Apple iPhone (news, info, general chat)

Not exactly true... from what I'm reading, they are trying to have it more along the line with previous iPods: Passive data viewers. They removed the ability to add calendar items in a special version of software.

Hopefuly that isn't how the final will be, but that's what current reports say.

Orange to sell unlocked iPhones in France

Well, I just went down to the T-Mobile shop and had a play on one of these. I don't know what to say, except I'm completely blown away by it. I'm no Apple fan boy either, I own no Apple gear at all, but this phone is fecking amazing.

Apple are just seriously good at making user interfaces. Their design is awesome, and it's so usable. It's like no other touch screen I've ever used before, it actually works like it should. It looks good as well and is seriously a killer device. I was initially thinking that the 480x320px screen would not be enough, but it's sharp and look brilliant. I surfed a few websites - even when zoomed right out they are readable and rendered just like on a normal screen. It's a real shame about the few downsides it has (locked to T-Mobile, slow connection through EDGE, pretty crappy camera, not able to run 3rd party applications that Apple don't approve of).

I'm very tempted to get one but I think I'll hold off a little more. In any case, this phone actually lives up to the hype in my opinion.

Try an Apple computer, and you'll be a total convert,

I've used Apple computers quite a bit, but they have the same disadvantage as Linux - not being able to run Windows games. If I was willing to live with this, then I'd just use Linux on my main PC, but I'm not so I run XP/Vista. The rest of the Mac OS features don't impress me so much. Although the Mac Pro's are excellent machines, very well built. If I was looking for a laptop and had the money, I would definitely buy one - and then install Windows on it

There are some rumours that there will be a 3G iPhone early next year. If they bring this out, I think that will tip the scales and I'll go get one.

For those that would like more options/freedom in their phone (Software/Carriers/Features), yet want something along the lines
of the dredded iPhone, have a look at the new HTC "Touch Cruise". Better hardware than the iPhone, Use any WM5/6 Software you want,
Unlocked, and ready to go.. (Or via a carrier if you wish, With Free Unlock avail. on the PDA Forums)

Update:2nd Story Link With Video, HTC Specs Link

There are currently 3 models of "Touch" devices (Touch,Touch Dual, Touch Cruise). check the HTC link above to see more.

Update 2:
As Reported by O2, UK and Apple. - Link


And as part of the contract with Apple, the carriers will (are required) "Brick" your iPhone should you want to change carriers after the initial contract is up.
With this and all the other conditions/restrictions with the iPhone, I'll be staying away from this thing.

The Samsung QBowl is supposed to be a competitor for the iPhone.

QBowl promo video



I had a go on one in the Vodafone shop earlier today, and it's nowhere near as impressive as the iPhone.

O2 are releasing it as the XDA Orbit 2 from the start of next month. I'm due an upgrade, not sure whether to go with this or the soon to be announced (Wednesday @13:00) Nokia N82. Leaning towards the Nokia but it's a bit of an ugly beast, have had an XDA for the past few years and the touchscreen is cumbersome for typing and WM5 is just not very fluid and has a lot of memory leaks. Plus another thing against the Orbit will be that it will come with a German version of the OS with no option for English (unless localisation has been implemented in WM6?)

@Jester
All new HTC devices now come with WM6. As far as an English ROM ver. you can bet that once this thing hits the streets
the PDA modders will have an English ROM avail. for you. People that buy the device from HTC or another dealer (Not Carrier)
also have access to HTC's ROM Download site, and can get you any language you want (Usually 5-6 languages).

I'm aware of this. I've always done this with the XDA's but there is usually a bit of a wait before the hackers get access to the device. In saying that I must have a look at XDAdevelopers to see what's happening, haven't been there in a long time so it may already be done! Have you played with WM6, how does it compare to WM5? Not a big fan of WM5, too many leaks and a poor interface but 2 very nice little apps. from Wisbar sorted that out!

WM6 is a big Improvement and with the hacks/mods that are avail. you can change/add almost anything you want.. Unlike the iPhone

I thought the same was of the iPhone with hacks it could run nearly anything?

To bad there isn't much 3rd party iPhone software, Remember the iPhone runs a modified ver. of OSX
WM5/6 have literally thousands of applications, a much larger 3rd party market, and have been established for years.

Is all the discussion of hacking significant only because it means not being tied to any one network, or is it also because the iPhone only has add-on webapps, meaning any games and widgets and things always use airtime? I find it strange that they don't even include something silly like solitaire (which IS on the iPod).

More to do with being able to write applications for it. They haven't released any SDK for it yet.

Google released their Android platform yesterday which should be a nice alternative to the existing mobile platforms, if it takes off. I wonder if that will give Apple some incentive to make their SDK useful.

With what I hear is a fully functional web browser, surely one can play any number of games on the iphone? If I was ever to develop something to use on my windows mobile phone, I'd probably just create a web app on my server.

This HTC phone really doesn't look anywhere near as good as the iPhone. It's features seem better, but Apple really have the user interface down, and I doubt any other phone/pda software comes close. That phone also has a much smaller screen. I'd be interested to see it, but go check out the iPhone yourself, it's freaking excellent. I will buy it straight away once it is has a UMTS chip in it.

