Hospital maternity statistics for Munich

The advantage of a clinic is the choice - you can always have a natural birth with candles and aromatherapy in a clinic (now at least) but you can't have an emergency c-section at home.

Don't you dare accuse me of lying. Just because you are so dead set against the idea doesn't mean that its not possible. Go and look it up. The studies all point to the fact that home births are just as safe as hospital births for a normal pregnancy.

No - I am not against home births. There are many women out there who are very aware of their bodies and with a clean bill of health who want to and why shouldn't they.
What I have a problem with is someone saying if you have a normal pregnancy then it's better to give birth at home. That is a lie. Or, to phrase it better, a poor generalization. A healthy, uncomplicated pregnancy is no guarantee for an uncomplicated and safe birth. Not a risk everyone wants to or should take. Fine if it worked for you, accept that it is probably not the avenue of choice for others instead of pushing it. I have given birth, if I had to do it again I know from direct experience where I would rather be. And what facilities I would want around for my baby. And that they had low c-section and dammschnitt rates.

Take this for instance:

Have the last word, Sim.
Showem, there is a check up center for babies and mothers on Bayernplatz (or there was the last baby I had), if I can manage to swing by before Saturday I will see if they have any better info for you.

Why is it a lie? Give me something to prove otherwise other than your opinion. Nothing in this world is a guarantee but going into hospital doesn't mean you will have an uncomplicated birth or that things will be any better in the end for you because you are there.

I can keep posting reports all day long about this to show that home births are as safe if not safer than hospital births for a normal healthy pregnancy. You don't think I've done my homework on this?
By god I have. I was dead set against my girlfriend giving birth at home because I was worried something might go wrong. I have read so much on this topic already so I will tell you again, I am not lying, whatever you may think.

showem, firstly, many congratulations!

as everyone else here seems to be adding their tuppenceworth, i'll add mine, since my wife and i have less than 6 weeks left until our little bundle of joy is due to make an appearance.

we've just been on a weekend birth preparation course here in erding with a midwife. concering caesarians, she said that the sole reason for performing this operation (certainly in erding hospital) is that the health of the child or the mother is in danger due to continuing with a natural birth procedure or that the baby is in a breech position which could lead to such danger or complications.

your frauenarzt will keep you informed during your preganancy of any concerns about the birth due to multiple factors. i've been to all but one of my wife's appointments with her doctor and they are well aware in advance of whether there could be complications so you will be well informed and hav etime to make decisions. luckily all has gone and continues to go well and the baby is now in the correct position.

funnily enough, a friend of ours had a caesarian on tuesday last week (a few hours after we'd met her at the frauenarzt) as the baby was in a breech position and coming up for 2 weeks overdue. they are now the proud and happy parents of a baby girl who weighed in at, get this, 4.8kgs!!

so, enjoy your pregancy for all it's worth, it's a magical time. get in touch with midwives earlier rather than later as they can provide invaluable information in advance and really help you through the pregancy. the doctor, whilst very effective and friendly, isn't going to give you half an hour to chat about this, that and the other, the midwife will. it will also give you a chance to check some out and find one that you get on with.

Normally, I would not jump into these types of conversations because I do not have kids, never given birth, and never been pregnant, but...


My sister probably had the easiest pregnancy recorded by any woman anywhere. She was healthy, worked out up until the day she popped out my nephew, etc, etc. However, she had major complications while giving birth (lost tons of blood, etc) and was damn lucky that she was in the hospital and not in her freaking house because she probably would not have survived what she went through.

I just vacationed last week with a friend who has two children and had two of the worst pregnancies ever 'most miserable 18 months of my life!' and then popped out each kid in under 3 hours, no complications whatsoever.

So, DDBug is right - you just don't know what will happen - and do you want to take that risk (having a kid at home)?

Yes, we took that "risk" and had 2 kids at home. So frankly as you admitted you don't know what you are talking about. Shall I post stories of the things that have gone wrong with pregnancies in hospitals?
Or where babies have been mixed up after being taken away from the mother. But you just don't know what will happen, eh? Or kids that have been stolen from hospitals? It can and it does happen. Would you take that risk?
How about MRSA in hospitals? Bloody risky world out there if you ask me. Wrap up in cotton wool and stay at home. Best way.

If I owned a house and didn't live in a city where the entire neighborhood would have been aware that I was giving birth in the middle of the night, I might have considered home birth.

