Health insurance costs, how much do you pay?

Please tell me that's not 250€ per month! If it is, it's really expensive. But then again, if that's per year, it's really cheap. What's your insurance deal?

My employer gave me two options: 45€/month that didn't cover pregnancy or dental or 85€/month that covered both (I opted for that one). Am I getting ripped off? Or is it a good deal?

Jeeves searches for words and reaches for the wine bottle...
Sounds pretty good value to me.

My insurance in total is €250 a month, with half paid by the employer. So €125 a month then. Is that a rip off? What are other folks paying?

And I don't pay church tax.

for health insurance, for a bloke, that is normal i think. I used to pay 13% with SBK and now I'm private I pay € 200-odd which is less... but then I'm a girlie, and the policy I have gives me a 1300€ refund every year if I don't claim that much, plus they pay for glasses, sunglasses, massages, etc...

My insurance is 408€ per month. I'm female, and it's private insurance. My company pays almost half of that. They only pay 50% of the public insurance rate. Of course, that's expensive from my perspective(having worked for insurance companies most of my career and getting free or very cheap health insurance). But, what can you do?

Kitkat, that sounds exorbena.. exhorbin... exorbann... really expensive. I pay about €1000 per year for health insurance. Who are you with?

Insurance for females seems to be about 2-2.5 times more than that for males. She's only paying 200 per month (company pays the other half) while you say you're paying about 90. Sounds about right to me.

For private insurance females pay more than males for the same service. Fact.

I'm with Huk Coburg. They pay for everything(contact lenses, etc). I went to the doctor for my shin splints and he did an MRI(same day, amazing) and they paid for that too - 100%. So, I can't complain. I heard that they also pay for the lasik surgery for eyes - I have to check that out - life would be so much more convenient without contact lenses.

Plus, I was already 36 when I moved here so my, ahem, "advanced age" made it more expensive.

@ Jeeves
Females as a group (as opposed to the individual) don't pay more for the same service - they are sicker more often and for a longer period over their lifetime than males. That's the beancounter explanation (I'm a beancounter ahem).

It's the same reason why males and in particular young males pay more for car insurance - the companies pay out a lot more for their cover.

OK, so I am seriously getting ripped off. Can anyone beat 477 Euros per month? OK, so my employer pays half, but geez!

I claim the prize!!
€505,68 on my most recent wage slip.
I've resolved to look into private insurance when I get back from hols...

i don't know how to do it and don't have time to figure is out, but maybe someone can make a pole thingy with a range of prices for male/female insurace... i think it would be interesting...

i'm with dbv winterthur and pay €272 total (i.e. €136 myself) a month, i've never had occasion to make a claim off them yet, but there service looks proeety extensive...

In the short term Private is better if you are not planning in staying in Germany
for the restof your life. The problem arises when you retire, then Private costs
a fortune compared to the public health care...in relative terms private can cost
2000 euros a month when you are in your retirement!!

SO I will stick with public, as I plan to stay here very longggggggggggg!!!

I have expat health insurance with JBI Private Health Care for Expatriates based in the UK. I originally just took out 6mths but have now extended it. I only pay about 45 pounds (Euro 64) per month. Its cheap as chips! It works too, as I ran up over 1300 Euros a few months back when I was quite ill and seeing lots of different people and getting lots of prescriptions. They ended up paying about 1400 to me, so I actually gained 100 yoyos for me beer fund - Happy Days

I looked into getting health care here but the prices were horrific. If you are here for a couple of years or so and from the UK, I would highly recommend getting your insurance from the UK its much cheaper.

I am self employed and pay 260 a month, but I am hoping that it can be declaired against earnings... Anyone know?

I had arranged healthcare cover with bupa international before i moved out here from england. but when i got here they said that bupa would not be sufficient and i would need a german healthcare insurer. Does anyone know why this is, and if i can just go private, or is it only if the company offers it as an option? i am currently paying 104€a month , so 208€ altogether.
thanks

Bullshit. We're just not as reluctant to go as all you damn men are!

It's the fact that we can get pregnant, not that we get sick more often, that we have to pay more. As told to me by the insurers themselves.

Yep - pregnancy and all the bits required to get pregnant are quite high maintenance, so ladies cost more, simple as that.

I agree with showem. However, of the two insurances offered me by my employer, 45€/month or 85€/month, the latter included pregnancy coverage, but would cost the same if a guy opted for that company. I dunno, maybe my employer has some special deal with these companies, but there's definitely no difference between the cost for men vs. women here.

