Foreigners living in Munich - TV Documentary

Hi my name is Juan Tejeda from Pyramid Films. Currently we are working on a documentary about foreginers living in Munich. The documentary focuses on the topic of integration. As many of you know the CSU has been criticized in many countries for having in the Bavarian election campaigns a harsh tone of anti-foreigner rhetoric. Are foreigners integrated in Munich? Do they feel welcome here?

If you are interested in been interviewed or have anything to say about it, please do so...

Editor's note: documentary cancelled. E-Mail removed. Do NOT e-mail juanteje any more.

The most active forum in Munich and nobody replied? I will step up to the plate for my interview. have your people contact my people and we'll talk American in Munich style.

Only just seen this topic!

Surely I, being totally well balanced and happily integrated into German society would be perfect for any TV interviews on the subject.

Who are the CSU?

@don riina

as i dont personaly know you, and have only your forum postings to go by,
please, please, please do not even think about an adventure into the public limelight.
i wish to remain in munich without being chased by angry natives carrying pitchforks, flaming torches, and wooden stakes and shouting "burn the brit"

thanks

Whhhhhhhooooaaaaahhhh!!!

Not even the sarcastic to go with it.

that was my sarcastic reply

could tell you some stories where you'ld laugh your head off when it comes to taking the piss from our beloved hosts.

Ah, I love them really Gideon. Well, no, thats not true atall, who am I kidding, but one of them at least is OK. Apart from when she invites her mum over or something. *#íüing !§+#!!!

dont worry we all get them mmmmmm-why-didnt-granda-perfect-that-bomging-technique-days
jesus my mother in law came over from east prussia when they all ran away from the russians

she is a one woman nightmare, and invites herself over

I'd do it...

Then I'd have something else to add to the 'Claim to fame' thread

@hazza
it what sense claim to fame, positive or negative?

What are you trying to say??

well think about the boss of the zweit heimat,

provocative wrong question,
provocative wrong answer and it all looks realy terrible on screen...

na mate only joking do it if aou want to, but make sure you get a free meal

I feel like I'd better not post anything here, as I'll just get started on a negative rant about Munich and Bavaria.
Maybe that's what they want though. I'll sleep on it!

Hi everybody, thanks a lot for the responses. I regret to inform all of you that our documentary has been cancelled due to the lack of funds. Instead a documentary about a recycling &§%§)!&FU**ING factory will be shot instead.

Nevertheless, thanks a lot for the support.

Sincerely,

Juan Tejeda

Wasn't till I met my Frau that I started to appreciate mother in law jokes. Les Dawson was a genius!

Anyone remember some of his mother in law jokes?

Integrated foreigners in Munich? What exactly does this mean? Which foreigner is truly integrated? I think it's a state of mind.

You can hardly compare a temporary foreign <enter profession here> worker to an "true" immigrant, one who is willing to permanently give up their home to be here.

If language is a basis for integration, I can only say I have to force myself to integrate, meaning I learned German and this is the basis for the rest. But untill that accent disappears, I will always be found out. Am I still integrating?

I cannot vote here, yet the police could easily stop me and ask me for my i.d. card. I will be taxed like any German, but could be excluded from getting a rental contract because the landlord wants no "foreign" tennants.

I think this could be an interesting discussion topic. Good morning!

Actually you can vote here. My buddy is doing the research as we speak. If you have been living here for 2 years and paying taxes, you have the right to vote.

I think it is pretty obvious what 'integrated' means. There are lots of people on the forum here who would not consider themselves temporarily here, myself included, although I would also not (yet) call myself integrated. As for ranting, it does seem to be far more prevalent amongst those who are just passing through (apart from don).

I would consider myself 'integrated' - aside from the people on this forum that I haven't yet met, I don't have a single native English speaking friend here - however, my friends here have all lived in the States so they all speak English well and are 'Americanized'(my boyfriend included) so they understand my need for 24-hr shopping and convenience and choices. But, as far as my perspective of the US now, having lived outside of it for 3 years - completely changed! I've become Germanized!!!

But, I still don't like weisswurst...

TexasTornado
I would like to see more information on that if you or anyone else has it.

European/local elections yes. Nothing of importance.

After 6 or so years you can claim permanent residence and become one of Ze Germans which will allow you to vote for your ruler. No tax without representation!

edit: Personally I dont think its worth it, although becoming a German would be comedy.

edit2: I wonder what the nationality test would be. Sing the banned verse of the national anthem, perform a leg slapping dance to some umpah music and then a test to see how well you can push into a queue of people.

