The Neukölln district of Berlin

Hi, I'm currently apartment hunting (from the UK so unfortunately I can't go see any of them) and I've found what seems to be perfect (regarding rent, U-Bahn line and time period) but I was wondering what Neukoelln was like as an area? 2 people so far have expressed doubts, although haven't told me why...??

Thanks!!

Well, if you read German, this link might give you an idea.

Article on School Violence

Found an English one as well

ABC News article.

Thanks! Kinda thought so, and at the moment the alternative is Schmargendorf so it's not really much of a competition!!!

My (German) mates live in Neukölln. When I was living in Berlin for a short time, I went to visit them and...lets just say there was a bit of an atmosphere when I was walking down the street. Didn't feel too safe but there you go.

I lived in Kreuzberg for two years and Neukölln for three. In fact, I lived at Reuterplatz, which is about 150m from the infamous Berliner "Rütlischule" where everything is out of control. Whatever. I enjoyed living there, because the rent was very cheap for a very nice apartment and because it had colour.

Having said that, I was living on the edge of Kreuzberg, so in 5 minutes I was back on the cool bohemian Landwehrkanal and it's important not to forget that Neukölln is huge - the southern parts are pretty dreary. If you want to tell me which part of Neukölln the flat is in I'd be happy to give you more detailed feedback.

Well I'd always recommend the Prenzlauer Berg area (that is if you have no children), it's such a buzzing place loads of quaint pub and bars, a great nightlife and an absolutely unbeatable flair.

If I had no kids, I'd live there myself

A good (English) friend of mine lives in the heart of Neuköln (Hermannstr.). It's fine. I joke around and tell him he lives in the ghetto, but really it's fine, and with good transit connections. Nowhere to go out in the immediate area, but not far from Kreuzberg.

I live in Treptow and could walk to the Rütlischule in ten minutes. I never knew this until I looked on a map about two weeks ago. It could not be more irrelevant.

If the price is right, and the flat is nice, I wouldn't think twice about living there.

That's funny, when I lived in Berlin for a few months also in Prenzl-g in 2004, my friend and I read this paper article on how Prenz-g has the most young couples with children out if all the Berlin districts...it's kind of true, West Berlin has more retired folk and poshy types... just hang out in the park on any day in Prenz-g and it's all stroller action! but it still has its funky charm...Friedrichshein is actually becoming the kind of "hip" neighborhood, cool bars and restaurants...looking for an apartment in those two myself at the moment actually

PBerg is the most 'fertile' neighbourhood in all of Germany, at least according the newspaper article I read a while back. A walk around Köllwitz Platz seems to confirm this, too.

It's Kreuzberg all the way, if you ask me.

hi,i lived in neukoln for 4 years. the berliners call it `small turkey` because of all the turkish people living there. schooling was a problem,a german girlfreind of mine had 2 children and sent them to school there and they were the only german children in their class of 30 !. the general language in the school was turkish.

however i found the shopping excelent,lots of bargain shops. the night life was excellent too,plenty of pubs. and the transportation system was top notch.

if you want to broaden your german speaking dont bother as the common language all around you will be turkish.

but hey,come,its berlin`the city that never sleeps`. fantastic night life.wish i still had the money i spent on berlin night life.

so - single and free,fantastic. married, ok.married with kids,forget it !

thanks for all the recommendations! i'll be moving to charlottenburg in june!

After all that, Charlottenburg? ... 'kin Spießer

Charlottenburg is a much better place for a family, safer & posher, Neukolln is way too gheto-ish and rough around the edges.

hehe thanks jayhay...

i guess though for me neukoelln would have been fine, i'm still a student!

Ah, thanks Diana for keeping the rent down

Charlottenburg = €€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€. Sorry, way overpriced and stale.

the sun doesnt shine on neukoln. i know cos am here now. it has a good bash at making you forget why you love berlin !!! friedrichshiens a nice area and pretty cheap try there !

I crack a big smile everytime I read all the dirt on neukoelln. I've lived here for 8 months now and I LOVE it. it's cheap, not 'hipster', nice people, I live next to a gorgeous park (hasenheide) and a great swimming pool...but I'm glad lots of people think it is dirty or scary. like someone else said, keeps the rent down! I also LIKE the immigrant feeling, I feel some sort of kinship with people from turkey and nigeria, trying to come here to find something different. diverse and a bit boisterous at times, when I move from this flat, I'd like to still stay in the area.

