400 Euro basis jobs - minijobs for €400 per month

recently moved here and currently looking for work,
what i was wanting to know is that i keep seeing adverts etc saying something about 400euro basis or something along those lines. What exactly are the meaning there??? If anyone can shed light on that for me, that would be great.

Ta!

Hi Trickykid, welcome to Munich and TT.

"EUR 400 basis" is a special kind of part time job where you are not liable for full taxation and social security payments and neither is the employer.

Typical for this (cos it's limited to paying €400 a month!) would be (say) a couple of days work in a shop or a part time cleaning job.

Good Luck job hunting!

My experience of EUR 400- a month jobs are that they are full time. But I was desperate so I took it Though I think I got 1 afternoon off a week or something.
Also, some work experience placements (if generous) go on that basis and pay you EUR 400. Usually a cash-in-the-hand job, no taxes.

At €2,50 an hour if it was full time i would be a low paid job!

But UA is on the right track, these are lower paid jobs. Sometimes "EUR400 Basis" is sued for a part of the job and if it is full time the rest is paid strictly cash in hand, illegally of course.

These jobs are OK for a start but not full time really.

These are called "minijobs" in Germany. Anyone over 16 years old can have one. You can be paid up to max €400 per month without any deductions. It doesn't even need to be the same every month. The employer has to pay some standard contributions for tax, social insurance any pension - he pays around €125 for you to get the full €400. There used to be limitations on pay per hour or hours per week, but these are no more. If your employer thinks you are worth €400 an hour there's nothing to stop him paying you the full €400 for an hours work, just as he can pay you €2.50/hour for 160 hours a month. It's all down to negotiation.

The jobs are best suited to shop assistants, working mothers and part-time work.

The real problem is that it costs the employer shedloads more to pay you anymore on a more formal basis. For example, if you were to earn €500 a month in your hand you'd actually have to earn around €675 a month before deductions and the employer has over €200 to pay on top, so you cost him €875, almost twice as much. For this reason of inequality, most employers prefer to take on or three folks at €400 a month rather than one at €1200 (net)...

YL6

And what's with these 1€ jobs that were in the news last week?

The €1 jobs are part of the "reform" (Axe swinging really, but that's another thread) of the social security laws from January.

If you are long term unemployed (on the new Arbeitslosengeld II) then you can be required to work for a charity or local authority for which you will get paid €1 / hour on top of your benefits.

One trade union leader was quoted as that is too similar to compulsory work under Hitler.

The employers say that €1 is too high and it shoud be 50 cents an hour.

The discussion goes on to the whole issues about the cost of labour in its broadest sense.

Call me a fascist, but I like the idea.

Hi,

can anybody help, my wife has just got herself a part time job on the €400 basis. Her last pay packet came to exactly €400.

However a friend of ours has said that her employer must pay the Amt (don´t know which one) €50 and she can then only earn €350 per month max otherwise she will have have to pay tax. It´s no good asking her boss as he doesn´t know himself. Has anybody had any experience in this matter?

thanks

I'm not to sure of the exact details and I'm sure somebody will be able to give a more precise answer later, but I'm pretty sure your wife can earn her 400€ without any problems.

It is certainly true that the employer has to pay a "Pauschal" payment for social security etc. which I believe is 20% i.e. 40€, but the point is, the employer must pay this, not the employee.

yes, and you have to watch out for rat bastard employers who deduct this from the pay packet! this has happened a lot, as many people doing those jobs are too scared to complain...

I'm about to take on staff, and one option is the minijob. I'm 99.9% sure the employee pays NUFFIN extra.

I KNOW 100% that the employer pays

11 % extra social (sickness) security
12 % on pension costs
and 2 % tax

Thanks, you´ve been a great help

Tell us how you get on!

Hi Was wondering if anyone could help me out regarding 400 Euro jobs - I am wanting to know the following:
1)How many hours does one work for 400 Euro - is this fixed or does it depend on the firm - Is it usual for these jobs to get a schedule of the hours a month ahead of time or do most call on demand - any chance to get this type of job and negotiate the days and hours one would like to work - is this typical in Germany for this type of job or not at all? What in holidays does one get (if any at all)
2) Is the 400 Euro taxable?
3) Does the firm have to register you for social benefits - medical insurance ect or is it a flat 400 Euro payment
4) any comments on a 400 Euro job - anyone tried it out ?
Would appreciate any info
Thanks allot and have a great evening

Topics merged by admin

1)How many hours does one work for 400 Euro - is this fixed or does it depend on the firm
Could be 10 hours at €40 an hour, or 40 hours at €10 - just depends what you agree with the firm. I think you still get normal 1 month of holidays.