Well since it runs WM6 you can use 3rd party apps to make the interface look/act exactly like the iPhone..
Have a google about and you'll see what I'm talking about.. At last check there were 3-4 different iPhone
skin/interface mods for WM devices..

@Fribble
hacking is required on the iPhone to do ANYTHING (3rd party Web Apps, Different Carrier, etc) because
apple locked down the phone and doesn't want anybody messing with their $ flow or that of the carriers
(which funnel monthly $ back to apple depending on how much iphone users download)

That's right but, as Darkknight alluded to, you have to be online to play. So, if you're somewhere without a good web connection, or travelling on a train, get bored and feel like playing a little bejeweled or mine sweeper, you're out of luck.

The way it was explained to me, you get to ride on all T-mobile hotspots for "free" as long as you buy the data package, and of course if you log on at home, it's free. But I don't know whether that means an unlimited connection (provided you don't download) at the hotspots, or whether there is a cap on the number of hours you get.

Nope, The data package includes a certain amount of MB's (via GPRS) and a few hrs. of WLAN.
Once you go over your limit they will slow your connections down (Even slower than GPRS) and will
charge you a fortune. This is not just for the iPhone , but for all of their data plans.

Well, that's really quite nasty. Do you know whether that also applies if you are on a non T-mobile network, ie at a private residence and logged onto their network?

If you are logged into a Private/free/open WLAN Access point then it does not apply.
When you use T-Mobile Hotspots you must login with your account details, or provide
your phone # and they will SMS you the temp. login details. Thus they can track you.

The skin isn't what I'm talking about. Have a look at the user interface and the way that the iPhone operates. They have clearly spent lots of time researching how to do this, and they do it extremely well. Putting a skin on a WM6 device isn't going to come close.


For the iPhone data plan this isn't true. There is no limit in time or data on any of the plans over the WLAN or the EDGE network. However, they do slow your connection down to 64kbit down/16kbit up (pathetically slow) after 200MB on the M plan, 1000MB on the L plan and 5000MB on the XL plan.

By reading hte T-Mobile site, it seems as though the downloads from WLAN are included in this figure, but I find it hard to believe they'd be throttling a WLAN connection.

There is no way you can get charged a fortune for data though, because even though they'll slow you down, it is none the less unlimited.

I suggest if you haven't seen this iPhone that you go have a look. It is seriously good. I also don't like the fact you can't install 3rd party applications on it, or that it's hooked to T-Mobile or that it's EDGE, but none the less, it is a really well designed piece of equipment.

They will slow your connection/charge you for every MB (Or Hour), over your allowed packages limits.
If you are using a T-Mobile Hotspot (WLAN) then yes it is possible they can throttle you. Its very easy to
do and all the Enterprise claa WLAN hardware can do it.

If your willing to pay up to 1Eur per MB over your limit, then yes its "Unlimited".
If you do some goog searching you will find the exact comments from the TCOM
Head guy, (Think it was Engadget or Slashdot) Its the same iphone/carrier contract
that AT&T,O2,Orange and DT have signed, so why would DT's contract deals be any different.

The WM skins, and 3rd party apps avail. will make any WM device work/act exactly like an iPhone,
Software slider and all.. The User Interface is the exact same as the iPhone, only the hardware is different.

Just to re-open this debate I now have an iphone, and say what you like about it - I think it's the dog's bollocks.

Ummm... so does that mean you like it, or not?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=dogs+bollocks
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bollocks

Congrats.. I still say its just plain Bollocks..

I say it's just a phone - with an iPod built in. Works very well for what I need - has the map thing which is very handy for me (the N95 sat nav is useless in London in my experience), and O2 do it on a tariff that includes unlimited data usage which is also nice. So far so good I must say.

Jimbo - I am interested, but can you 100% guarantee that I will become an instant overnight chick magnet once I have invested?

Or could I achieve the same effect by purchasing the cheaper iTouch and holding THAT to my ear in the pub to make fake conversations and achieve the same?

Frankly I need all the help I can get and hoping this might be the solution (I have tried all the pheromone sprays etc already before you ask)

I got a blow job on the train this morning, but it was from a 19 year old computer programming student called 'Mike'. Still - better than nothing. iTouch looks the same from the front, but is quite a bit thinner. And doesn't ring.

Do the WM devices have the multi-touch stuff too then?

Prob. not.. But when looking at what programs the iPhone can run, compared to a WM device, I'll take the WM device over the iPhone anyday..
The iPhone is just way to restricted in both technology, and software.

Frankly Jimbo I am absolutely disgusted by your actions. Do you have no shame?

p.s. Does "Mike" usually catch the 7.53 or the 8.12 to Liverpool Street?

Depends on the lectures, but normally the 8:12 - he sits in the second carriage. I had to bribe the ticket inspector with a blow job to let him ride first class with me.

Just play your mp3s really loud. Everyone will assume it's one of those annoying ring tones.

(Works best if you listen to shite like Timbaland and Fergie.)