It's a matter of personal preference. I lived in Kreuzberg for a year and hated it, but many people love it. I know people who love Neukolln, and others that prefer Charlottenburg. I prefer Prenzlauer Berg and Mitte. It just depends on the atmosphere you want to live in.

this is cheapest, nasty, deplicated ghetto of berlin.

sure you can get 120 m2 for only €400, but dont be suprised if you smell dönner for the larger part of the day, due to its situation atop some nasty dönner shop. or having your woman harrassed daily if not assaulted. the buildings are in poor condition, to a German's perception, but are in pristine condition according to Turkish/African standards.

There are pockets of neat areas here and there are a handful of interesting venues. But I would deeply reconsider moving to this locale. The same really goes for Friedrichshain: another run downed area with deadbeat "lifetime" students and neo nazis.

The most expensive and desired area of Berlin is Schöneberg, then Mitte. This is where you will find about 12-15€ a square meter. Ridiculous! For those a bit more snobbish and would really like to have a prestigious Princeton or Cambridge address: Zehlendorf (the "American" suburbs of berlin)

Kreuzberg is also very interesting and progressive...almost like the east village of berlin. take it or leave it, its multi-cultural

There are pockets of Prenzlauerberg that are acceptible, obviously around Schönhauserallee is considered Ghetto, but a few streets east and west are totally different. There are a lot of deadbeats, bums and beatnicks for my taste in this borough.

Mitte is very expensive, being the diplomatic quarter.

Tiergarten - Wedding is just a small step above Neukölln or Friedrichshain

Charlottenburg is where the chic and rich live...old school, that is - used to be the most desired, expensive area.

Spandau - might as well live in Brandenburg.

To be honest, that's what we all figure charlottenburg thinks Have fun being chic and rich. We'll be over here being nasty and "deplicated", whatever that means.

Hey vanilla, where pracically neighbors

(/me does the secret neukölln handshake)

And yea, i like it too. And being a native i lived in most of the quarters at one time or the other.

HUH?
Prenzlauer Berg ghetto and Kreuzberg not? I lived in Kreuzberg and saw A MILLION times more deadbeats, bums and beatnicks than I've ever seen living in Prenzl Berg, where in fact I haven't seen a single one in my entire time here...

There are plenty of unemployed, strip joints, immigrant housing blocks (complete with satellite dishes on each balcony), Russian mafia run crime, "massage" parlors, human traffickers, drunks etc etc in Charlottenburg so for the love of god quit generalizing about this place like it's Park Avenue.

Thanks.

But again, just throw a fish. The guy probably has no idea where Charlottenburg is and has never been to Neukölln. Probably thought he'd get mugged the minute he showed his face. Well, whatever.

There's an abandoned apartment next door to us with a balcon which faces north east, morning sun. We're east of eberswalderstr ubahn.

400€ for 58m is what we pay, so I assume the price is similar. Should be [relative], price down these scoundrels before you sign, maintenance is 'your' responsibility, tho by law it's theirs!

no lake out front . a road tho *cough-cough*. Yet somehow elevated enough to avoid >50% of the pollution, me thinks

I don't see why there should be a 'neighbourhood war', all areas can be ok, it all depends on what each one of us is looking for.
I'm not trashing any area, if you are young, single, childless and white I think the best places are in East Berlin...

I lived in Prenzlauerberg some time ago when I was around 24 years old, just married & pregnant and it was HELL for me personally.
There wasn't a decent supermarket just a rancid Aldi 20 min. walk away from my flat, at the local Burger King I got pestered many times by guys asking for sex, I guess they thought I'm dark skinned (hispanic) therefore I'm a whore!
I got chased, verbally abused and got bottles thrown at me by a gang of skin heads while 7 months pregnant in broad daylight while walking to Aldi, people stopped in the street, while walking with my German husband to 'touch my hair' because they said they'd never seen anyone with hair so black and made 'yuck' faces. etc.
So me, married, pregnant, foreign, living in a neighbourhood filled with skin heads & trendy young junkies in old buildings with no lift or telephone lines, no tv reception besides the 1A channel, well it was hardly the best choice, the last thing on my mind was clubbing, doing drugs or being 'alternative'. So no thanks, thinking about those days still give me nightmares!

I moved to Charlottenburg as my husband thought it'd be better for us and yes it definitely was.
I don't think it comes close to the comforts of London but it has better schools, shops and restaurants at my doorstep, a mixed crowd, a calmer pace, it does suit ME better.