I've organised Irish Health insurance, which is about €1,000 a year, but the company doesn't want to pay their portion unless it confirms with the Sozialgesetzbuch V §257 und §61 Sozialgesetzbuch XI, and they can be found at
http://www.sozialgesetzbuch-bundessozialhi...h/sgbv/257.html

http://www.sozialgesetzbuch-bundessozialhi...h/sgbxi/61.html

anyone had this problem

Walker said:

What do you mean by "in relative terms". Would it cost 2000 a month in today's money or not? I thought that there was a law against them upping the cost by that much. I believe that a propportion of the insurance is paid into a regulated fund, so that the cost does not go up so exorbitantly when you are older.

Mine all comes out as a bit lump sum for Krankenversicherung, Pflegeversicherung, Rentenversicherung etc. Re. the pension insurance - is there any chance I'm going to see it ever again? Cos it's even more than my health insurance. I mean, I know nowt about how pensions work - is this money still mine or could it disappear into the German state coffers never to be seen again, whether I stay in Germany or not?

BTW, I am in Berlin now, but continue to look at TT for advice - it has yet to be beaten by any similar forum here oop North.

I'm brand new to this forum - American living here since 2001 - sure wish I had access to all this info back then.

Anyway... just to add a bit of interesting info - particularly for the ladies - regarding health insurance in germany and pregnancy/childcare etc. I just learned all this and it's a nightmare. Basically, if you are privately insured, you don't get any "mutterschaftsgeld" during your maternity leave. You would only get this if you fall below the salary level of 30K euro netto household. And no one I know below that level would be privately insured so it's an "oh brother". There are some other differences regarding pregnancy/birth/maternity leave/ and "Elternzeit" for Private vs. Public insureds so be sure to inform yourself through your insurance contract, your employer (HR dept.), and the laws. If you are privat insured and want to change to public you can only do so if you earn below a certain amount (i.e., you would have to go part-time if you are currently full time). Also very complicated re: whether child goes on your private insurance or your spouses public insurance (if he/she is on a different insurance).

I'm privately insured and chose to be because the care is so much better - I recently went into the hospital and got private room, excellent care etc. all 100% covered by DKV. Now given I pay 485 euro/mo but 1/2 paid by employer. My husband is public insured with AOK (the worst coverage and most expensive so he'll be changing) and he actually pays 590 euro/mo for crappy coverage and he is 4 years younger than me (I'm 37).

It's just awful over here re: childcare/daycare and insurances... no wonder germans aren't having kids!

Key point in this long winded text of mine: Get informed sooner than later!

I'm presently searching for private health insurance. What is the best way to start the search, esp. when my German is far from fluent?

Holy Crap, Sabine!
Thanks for that information. The topic of kids has been coming up a lot lately with my boyfriend and I as we want to buy a house(we both work and have good jobs(ie. > 70K year). I have had private insurance since I arrived here(in 2001) and my boyfriend just switched. Luckily, if(when) we have children, I have absolutely no desire to stay home with the little bugger for 3 years! 6 months is the maximum before my brain will probably turn into mush. Finding daycare/childcare etc is supposedly, a nightmare. I have one co-worker who has her mother-in-law taking care of her baby because no daycare will take him until he's 10 months old! With these stupid rules, it's no wonder that Germans 1) are not having children and 2) not buying houses. THEY CAN'T AFFORD TO DO BOTH! Seriously, we both make good incomes and we might have to make a choice between the two!

Why does AOK have the worst coverage? All the public insurances pretty much offer the same deal.
Thanks for letting us know how much your hubby is making BTW.
590/month wouldn't be bad at all if you had 4 children and were staying at home since all of you would be covered by his insurance.
And age doesn't have anything to do with how much you have to pay to the public insurance, unlike your private insurance contributions which will continue to rise every year.

Hi,
I'm a freelancer and therefore need a private health insurance, but as we have seen here.. MAN are they expensive! Haven't found any under €250,- a month, NOT including dental.
In another forum session about health care many people posted info on their insurances, and made my mouth water with stories about not paying more than €80,- a month including everything.. ausländer versicherung with DKV, some Global Health scheme.. I checked it all out but they do not insure for these prices.
Does anyone know more? Or am I really f#ed and need to pay 250 a month...?

I hate to get all negative on ya, but I think my fabulous deal of all-inclusive 85 EUR is due to a great group plan deal my institute gets. From the rest of this thread, I don't think it's very common.

