IT jobs and trial periods - "Probezeit"

I just had an interview with a company who seem impressed and now want to send me a spec for a project for which I should estimate the amount of man hours and cost. They will then employ me initially just for this period to assess my ability. They will also do this with other candidates.

WTF?!? Is this normal in Germany? Are they just trying to get easier short-term hard-working labour? Or is this a valid and fair assessment of ability?

I have heard of some companies having a 1 day "Probetag", but this?

Would *you* do it? What are peoples' thoughts?

I am currently on the unemployment list and do not know how I stand regarding health insurance etc that are usually paid by the Arbeitsamt, and tax. They told me that it was possible to work for a fixed period and they do not care for how much, and will then continue as normal... They also suggested that I give the contact details for my work officer in the Arbeitsamt and they will try to work everything out the best for me and them.

I guess this is a contract/consulting position?

For permie staff, we often offer a 1day probetag. Then there is a 6 month probzeit, during which time either party can cancel contracts - that from what I understand is pretty normal here.

It is for a permanent position :} But seems they are wanting to make the Probe period like a freelance project for a short specified time.

It is quite common to have to work for a Probezeit. The advantage to you is that it's easy to quit if you don't like the job. The disadvantage, of course, is that they can sack you easily as well. See what the contract says; there should still be some kind of notice period even within the Probezeit.

I know that it is normal to have a Probezeit in a new contract and the reasons for it, but this has nothing to do with a new permanent contract or Probezeit - they want to employ me for a fixed period first (like freelance) for the period that I specify that I need for the project (could be a week or so) and for the cost that I specify. After that, they will again assess all candidates before issuing a permanent contract... A 1-day Probetag, I could understand...

i think it's becoming increasingly common
one company i know of has started doing it for a few positions, but they do keep the people on if they fit in and if their work is good
what have you got to lose, really?
if you're taken on for a fixed period and not kept on, then you wouldn't lose your unemployment benefit - in fact you'd probably get it for longer, i'd have thought
no doubt someone knows the details and will post

Thanks Topsy. I am just a little nervous myself regarding the nightmare beurocracy in the Arbeitsamt and the logistics of doing this... most in the Arbeitsamt here don't seem to know their left arm from their right :}

I am not bothered about doing this short job because, as you say, I have nothing to lose... Just don't wanna screw-up my entitlement to unemployment by doing so...

6 months Probezeit is typical. Both parties can leave the party at anytime. Rightly so - a simple interview is never enough to be sure if you fit. Usually towards the end of the six months an employment review secures your future. I can't see it having any affect on your unemployment rights (if they exist in the first place). A mutual agreement to divorce from a new company is no big black mark, so long as you don't have too many, and can explain it.

Thanks YorkshireLad6 for your post, but I am not talking about a normal "Probezeit".

They want to give me a project, estimate the timeframe needed. I will then work for this period of time as a test period (I think as freiberufler, not full-time) and for the money I guess it should cost. At the end of this "befristete" period, they could decide to offer me a full-time contract or say "Tschüß" and I go unemployed again.

Why do they do this instead of offering a full-time contract with Probezeit? Doesn't make sense...

Of course it makes sense. I would do exactly the same thing if the situation were available. If you prove yourself then I would offer you further work, i.e. a 6 month contract or whatever, if you don't make the grade then I can cut you loose without any further commitment. Simple and clean with a minimum of hassle for my company. You're shit then I've not put too much into it and I can go in another direction, you're good then I can get you as a resource and be commended for exercising caution.

I've been working a combination of 3, 6 and 12 month contracts for nearly eight years now, mostly within the same company. The scenario you've described wouldn't work for what I do but for a developer it's a great idea. There're a million developers out there and to be totally honest most don't deserve the title, they're just programmers, code monkeys. If I'm hiring then I want someone with an ability to think rather than just blindly follow a spec.

Ah, you say that this is for a permie position. All the more reason that I'd want to sample the goods first. Normal probezeit is 6 months. I'm guessing that the project they've asked you to spec and carry out is a shorter period than that. Smart thinking on their part from a planning and budget point of view. Whoever's doing the hiring sounds like he's neatly covering his ass in case you turn out to be a dud.

Okay I can see now that it is probably smarter on their part as they get to assess me in a shorter period of time. But if they later offer me a permie contract, I would still have a 6 month Probezeit too, oder? That wouldn't make sense...

That should be open to negotiation. The term that you've served under the initial agreement should be taken into consideration when the contract is being drawn up. So if you do this project in 6 weeks then you should push for your official Probezeit to be 4.5 months instead of 6. There are no hard and fast rules for this and you should read your contract carefully and negotiate on any points where you are not happy.

Thanks man!