As it was, out of consideration for my neighbors, as well as feeling comfortable that the clinic I chose was supportive of natural childbirth, I chose not to have a home birth.

There are a lot of good reasons NOT to have a home birth, probably at least as many good reasons as to have one.

I think its important like Showem is doing to get as much information about what is best for each person. I have never had children, but I do lean towards a home birth with a trained midwife (got a few in the family) and I would feel very comfortable with them. In my Home province of Manitoba they have changed birthing alot, they have rooms like your own bedroom, midwives on call and delivery nurses (two different training courses in Manitoba- and both need a license) in the hospitals- like best of both worlds. My best friend back home had a premie- 3 months early, and they couldn't take him home til they could spend a night alone with him at the hospital, they have a special room set up for the parents to sleep like at home with the baby. The hospital wants to make sure baby and parent are ready for this.
I have had lots of my girlfriends with bad experiences at hospitals with the precare, delivery and post care, and lots with great experiences. I think every person has to do what is best for them.

Hi, sorry my link didn't work..here is the portion of the ariticle.

There were 1457 consecutive patients delivered of a singleton fetus in cephalic presentation beyond the 34th week of gestation at the I. Frauenklinik, Ludwig-Maximilians University, Munich between May 1999 and June 2000. The 257 patients (17.6%), who underwent cesarean section prior to or during labor, were excluded from the study. Of the 1200 vaginal deliveries, 1017 (84.8%) were normal spontaneous deliveries, while 183 (15.2%) were instrumentally assisted.

I suppose, being a L&D nurse, I am somewhat biased. I have seen what should have been "normal" deliveries go awry-shoulder dystocia(baby is big and the shoulders get stuck), postpartum hemorrhage, just to name a few bad scenarios. These are things that sometimes can't be predicted. Even an ultrasound can be off as far as the definitive weight of a baby. Times like these, I am very thankful that I am in an area where there are lots of trained "hands" and an OR available, if needed. A birthing center in close proximity to a hospital with an OR is ideal. I work daily with midwives, and they are fantastic. They are very "hands on" and allow you to labor in whatever way suits you-as long as you and your baby are both safe.

I did find the midwives to be very encouraging of all sorts of ways to be active in labor - kneeling, taking a bath, leaning, etc. the wierdest one was when they told me to hold onto this rope hanging from the ceiling and to let my self hang from it (wtf! I weighed almost 200 pounds and was fcking exhausted from 20 hours of labor, my arms were not doing that!) and they accepted that for most of the time I was most comfortable on my side with one leg in the air (don't ask).
However, as much as you might be tempted to do so, do not quack like a duck. They did not find that method of dealing with contractions very amusing.

I was one of those who had a normal pregnancy - worked until seven the night I went into labour...waters broke ten thirty...contractions two minutes apart from beginning and by the time I got to the midwife an hour later was already fully dialated - and pushed and pushed. I was doing the water birth thing and determined to do so as naturally as possible. But normal and texbook turned sour - that is the reality. I do think homebirths are wonderful as long as there is an emergency plan as well with quick and easy route to a hospital. The fact is that midwives cannot perform c-sections so if the baby needs to come out quickly then a Gynae needs to take over. Home births are great as long as everything is going well - but you are in real poo if things go wrong. My daughter's father still calls midwives 'Witchdoctors' (unfairly of course) as my experience scared the hell out of him! He honestly thought the baby and I would die. As I said above things DO and CAN go wrong and you need to be prepared if you are having a home birth - thats all.

DDBUG, you made me smile with your description of your labor-although I am sure you were not feeling much like smiling yourself at the time. We sometimes use a towel and play tug-of-war with it to get laboring moms to bear down. At times like that, I hope the patient hasn't been working out at the gym prior to her delivery

I was talking with Sleepless last night and realised the best reason for me (not necessarily anyone else) not to have a home birth. I live up 5 flights of stairs with no elevator. If it did turn out I needed to go to the hospital, it would mean either me walking down 5 flights of stairs deep in labour, getting scuttle-bumped down on a stretcher or getting craned from out a window. In December. Even he agreed that was a pretty good reason.

Anyways, I still don't have my hands on the statistics, but I do have a few good leads, just have to follow them up.