2) Is the 400 Euro taxable?
No. That is your takehome pay. But of course that is a maximum so you could also just do €200 a month. Depends what you agree.

3) Does the firm have to register you for social benefits - medical insurance ect or is it a flat 400 Euro payment
Yeah all has to be registered and so net cost to the firm of a 400 euro worker is something over 500 euros.

4) I once had a €400 job as a translator; friends of mine have had them throwing luggage at the airport. There's no typical €400 job. The most you could say is that they tend, by their nature, to be low-skilled and short-term, but that certainly isn't always the case.

Hi All,

I am trying to revive this old thread to get a better understanding

I am new here and I am working on a permanent basis (no issue here); my wife was not working at first, so got insured under my BKK insurance.

Now she is starting a collaboration with some media here, getting paid for each article.

here come the questions:

she is not making more than 400 hundred a month; does this alone qualify for a mini job, or do you need to declare it in advance ?

I mean, can she just go on and try to make as much as she can and then, at year end, see whether she is below 4800 and apply for the related taxation ?

How does her situation influence the possibility of having her insured with me, on my BKK ?

Thanks for ur replies

How is she being paid? Does she submit invoices or get a salary slip? A "minjob" is always agreed by employee and employer and declared as such. The employer simply pays fixed percentages of social and health insurance on top and the employee sees no deductions from their pay. Earning under €400/month (averaged over a calendar year) means your wife does not need to apply for her own health insurance and can be covered under yours. As soon as she exceeds a cent over the €400 average then she will have to pay 12-13% of her pay into her own health insurance (assuring public insurance) and may be liable for tax and social insurance.

This thread has been really informative. Thanks a lot. My apologies for the length of this.

I do have a few specific questions that I'm sure can't be that uncommon. Any similar experiences or any advice at all is greatly appreciated.

First off, I'm American, so these pertain to residency issues as well. I just started working part time at a very small family business. Friends of mine. As you can imagine this is all very informal. But since I'm American I need to get some type of visa. My American girlfriend has a nice job and we have been saying that she supports me (she pretty much does), but that's good for only a three-month extension.

First question: Can I just renew that every three months?

Yesterday the helpful man at the ausländerbehörde asked me if I wanted to work here, so I said sure, hoping I may be able to gain some legal residency status that would at least let me be here to look for work. Then he slid a form to me for my boss to fill out. Since my "job" is very informal and he's a friend, I really don't want to be a burden on him. If he has to jump through a bunch of hoops to prove I'm the only one that can do the job, or pay a bunch of new taxes because of me, I'd hate it... and it could even be the end of this casual gig I've got.

Second question: If we set up a minijob status, will he only be responsible for just over 100 euro in taxes a month? I already have private health coverage so I don't want him to pick up the tab for that. Also, how is this checked? Do they need proof of pay stubs?

Final question: Is a 400-euro minijob good enough for them to let an American live here? I know you need to have/make a certain amount of money and I don't know if that will cut it.

Thanks a ton for all info. Again, I'm sure there are other people that have been in the same boat.

Thank you YSL,

actually she is just starting, but it seems she will receive a fixed payment for each article (she is working for a news channel); after the first one, she has received a blue paper in two copies, where she was asked to choose between:

ich bin nicht umsatzsteurpflichtig
ich bin umsatzsteurpflichtig (and then provide her steurnummer)

we chose the first, hope this is OK for now.

I think the employer has already withdrawed a part of what she was entitled to have (i think around a 35%), but anyway she is below the threshold of 400€ / month

It may be that she has to draw a balance at year end and see whether she paid too much (or not enough) ?

bye

KAP

Quick question(s): Can non-EU citizens get a work/residency permit based on this type of job status? Does a (single) non-EU citizen have to prove greater earnings to attain a work/residency permit, or will this suffice? Or is it a case-by-case basis based on rent and other expenses?

Thanks for any info.

In case anyone was wondering... the 400 euro minijob is not enough to qualify for a work permit.

However, it apparently was in 2004 when I got mine...so it may just be depending on the person you ask, as most laws in this area seem to be.

I have been offered a 400 euro basis job with a company who I also do freelance work with. 10 hours a week would be covered by the mini job, and the rest I would continue to invoice them for. Is this legally possible?

It's legally possible, but doesn't offer either of you any advantage. In fact for them, it's a disadvantage, as it costs them around €525 to give you your €400 each month (the difference is paid in insurance and pension contributions), and anything YOU earn over that €400 will take you into a taxable bracket. If they simply paid you €400 against invoice then it only cost them €400, so they would save on the deal.