Try www.expacare.com...they are UK based. The claim form is a bit of a hassle, but their coverage overall is pretty good. I pay 130 € a month for full coverage (including dental)...zero deductible except 50 pounds a year for the dental.

Also they do not cover routine examinations...plus 2 year wait on pre-existing conditions.

our family pays 890 euros for husband, wife and two small children. We know this is a gross amount to pay but we do it without much choice. My question is why do the docs send us bills instead of billing the insurance company? we just paid our insurance then got a bill for another 100 euro from the doc, we paid it but shouldn't that just go to the insurance company?

Is that private or public insurance you got there hockeywidow?

My private works like this

Bill arrives from Dr
I post bill onto insurance instructing them to pay me
Once I've been paid, I pay the Dr

The flexibility is that you can choose to claim or not claim certain bills

P

private insurance.

why would you not want to claim a bill?

You might not want to send in the bill to the private insurance company, because they usually give you money/bonus back if you don't lay a claim (send bill back) for a full year or more. The amount or bonus gets larger as the time duration without a claim gets larger. So it could turn out to be an advantage not to send in a claim knowing that at the end of the year you'll get a bonus back from the insurer.

Not sure if I posted this before, I pay 310€ per month (employer pays half) at DKV (AM0/ZM3/SM7/R10) for a premium/comprehensive package. No complaints so far..

Also, if you're looking only at current monthly rates and coverage now Huk Coburg is cheaper. Actually they are the best. But in the longer haul Huk tends to increase their monthly fees substantially. DKV doesn't as much.

Well I pay somehwere in the neighbourhood of 400 € with employer also paying half. My biggest gripe is that I was on private insurance like my husband until I recently got a job and then was told you HAVE to be on the public Kasse. The cost for the public insurance is far MORE than what we were paying for private and now I am on a different plan than my husband...surely spouses should be allowed to be insured together???!!!

More importantly after a stint in the hospital this week it is clear that there is a HUGE difference between treatment and accommodation between public and private patients. I was stuck in a sad little room with two beds end to end because it was so narrow...toilet outside the room shared by the entire ward. When Tom had his knee surgery his room was better than some hotels we have stayed at. Private room with balcony and private shower...soaps, towels, etc provided. I really don't get why they want the employer and employee to pay MORE when I could have stayed on my private insurance happily without employer contributions.

About sending the bills...with private insurance we send the bills direct to insurance with instructions to pay doctor directly by bank transfer (the preferred German method) that way we don't have to get involved in the payment side of things. The only drawback is that our insurance company is very slow in processing and sometimes you get a Mahnung. If you are ok to ignore them knowing that your claim is being processed then it's not a problem (our company has an online function that allows you to check progress of claims). Doctors bills will always come to you directly as far as I am aware...and you will notice you will get separate bills for just about everything.

Privately insured patients usually get considerably better service and treatment than those in the public system. The contribution to the public system is based on income, so if you earn little, you pay little. On average, the contributions to the public system are therefore much lower than those for the private system. If you earn a decent salary (i.e. pay more than the average contribution), you may end up paying more for public than for private insurance, especially if you are young. However, as you grow older, the contributions to private insurance tend to go up, whereas the public system has nothing to do with your age (and if you retire on a low pension, your contributions to the public system will be low, whereas the private insurer may charge you large sums of money).

What confuses me about your statement is this: 400 Euro per month is not particularly high for a woman in a comprehensive private health plan. I pay roughly 300 Euro as a man, and I understand that the rates for women are about 30 % higher, which would imply roughly 400 Euros as well. In that sense, what you are paying now does not sound excessive. Was your previous private insurer really considerably cheaper than that?

My private insurance price for next year just went down, as I have been basically claim free for 2 years. I have a 250 Deductible a year, and if I make no claims outside of my normal yearly physical, I get that money back. My insurance rewards you for being healthy and responsible.
I was public (freiwillig with Barmer's) and paid about 250 a month more than I do for Private. And the better treatment I get in offices is unbelievable. Last month I was at the Doc for my yearly check up, and the waiting room was full, and I arrived and sat down, as he was finished with the last patient I was the next one taken in, and he spent alot of time with me, because I am private. Since I changed to Private, I seriously don't wait for appointments and get in when I really need to.

Yes considerably cheaper. Granted it was an international insurance that does not cover all the same things that the public does such as routine check-ups or dental but those things are not a concern to me. The emergency and hospital coverage is way better. I just don't get why you don't have a choice just because you are earning less. 12 - 14% of your salary which is what most cost is a pretty large chunk when you aren't earning that much to begin with.