From what I understand, they are releasing a Dev Kit in Feb for native apps.

So how can WM with an iPhone skin be exactly the same if it doesn't have one of the main features, the multi-touch stuff? I was playing with one a few weeks ago in the UK and it would not have been the same without the multi-touch.

Even so, how restricted will Apple make such an SDK? What (If Any) Limits will they place on the oftware and developers?
Even with the SDK coming out in 3-4 months, WM devices have been around for atleast the last 4-5 years. They already have
a large headstart and over 500k programs to back it up. When the SDK is released, how long do you think it will take the iPhone
to have the same amount of programs and developers to equal WM devices? I'm guessing atleast 4-5 Years.. Are you really willing
to wait all that time just to use an iphone with software that has been avail. to the rest of the PDA devices for over 5 years?

I'm not, and nor are many others. Why wait when you can have a device with better hardware, and a huge selection of
applications NOW, and more than likly cheaper than an iPhone. (Unlocked even.. No constant hacks required)

I'm not saying the iPhone is not currently restricted, that is apparently clear. I'm merely saying it's NOT the same as a WM device with a skin on it, despite you claiming it is.

Darkknight, I've seen your other posts also with regards to Apple things, and I've seen the general disdain. I know I will not convince you, that's fine.

The fact is, ‘techy’ people usually hate Apple stuff because they don’t really “get it�. To them, wresting with computers and technology is fun and a challenge. But to everyone else, it is simply a hassle. The fact is, there are plenty of phones with more features than the iPhone, but if the user experience is worse, who cares what bells and whistles are on it? In other words, if your phone has a feature, but isn’t usable in any practical sense.. it functionally doesn’t exist for most people.

I know how it is, I’m a nerd too… but the above paragraph was something I realized a long time ago… when I realized that for some reason I thought it was ok to sneer at people taking their PC to a technician to be fixed… but went to a mechanic when the ‘check engine’ light came on.

The fact is, things like phones, computers, and PDAs are a tool to accomplish the tasks of life. If a certain phone is easier to use, more reliable, and makes those tasks easier, people will be much more willing to buy that, even at a premium. This is where apple reigns supreme, because it accomplishes these tasks by strictly controlling the environment, which irks ‘Linuxy’ people.

I did not buy an iPhone as I’d really like to wait for one with GPS for motorcycle trips. However, when you place it next to other phones, such as the N95, the iPhone just seems like it fell out of an alien space ship. In comparison to the typical attitude of ‘just increase the specs’ seen in other ‘high end’ phones it is years ahead.

thefirelane hit the nail on the head - for me this phone has great functionality and is wrapped in a slick looking unit, which offers the stuff I want it to - I have no idea what all this PDA stuff is you're talking about, nor do I care. The phone already does what I want - I don't want any 'apps' on it at all - I want music, a camera (rarely) and the ability to call and SMS people. And that's it. I have a PDA too - and I don't want any apps on that either to be honest...

Got my iphone last week as a US import, stung by the zolllamt a bit but still worked out about 430euro all in without any contract.
Device is bloody amazing and seems to be a good selection of apps available which are easily installed.
Everyone who has seen mine or played with it the last week wants one, and there selling on ebay.de for 900euros now, crazy.

I realise it's easy to do, I just don't know why they would do it specifically for iPhone customers when they don't do it for the others.

I cannot see anywhere on the T-Mobile site where it says that you get charged for excess downloads. They say unlimited and state the speed limits after the amounts mentioned in my previous post. If you have specific information about it, post a link, cause if they really do charge you the plans they are advertising would be very misleading.

Hutcho - O2 England are offering pretty much exactly what T-Mobile Germany are - pay for calls and texts, but data is free - which is what Apple want, coz you can download from iTunes direct to the phone and they want to encourage you to do so, not put you off.

From all info I've seen from both O2 and T-Mobile. Data is NOT "Free".. You have a certain amount of traffic per month depending on your contract.
If you go over that limit they will slow your connection down and charge you out the ass for ever MB after your limit.

If you like the simple interface, Lock-ed in nature, no 3rd party applications, and 400 Eur price then by all means get the iPhone.
I'm just pointing out there are much better (And cheaper) devices avail. whether they are WM device or not.

That's not right for English O2 - all data is free and there are no limits - quite clearly stated in the contract:


Straight from O2's site.

Its still not "Free".. Its included in your monthly bill..

Well fuck me. They CHARGE me for this shit?? Jesus - I'm going back to my PDA/WMD which was entirely free for everything.

Can anyone figure for me - if I order one of these things "online" does it come automatically with a new phone number 'cos I obviously wanna use my old Vodafone number? So do I order and then switch or er...what?

It says:

<h5 class="faq_question"> Kann ich meine bisherige Mobilfunknummer weiter nutzen? </h5> Ja, natürlich. Möchten Sie von einem anderen Anbieter zu T-Mobile wechseln, finden Sie hier eine Anleitung (PDF), wie Sie Ihre Mobilfunknummer mit zu T-Mobile nehmen können.

But cannot figure if I need to send the PDF with my order, after my order, before my order - or must I go to a shop probably to switch?