Thanks for the info, would part of this contribution (525) be towards my health insurance. I'm trying to get them to put all of my hours onto a contract as I think this will offer me more security longterm. Thinking of perhaps sugesting a pay cut in my freelance hourly rate to compensate the payments they will have to make. Good idea?

Do you actually have other clients? You can't be "freelance" if you only work for this one company.

personally I would be very surprised if it was legal to be an employee and a freelancer at the same time with the same company... I would think they'd go after the company for trying to get out of paying its full share of insurance contributions for an employee.

Thanks for your feedback, in the end the company felt it would benefit everyone if all of my work became contracted as they were really my sole client. Just waiting to sign the damn thing. It will be a relief to end the whole 'Freelance' charade and gain some security.

Hi everybody. I'm a German citizen who was born and raised in the United States. I've been in Germany for almost five years, first in Berlin and then in Munich, first working full-time and then as a student. I recently moved back to Berlin and got my CELTA certification, so I'll be looking for teaching work shortly. I don't have any work permit problems, obviously, but I need health insurance, preferably without going broke. "International" health insurance is not an option for me; I need "real" health insurance that actually does pay for things.

So my question is: Can I take a 400 EUR job and then do additional freelance work? Am I a freelancer then, or a part-time employee who works on the side, or what? Are employers willing to do this, or does the fact that you're making additional money (elsewhere) raise their costs and make it unattractive for them? How about for me - do I pay for the public health insurance based on my 400 EUR job, or based on my total salary? Do I just need to sort this out with an accountant?

Thanks!

Hepat: I tried to find the relevant regulations for your case online but unfortunately to no avail. However, within the logic of the public health insurance system I am pretty sure that your dues for public health insurance would at the end be computed from all your income, i.e. the income combined from the 401-EUR-job and whatever you earn on top of that as freelancer since as well for employees as for self-employed this is bascially the rule (with some exceptions for employees adding a 400-EUR job to their other, main job, granted).

It would not be fair to the community of members of the public health insurance in the reckoning of the lawmakers, if you would only be charged a min. premium on the mini- or midi-job and the rest of your income would be not "taxed" for the public health insurance as well. But don't take my word for it, since I have no black-and-white proof. You could probably go to the next AOK office and ask them to clarify this issue for you. Once you have the correct answer you might want to post it here, too. It is certainly relevant to many others as well...

Cheerio

Just wondered if anyone could shed a bit of light on this for me - I've just got a job working on a freelance basis for a company where I will invoice them for the hours worked. I'm only doing a few hours each week so will not be earning more than 400 Euros a month. My husband is working and I understand that he currently has my 'tax free allowance'. Am I likely to be taxed on the amount I earn or not? I seem to get different answers depending on who I ask so any advice gratefully received! Thanks.

I am no expert, but pretty sure it makes no difference even if your hubby earns €10M a year at Deutsche Bank. You can still have a €400 a month minijob. But the company must do the correct paperwork (its costs them like an extra €100 a month in taxes etc to employ a €400 bod) - so actually I don't think you even need to invoice them. You just work xx hours and they pay you accordingly based on the hourly rate agreed.

p.s. There is also a MIDI job for those earning €400 to €800 per month. Not quite so cool 'cos you pay more tax, but worth checking out as well.

JE knows his stuff. i earn my salary and have 400EUR job on top which is not taxed.

I know - the whole system sounds barking mad to me. I "think" even hubby on his €10M a year is allowed a minijob as well at €400 a month. Which is so crackers I hardly believe it.

Please can anyone confirm that I have understood the thread properly... I work part time and have also been offered a mini job by another employer. So this mini job for €400 will be tax free earnings?

Thanks!

Correct Querty.YL6has it all explained in great detail here.You work x amount of hours for € 400.Social deductions are paid by employer and employer only

It may not be directly taxable but it will still count toward your entire income (Gesammteinkommen) and can have a negative effect on your income tax return (Einkommensteuererklärung). Not even the Germans fully understand their tax system, it's the most complex in the entire western spiral arm of the galaxy. Couple that with the health insurance system, it's enough to make anyone sweat blood.

Thanks for the help!

I will hopefully be working in a 400Euro job soon.

A quick question without the jargon:

Do I then have to pay for the AOK for myself or does the employer take it on?

Confuzzled. Kate.

as far as I know it is the employer who has to pay the social welfare dues like health insurance etc. on top of your 400 EUR. The health insurance would be with the "Knappschaftskasse" though, if i am not mistaken, but that is only a minor difference...

Cheerio

Thank you.