I know East Berlin has changed a lot but people still move there for the 'scene', the clubbing, etc. that's something I do not need and now days a flat in Mitte or Prenzlauerberg is a lot more expensive than any flat in Charlottenburg, so no, Charlottenburg is not more expensive, it used to be, I am only here for a quiet life, I have never been into the whole 'gritty-arty Berlin' scene, places like Tacheles, clandestine techno clubs, give me Hampstead-Highgate any day!

Diane, I agree that a pissing match about whose neighborhood is better is silly. It seems (from the birth year in your profile) like you lived in P'Berg 10 years ago, though. In Berlin in particular things change a lot on such a timescale, so P'Berg may be a very different place now than it was when you were there.

Of course JTW, I acknowledge that things have changed, especially when it comes to rent prices.
An English couple that used to live in the building next to ours just moved to East Berlin, but it took them ages to find a flat as they just couldn't afford the rent of what was on offer, their flat in Charlottenburg was a lot cheaper but they are a young couple (30's) both professional and no kids so they wanted to be in a trendy, noisy place, whereas we don't.
My husband is not the type that likes meeting people or going out at all, I do like going out but mainly to have a nice meal, to the pub, to have coffee or go shopping and we have plenty of that stuff in our neighbourhood being next to Savigny Platz and 10 minutes away from Ku'damm, besides we have a young daughter that needs to attend an English speaking school nearby so of course I prefer to be in a family oriented, English speaking friendly neighbourhood rather than in between techno clubs.

So it all comes down to what age group you are in and what you want from Berlin, there's no point in comparing between places like Charlottenburg, Neukolln, Kreuzberg or Prenzlauerberg as they are perfect for very different types of people, it is not about the money or social class at all.

I agree with almost all you said, but Wilmersdorf, Zehlendorf and Grunewald (in that order) are very much about the social class

Ok I understand where you're coming from, but the rent rise has chased out a lot of people who are purely scenesters, and it has definitely chased out the junkies and low lifes. Your experience here in P-Berg reminds me a lot of my own in Kreuzberg.
It's still busy here, and trendy...but I find it's more young professionals and young families here than anyone else.

Still the cheapest Capital city rents in Europe though...

Hi all,
Greetings!
I'm looking at buying a cheap flat for about 40k in Berlin to live in whilst I learn german for a year. I'll likely keep the flat for many years after and if I like Berlin, stay in it or if I don't, rent it out. Now, my question...I'm looking at this flat in Neukoelln. Does anyone have any experience with the area? Convenient transport links? Is it a sh!thole? Be honest with me! I'm probably not going to get a des-res for 40k and I accept that but I really would want at least a 2 Zimmer to have somewhere to stick visitors from home (Ireland!). Cheers all!

Topics merged by admin

First German lesson: 2 zimmer means a living room and a bedroom, not two bedrooms.

Cheers, I actually knew that (I was thinking settee bed!) but more thanks for the thread linking, man that was fast!

Neukoelln is a big place. Ask the agent for the actual address because it's not possible to answer your question otherwise. Some areas are nicer than others.

Ta very much. Will be speaking to the agent on friday!

Okey dokey, the apartment is in Rixdorf, on Schoeneweider Str. Any thoughts? It's convenient to the U- and S-Bahn at least!

We are about to sign the docs from a flat about 10 mins walk near the canal from here. We spent some time in Neukoelln and really liked it.. Can I ask you does the flat have one central heating system for the whole building or will you be paying for that yourself? We wanted an altbau but the ones with the heating included in the monthly Wohngeld were getting too expensive for us. That looks like a nice flat (not trying to steal it honest!)

I honestly don't know if it's a central central heating system or if it's just central heating standalone style. I just spoke briefly to the agent about a couple of places and I'll be heading over to look in a couple of weeks. Are you buying to live in it or to let it out?

We are buying to live in, hence why we were looking for an apartment with the heating included in the Wohngeld..seemed hefty monthly bill prices otherwise. I would advise checking stuff like that out when you are visiting the flats.Things like how recently the pipes/electricity have been done too...we have to keep the flat for ten years to avoid being taxed a crazy amount if we sell before then so you want to make sure no major work will be needing done before that as it will raise the Wohngeld.

Cheers for the pointers. Any and all tidbits ar gratefully received! When are you expecting to move in? I believe a flat near Neukoelln station is a reasonably sound investment, given that Tegel and Tempelhof will close and all services will be through an expanded Schoenefeld. They say they don't have the money to extend the U7 but the S45 is already there. An flat midway between the only airport and the city centre would seem a decent bet, so long as the area is ok or up and coming. I've read elsewhere that some people say Rixdorf is not like the rest of Neukoelln at all, any thoughts on that?