I wondered what you guys were stood there chortling about - now I know
yeah, I reckon that's a pretty good reason

Actually, we chortled over a few different things, but yeah, the idea of waddling down the stairs with a head about to pop out did give us a good laugh.

I dunno - I've heard of women being sent to climb stairs to speed up the delivery
(I would have slapped anyone who suggested that to me though)

A friend of mine had an "emergency" c-section at the Maisstrasse clinic. Because it's such an old building, apparently they have no lift from the patient rooms, where she had been laboring, to the surgical suite.

She had to walk up the stairs to the next floor for her c-section. The nurses kindly asked her if she needed assistance, though!

Hi Showem, I'm late to the thread, I was on vacation when it was started and only just now noticed. Anyway, a few thoughts, although you've probably made up your mind by now!

Most of the hospitals seem to offer information evenings around their labour/delivery services...presumably they would also divulge c-section rates at those. Also you can schedule a "Vorstellung zur Geburt" (at least the Frauenklinik vom Roten Kreuz in Taxisstr. where I delivered, I think other hospitals offer this too) -- an interview with a doctor at the hospital where you tell them your wishes about things like an epidural (PDA in German), enema, using the bathtub, having a c-section etc.

My impression corresponds with others on the thread that Germany is much more conservative about c-sections than the US. One friend had an extremely difficult time giving birth to her son but didn't want a c-section. The doctors respected her wishes and she managed to deliver vaginally, but only with a midwife literally sitting on her stomach pushing, and a doctor using some sort of instrument and pulling, and a big episiotomy. She did have complications afterwards, so in retrospect thought a c-section might have been a better option.

My tip for labour is -- try the bathtub if your hospital has one! It really does help, especially if you are trying to avoid meds.

Also, i did the pre-birth acupuncture and my labour wasn't too bad -- not sure if it helped, but hey, it probably doesn't hut anything, and if it does shorten labour by a couple of hours its well worth it.

Also, perhaps more important than c-sections rates is whether the clinic has a neonatal unit ON SITE. Another friend's little girl had some initial problems and they wanted to observe her. Her hospital transferred the baby over to a nearby children's hospital and sent her home the day of the birth! She didn't get to go with the baby, as they had implied during the infoabend, and it was very stressful for her.

The info at the clinic really is more important than the stats.
I was interessted in Großhadern as my friend is a nurse there. Their c-section rates are high, but the doctor explained that was because they had most of the emergancy births. Including multiple births.
Are you expecting twins
But at the end of the day the clinic's job is to bring your baby safely to the world. I didn't bother with a birth plan, nor the birth preperation classes and I loved both my births. Not painful at all. (This is said nearly 3 years later, I just love my selective memory)

Interesting piece on risk associated with C-sec.

Hi all,

I'm due to have my first baby in december, and from various people i have heard that the c-sec rate in germany is rather high and that they just whip you into surgery before really giving natural labour a real go, (im not sure if this is the case or not) but it still worries me, as i would only want a section for the benefit of my baby and me, not just because some doc thinks so.

Any advice and opinions people would have on this would be great, im also looking about for a good maternity hospital in Munich, and also some birthing classes in English.

Thanks Folks
Sarah

So I started reading this thread wondering if an elective c-section is an option in Germany. I now gather that it is, but (correct me if I am wrong) that many doctors (and/or hospitals?) will refuse to grant such a request without a medically determined necessity. What course of action should one take to arrange a voluntary c-section? (My frauenartz does not perform any deliveries, natural or otherwise.) I'm just looking for information here -- have read all of the valuable information posted here and elsewhere on the risks of c-sections, reasons for natural childbirth, etc.
Thanks.

Hi Tahoe (one of my favourite places, just moved here from the Bay Area):

I had an emergency c-section at the Roten Kreuz Frauenklinik after the two midwives and dr. jumping on my belly couldn´t get my daughter out. The anasthesiologist (sp?) spoke English with me, I was dead scared never having had surgery before, and mentioned her friend (also a dr.) had an elective c-section earlier that day. So you may try to schedule an app't with the OberArzt, Chief Physician there to discuss your wishes. Good luck. I found Dr. von Obernitz to have an excellent bedside manner, and spoke English to boot.

Thanks for the suggestion. I keep bumping into people whose friends have had elective c-setions -- if anyone could provide me with the name of the attending doctor, I would greatly appreciate it. Meanwhile, I will try the chief Frauenartz at a couple of hospitals.