Using family ties to immigrate to Germany

Alright, I've got a "special" situation...lucky me...and wondering if anyone can help.

I'm an American citizen and the mother of two half German children. My ex and I have shared custody, and I am not allowed to take the children out of Germany without his permission, therefore, I'm living in Germany to be a mother. Obviously. I also have an unbefristet aufenhaltserlaubnis.

Here's the problem. I have a baby with my new partner who is American and he wants to move here to be with us. We're trying to get him a job, but if it doesn't work out I thought I'd try for a special "family" erlaubnis because his daughter lives here. Lady from the Aus Amt says that he can't have one because his daughter isn't German. This doesn't make sense to me, because according to the law she automatically has German citizenship until she's 23.

Essentially, if he doesn't get an arbeitserlaubnis, I have to choose between my older children growing up without me, or my baby growing up without her daddy.

If anyone has any idea, hit me with em. Please.

*panic*

marry your new boyfriend?

Good idea. We're engaged but it takes a while to get married in Germany, doesn't it? (I got married in Denmark.)

anyone know where two Amis can get hitched, fast?

Your myspace is interesting...

Complicated situation.

what is this, Young and Restless reloaded?

Get a lawyer. seriosly. If you're short on cash, try a 'kostenlose Rechtsberatung', many social organisations offer them.

Edit: Holy shit, that kid looks like good in that ramones shirt. I want some for mine !

Try living it, sweetie.

Fly to Vegas and get hitched there. It's quick and legal. Don't forget to tell them you must have two copies of an international marriage certificate. The Beamter will demand at least one copy.

woof.

Cool. Got a few hundred bucks I can borrow?

(Did you notice the 3 kids part? )

If you had enough time to have another kid, you have enough time to fly to vegas.

You made your bed babe...

Definitely get a lawyer before doing anything else, especially getting married. As an auslander with 3 kids and 2 fathers from 2 countries in the works you definitely need proper legal advice.

Does it even help to get married since you're not a German citizen, and will it it affect your level of support from the state or your ex? Can it affect the custody agreement of your other children down the road? What can happen, legally, if it doesnt work out with the new guy and he wants to move back to the US? No clue really but worth certainly worth talking to a lawyer.

I dont know about the family laws but getting a job is certainly necessary I would think. Things to consider:

1. What does he do, work wise. His chances of getting a job are better in some industries than others.
2. What is he doing to prepare for the move, is he taking german lessons? Is his CV german ready?
3. How long can you manage if he doesnt have a job? That is, is it even financially realistic for him to come over here sans employment?
4. Would you be willing/able to work if he takes care of the baby?

Just some things to consider. Good luck you all.

jml

Do not attach in any way his coming over to you or your child. He should get himself here on his own merits and then just sort of bump into you after he has all his documents sorted.

what the... ?

If I were you, I'd be looking into the "his daughter isn't German" angle. Sounds like you think she's German, but the lady at the Auslaenderamt thinks not. Does this mean that if you can prove your daughter is German, her father/your partner can join you in Germany?

I wasn't aware that the child of two Americans, one resident, one not, "automatically" receives German citizenship. It's possible you would have to do some paperwork to have your daugher certified as a citizen.

Why do you think your daughter is German?

A friend of mine was born in Germany, grew up here, always lived here, but her parents are both Indian, so she had Indian citizenship until 2004. She then got the German citizenship, along with her sister (also born here) and her mom (who has lived and worked here since he 1970s) and it was not a problem at all, more like a formality. But being born here does not automatically give your daughter German citizenship.

But why can you and your boyfriend not get married in Denmark, like your last marriage? I have heard before that it is a lot quicker than getting married in Germany, and your partner can come here as a tourist, then you can go to Denmark to get married and apply for his Aufenthaltsgenehmigung. It would also be cheaper than getting married in Las Vegas.

I just found this:


How long have you been living in Germany? If you have been living here for 8 years or more, your daughter does indeed have German citizenship (according to this paragraph) - and will have to choose between her German and American citizenship between age 18 and 23. This is called the Optionsmodell.

Last I knew, Mariposa's information is correct. However, I think you still have to apply for your child to have the correct citizenship papers, if you haven't done so already.

If she does have the papers, I don't see how the Auslaenderamt can tell you that your daughter isn't German. Then the only thing to pursue would be to find out if her American father can indeed join her in Germany on the basis of his daughter being German.

Is your boyfriend listed on the birth certificate as the father? If not, there's another snag.

I know, I know it's really complicated. She has an American passport and an aufenhaltserlaubnis. No "kinderpass"...gotta check into that.

You know this biggest problem with all of this stuff is where to start. I don't know what to do if the person at the auslanderabteilung says she's not German. Do I go to the standesamt? I guess that's the place to start.

Well, if you have not lived here for 8 years or more, she isn't German. If I were you, I would get a copy of that law, and proof of your residence here for the past 8 years and your permanent Aufenthaltsgenehmigung, and go back to that Amt, maybe to a different person, and show them in writing that according to the law your daughter is German.

Especially if one of the parents is German.My brother is married to a German woman and their boys automatically recieved German Citizenships.Seems like you are being messed around by the lady at the Auslander amt.Go higher than her.

But she is American and so is her daughter's father, so the parents of the child are both American, not German.

And that means that her children do not automatically get German Citizenship.Like my 2 daughters we are both English and its only a formaility that they can apply for German Citizenship

Am I missing something? I assumed the father is German.