How difficult do folks think it will be for me to let out one of the rooms in a two bed in Rixdorf? I will likely not leave my job here until January so i have time to buy and get it ready and pay the Hausgeld until I get someone, preferably a german speaker so as I can practice (inflict) my german on them.

What would a renter expect as a minimum? In my experience of germany they'd expect 4 white walls and not much else but is thus really accurate? Should I put in a bed and so on to entice a tenant?

<bump>, so anyone got any thoughts on the south of Neukoelln, around Neukoelln S/U Bahn/Rixdorf?

A friend of mine is living in Rixdorf, Neukölln, so I visit the area from time to time. Indeed, Rixdorf (btw not in the south of Neukölln, it is, in fact, the heart of Neukölln - at least historically and geographically) is a sort of an oasis in Neukölln. It once was a small village and directly at its central square, Richardplatz, it still looks a bit like one. Mixed of course with end-19th century Berlin apartment houses. Anyway, it's relatively green there, some decent restaurants are located there and even some art galleries are around since some time. That said, the "real" Neukölln isn't far away. It is and was always a poor district with a high number of immigrants and unemployed people, thus the social problems there. You will for sure encounter drunken people, bored, mobbing youth groups and babbling homeless people, especially directly at Karl-Marx-Allee (the main shopping street) and Sonnenallee and many streets are lined with cheap, stinky bars and awful, cheap shops, but if you can live with that, it's fine. The infrastructure is great, no doubt, and it's far ahead of what's called ghetto in other countries. It's even said by some, that it's one of the new "in"-districts, because rents are cheap and the underground nightlife and artists are moving there since last year.
Ah, and at least if the rent isn't too expensive, it shouldn't be a big problem to find a renter for an empty room, though it may be easier of course to find one with a bed and some basic furniture inside. Try www.studenten-wg.de for example.

Thanks so much TobyG. I can live with that stuff-I'm from Dublin! We have drunk and homeless people by the barrel load. As for mobbing youths, well I am in two minds here. I hate neighbourhoods that have all completely matured and are full of old people, but I also hate bloody troublemaking kids. Can't win em all I guess. I intend buying a 2 room and heading to IKEA in a van and getting beds and sofas and a table and cutlery and so on so it's ready for me as well as any potential renters. So speaking of tenants (and thanks for the link btw) are there any big employers or hospitals/unis in the area?

You're lucky regarding IKEA, cause it's really not far away, located in Tempelhof (about 8 km). And Berlins cheapest car rental (robben & wientjes http://www.robben-wientjes.de/ ) isn't far away either. Regarding employers: What comes to my mind (besides all the retail industry at Karl-Marx Straße and along the S-Bahn tracks) is the Hotel Estrel, one of the biggest Hotels in Europe and an industrial area near the S-Bahn Sonnenallee.

I love this forum, such great local info. IKEA does indeed seem a quick spin up the A100. I'm really liking the location of this flat wrt transport links at least! I envisage taking my bike over and visiting mates in Cologne-being near the A100 might mean a quick escape from Berlin on a friday!

I am looking for a place to live in the summer months, and found one through wg-gesucht.de except it's in the Neukolln district.. (after emailing a dozen people, this is the only reply I got). i didn't know anything about this area until a good Toytown search or two; is this place really not recommended for someone who is going to germany (solely) to learn the language? It's very close to Hermannstr. Btw, anyone know approx. how long it takes to go from the end of U8 line (Hermannstr.) to Alexanderplatz? I don't care for party/clubbing scene, but I need a safe place + good cafe/restaurants as I am a risk-averse 22 year old female who is too lazy to cook..

what do you mean "relly recommended for someone..." why not? because there are so many immigrants? don't bother - you'll have to speak a lot of german everywhere and there are still about 60% german people in neukölln...
it'S 17 minutes from hermannstraße to alexanderplatz. there are some restaurants also in neukölln of course (it isn't necessarily safer at alexanderplatz btw), the closest hot spot to hermannplatz is Gräfestraße and area in Kreuzberg.

I was referring to this comment:


and in regards to safety:


Not sure what is meant by "bit of an atmosphere".. but yeah.

By the way thanks for your help, <20 mins doesn't sound too bad

I have regular appointments near Hermannplatz and I have never felt uncomfortable walking around there.