I pay 96 euros a month, with bupa international ...I've never had to make a claim...but at least they speak english! ...very friendly, etc.

I have their top plan, which covers freakin' everything...

Yes that is who we are/were with. Mine was more than that as pointed out that women pay more...but still considerably cheaper than what I now pay.

One of the reasons why international insurers like BUPA are so much cheaper is because they offer short-term contracts (usually 12 months). The German public health system works on the assumption that you'll be part of it your whole life, and that the young subsidize the old (because older people are obviously particularly costly; I think I've read somewhere that a 70 year old typically has about 3-5 times the medical expenses of a 35 year old). Doesn't help you if you don't intend to stay here your whole life, but that's the way it is... The German private insurers also to some extent charge higher premiums than necessary for young people which they then "reserve" for later when these same insured get older (because the German private health insurance system is also a long-term one and does not work on a 12 month contract basis).

The problem with private health care is they price it on age, the older you are the more it costs. Friends of ours (age 52) is sick leave and at age 55 will be retired and they pay 500€ a month each plus 1500€ each deductible, or 1250 per month total. Karen is now working so she was (or will be not sure) able to join the public system.

The other problem with private health care if you can't afford the premiums you lose your cover and you can't join the public system unless you fill for bankruptcy.

I looked at private but considering that we are planning on retiring here private doesn't make any sense. Although AOK is considered the poor mans choice I find that it is head and shoulders above what you get in Canada, particular for the working poor. Finding a family doc is almost impossible in Ontario and OHIP (Ontario Health Insurance Plan) does not offer dental or prescription coverage. The only real negative is that certain specialists can be hard to come. But that is true pretty much anywhere.

As to health care being cheap or expensive that is really relative, I look at the take home amount and 70% of the gross is quite reasonable for the wage Chris earns.

tom_a: bupa international has a MINIMUM of a 12-month contract...so, I don't see how it's short-term, really. but anyways...it doesn't cover vision or dental, I'm not most german private insurers DO...

I may be mistaken, but the way it got explained to me is that the premiums of BUPA and other international expat insurers are calculated on a yearly basis (though the contract itself may of course be extended), i.e. nothing of what you pay now is set aside for later years. Whereas German private insurers are required by law to set aside certain parts of your premium payments for the time when you are older. That makes the two systems a little hard to compare. But for someone who's only here for a few years, I'd say he's definitely better off with a BUPA policy, as he won't use the German system long enough to profit from it eventually.

I'm not sure about the BUPA contract...we had (well hubby still has) Lifeline Gold...as I was working and then not and then now working again I was on it and off it twice now without incident and no contract mentioned. They just add you when you need it and cancel you when you don't. However, hubby has stayed with them all along so perhaps that is something to do with it.

I don't plan on being here long enough to benefit from whatever it is you are talking about but the thing that gets me is the fact that you are not given a choice especially when most people would normally want to be insured with their spouse (makes managing money bill payment etc easier).

The premium I was paying is significantly less and the treatment was way better. I made it through a broken ankle on BUPA this year and had no problems whatsoever. Tom had surgery at a place that only takes private patients If he did not have private insurance (like if he did not earn enough), who knows what state his knee would be in now. I found a good doc recently only to be told that come Jan 1 she is only taking private patients. If the German public Kasse is so great, why do all want to avoid it??? Docs even have those posters hanging in their offices with the cartoon depicting the Kasse or government or whoever taking money from them...don't know if anyone has seen them. It is how they explain the 10 euro charge.

I pay 246 per month myself, as I'm self-employed andon of my kids is included. Was the cheapest what we found and the fastest to answer enquiries.

I am privately insured and pay almost €300 per month. I am a she-dragon. I pay it all. The bf is also privately insured and older than me. He really earns a lot more than me. He pays only €200 per month. But he is a he and I am a she and shes pay more than hes because shes can fall pregnant.

Shes between the age of 30 and 40 however hardly ever still get fixed employment because shes can fall pregnant and hes can't, so shes are left to work freelance. This means that shes have no security, paid holidays, help in paying high bills or health insurance. This once again implies that shes can basically forget about financing a child on their own, meaning that motherhood basically gets excluded after all, but shes still have to pay that much insurance because of the possiblity that shes might still somehow fall pregnant. It's as simple as that.

I (male, freelancer) pay about 200 a month with everything covered worlwide and a possibility to stay in the German healthcare system. that is if I stay here longer.
Zahn insurance 08341-2733 ask for Barbara. She speaks English.