EDIT: Ah nevermind, I see we're talking about the third child.

LOL

@Mik Dickinson: you seem to have missed the quote in post #17: If at least one of the parents (of a child born in Germany) has been living here for eight years or more and has a permanent residence permit then the child is entitled to German nationality.

U.N. no i have not missed it.Explain this please.I have lived here for 24.5 years and my wife also a British National has been liveing here for 19 years.Both our daughters were born over here now aged 13 and 10.They are both not automatically entitled to German Nationality.Both me and my wife have´unbegrenzte Aufentaltserlaubnisse'.So there is something wrong here in the quotes from the German Officialdom.

aessa, try this site: http://germany.usembassy.gov/germany/servi...ationality.html
This was updated Nov 2006 after they passed some new laws about citizenship & dual citizenship for Americans & Germans

II. Basic Primer on German Citizenship Law

1. A person can become a German citizen in one of three ways: by birth, by adoption as a minor, or by naturalization.

2. A person may be born a German citizen by either jus sanguinis, i.e., through descent from his/her parents, or jus soli, i.e., through place of birth.

3. As a general rule, a child born to a German citizen parent automatically acquires German citizenship at birth through jus sanguinis, regardless of the place of birth. There are exceptions under present law, however, and have been many in the past. For more information about how German citizenship may be transmitted by a German parent, please contact your local Staatsangehörigkeitsbehörde (or Standesamt, in some parts of Germany).

4. As of January 1, 2000, a child born in Germany to non-German parents automatically acquires German citizenship at birth by jus soli if: (1) at least one parent had lived legally in Germany for at least eight years prior to the birth; (2) at the time of the birth, that parent had a permanent residence permit (either an Aufenthaltsberichtigung or, for the three years prior to the birth, an unbefristete Aufenhaltserlaubnis). Note that:

a. The child must choose between German nationality and the nationality of his/her parents before he/she turns 23 years of age, unless it is legally impossible for him/her to give up his/her parents' nationality, in which case he/she must apply to the German authorities for dual nationality before turning 21.

b. Special rules apply to children born between February 2, 1990, and December 31, 1999, who have until December 31, 2000, to apply for German citizenship.

c. Those born in Germany to non-German parents before February 2, 1990, have no claim to German citizenship under this law.

d. For more information, please contact your local Staatsangehörigkeitsbehörde or the nearest office of the Ausländerbeirat (Foreigners Advisory Council).

5. A person can become a German citizen at some time after his/her birth through the Einbürgerung (German naturalization) process, i.e., by applying for German citizenship and satisfying certain legal requirements. One requirement is the formal renunciation of all other nationalities, unless legally impossible under the laws of the applicant's home country. For more information about German naturalization process, please contact your local Staatsangehörigkeitsbehörde (or Standesamt in some parts of Germany) or the nearest Ausländerbeirat.

6. A child under age 18 adopted by a German citizen automatically becomes a German citizen as of the time of the adoption.

7. A German citizen has no right to renounce his/her German citizenship but generally is allowed to do so, so long as he/she does not become stateless as a result. While there are exceptions, as a general rule a German citizen may not give up citizenship to avoid an obligation of that citizenship, e.g., military service. For more information about loss of German citizenship, please contact your local Staatsangehörigkeitsbehörde (or Standesamt).

Why does your second stud want to come to Germany?
Why haven't you answered the questions posed in post #12?
Maybe then someone could come up with solid ideas/help!

The Staatsangehörigkeitsgesetz was revamped in 2000 - that's when they added the 8 year clause. Before then, citizenship by birth was strictly regulated through bloodlines.

Wel a stattsangehörigkeitsbehörde is a totally new one on me.Always thought it was the Auslanderamt that dealt with ntionalisation.

Because he wants to live near us, like I said.

I actually think we've got it worked out. He's going to be a freelance English teacher. I'm more concerned about the legal aspects of him not being allowed to be here simply because his daughter lives here. It just doesn't seem fair...

Thanks, that's exactly where I got my information too! I'm just not sure what to do with this (or the German version of it) if the lady from the Aus Amt says it's not so. Guess I'll have to pitch a fit.

@ #post 32
May not be that simple.
Check out work permits and schools that might assist.
It's not as easy as just..."he's going to become..."
Best of luck anyway!

Now do not quote me on thsi but i do believe if you can prove that the person in question can afford their own sick insurance and will not become a drag on the German Federal Social system you will make life easier for yourself.I do however wish you all the luck in the world getting what you want.

I've been told different things about that. An Arab guy I knew, told me that they had him sign a statement saying that he wouldn't collect welfare. Another person I know claims that's not legal, because once he has the right to live here he's got the right to social help. Dunno.

If you think about it logically then you can only be entitled to claim on the social if you have paid in to the system

Logic - German law?!! That's just crazy talk!

No inform yourself about the 3 year regulation.Non applicable for E.U. Citizens

We don't want any money from them so, why?

Supposedly brought in to prevent a mass flood of immigrants from the East but the German Govt. overrated their country thinking that when certain countries joined the E.U. that Germany would be overswamped with immigrants increasing the amount of people on social benefits and unemployment.Their are other ways around the system say by stipulating that the person involved is a dependent.You are the worker and the guy stays at home.Just read what they give you and you can work your way around.Believe it or not German officialdom leaves you a lot of lee way.