh please. 50% of London's properties are brought by foreigners for one reason or another - do you object to that too? We're all in the EU and I (as indeed everyone else is) am free to buy property wherever I choose. No one 'owns' Berlin, and I have to say I'd find this comment laughable coming from a born & bred Berliner, let alone someone who is'nt.

In other words, I don't agree with you

Who mentioned London?

Getting back to your original point about "safe" Berlin districts, I was merely trying to point out the potential corrolary between outsiders buying up all the best properties and the resentment that might create amongst the locals. Of course, as a stay away home owner that's a problem you won't encounter first hand, but I'd like to thank that, for my part, I'm at least putting something back into the community - however laughable or quaint a concept that might be.

Who said anything about a stay away home owner? I might well decide that I like Berlin enough to move there, if I were to find a suitable job that paid sufficiently. I was using London as an example - which has a far, far higher proportion of foreign owner/buyers of property. I don't think the odd Brit buying some 2 bed apartment is going to bring Berlin to its knees. Germany will never be an obvious investment for British (or other) buyers like London, so don't let it give you nightmares...

Gawrd, it were all trees 'round here when I were a nipper. Bleedin' foreigners coming over 'ere destroying our communites. National service that's what they need...bring back the birch I say, hanging's to good for 'em etc.

Well your comments could be interpreted that way, yes. And besides, with regards to what you say about the locals resenting brits for buying a few properties - the Germans are not exactly noted for being shy when it comes to entering other people's countries, now are they?

Gee, the British take the cake though, followed by the Spanish and the French! (British Empire, where the sun never sets)

LOL! Yeah, but y'know, there's ways of doing things... We had a particular knack for it, and gave most of back voluntarily, being the good sports we are...

I know this is a bit out of date for this thread and pointless but have been trying to find some info out about the dodgy areas of berlin out of curiousity. So i thought id add my experience on!

I came over for a weeks holiday last month.Was staying in prenzlauer berg and found the area fine day and night (was walking around alot by myself too) didnt come across any type of neo-nazi/nazi,skinhead,punk or whatever except once on a tram and they didnt do or say anything.

A few people have mentioned Lichtenberg as a place to avoid? I visted a friend who lives there a couple of times during the week and my impression was it seemed rather pleasent.Only had one bit of minor aggro and that was outside the U-bahn station.The only time i felt slightly on edge was in some parts of Kreuzberg,

I asked her what the dodgy areas were and she mentioned Marzahn and Hellersdorf and added she does not go to them.I was quite intrigued to go and check em out but never got round to it.

Overall i find Berlin alot safer than London or towns near me and feel comfortable walking about by myself,then again i know what to look out for when im at home!

I wouldn't go to Marzahn alone at night, everywhere else is pretty safe. But then again, I'm a guy. It's different for a girl, they tend to become attack and verbal abuse targets more often.

The sprawing GDR council estates around Alexanderplatz are pretty rough at night and best avoided.

Pankow??
its a very nice area, unless your referring to north of pankow, heinersdorf...

Sprawling GDR council estates!! I love that!

This isn't the USA...

(sorry, couldn't resist).

Same rules apply that apply to any big city. Just exercise common sense.
You've nothing to worry about in most areas here. Prenzlauerberg isn't scary at all, not sure where you got that idea. Are you planning on standing around in shadowy corners in skanky clothing on weird side streets and stuff or something?

I think several years ago P-Berg was a different place. Kinda the types that hang out in Kottbusser Tor now used to hang out in Kollwitzplatz. They've since been replaced by stroller moms.

"several" years = more than ten. after that it was helmholtzplatz, but it was never something like kottbusser tor