Helluva lot more integrated here than I was in London - not as much as Madrid - why should the government have to try and integrate people ? You make the best of it as you can I reckon .

Its a tough job, but somebody's gotta do it

Anyway, what the crap is integrated? I'm marrying one of their daughters, drink their beer, buy their produce (but cook it properly), grunt back when spoken to in German (not to be rude, its something I notice most Germans do as a reply here) pay their taxes...

Am I only integrated if I jump up and down waving a flag with "I love Germany " on it?

You can claim permanent residence after 5 years if you ask for "unbefristet" when you renew your residence permit. However, I don't think that's quite the same as giving up your UK (or wherever) citizenship and becoming a german national...

My GOD, you are more integrated than me!

As for the citizenship thing and voting it was covered in details in another thread. If you are an EU citizen and / or native of a land that has a reciprocity (or something) agreement with Germany then you can hold a german passport AND your real one I will probably do this if and when the time comes, but would not go so far as giving up my real passport if it were not so.

Holding a German passport? Thats not setting a very good example to the children now is it?

Don, then I advise you not to have kids mit yer Fräulein, because, I hate to break it to ya, they are going to be German Passport holders Muhahahahah

How is that even possible? I am English, the kids are mine, the kids are English. Simple.

I am with you on this one. If an English bloke plants his seed in a German bird, then there will be a mini-world war where the genes fight it our for dominance. The German genes will take an early lead in the fight, but just at the last minute the plucky English genes will storm forward with a toodle-pip and a huzzah, and take the victory. The child, will be English. This has been scientifically proven.

Oh dear

@ Mystery Man - Are you SURE EU Citizens can retain their old citizenship if they become Germans ? I am 99% certain this is NOT the case.

I came here for a backpacking "working holiday" and live here 12 years later and don't intend to leave.

When the CSU fucks say "integration" they mean flag-waving, cheering for Schumacher, singing Deutschland Über Alles and having quiet family Christmasses.
And it's a one way street.

My kind of integration is after a night on the helles in my Local where there's British, Irish, Romanian, Turkish, Greek, Slovak as well as German guests all having a fun night and then heading off for a kebab.

On the TV issue. There is , I think ONE programme, called "Babylon" that looks at the issues of so-called "Ausländer" in Germany. It's made by WDR. I saw it once and it seemed to be about letting the German viewers look into the lives of foreigners rather than actually representing them.

British television has clear guidlines on serving minorities, German television is ABSOLUTELY FUCKING SHITE at doing it. No wonder LOTS of foreigners watch sattelite from "home", something that the CSU is always complaining about. Duh!

Sorry, rant over.

grtho,

interesting point about british television.

i have the luxury of the beeb in the office, one day i was watching the news and a college came in and stared intensely at the screen, as was a bit shocked as it was local london news, sort of traffik jam due to blocked drain sort of stufff. Of coarse being an opionated nosey bugger i asked why? her reply...

"he's black. the guy reading the news is black, that would never happen in germany"

she by the way is married to a black guy, but its a point, could one say that a minority has achieved an 'integrated' status when they are allowed to read important national news on the telly?

so when a muslim women is on ARD at 20:15 this thread will cease to be of importance?

I'm also married to a native have too little 'uns, spreche die lingo too gelle, when am i integrated.

But lets not rant, a hell of a lot of germans are open.
but also a hell of a lot pidgeon hole ausländer into two compartments, those whose grasp of german and germany is so perfect that they are suspect for not having a german passport, and those who clean the streets, serve in mcdonalds and generaly are here to help the german population enjoy life.

i have been described as "our englander", must admit to have felt like a dog, didn't know whether or not to roll on my back, put both my arms and legs in the air, and pant wildly with outstretched tounge.

Oh, I don't know about that. There's a TV presenter on ZDF I believe who has an Asian background. And big long ponytail too!

EDIT: Yeah, his name is Cherno Jobatey Does the morning show.

NEWS PRESENTER???

i'm talking about the national news bulletin ARD 20:15 - TAGESSCHAU

EDIT: morning show, thats the television equivalent to sweeping the streets put him somewhere where noone can see him, sorry he's just there to be exotic if hes good whack him upfront, might make the tagesschau in a dacade thou

Integration. What does it mean? Let's take the foreign immigrants that moved from Italy to the US 3 or 4 generations ago. They wanted to make it their new 'home'. They wanted to bring up their children there and their children's children, etc. Yes, they were probably escaping a bad political situation to go to the "Land of the Free" but they saw that as their new place to root themselves.
Some of them chose not to vote or 'buy american', speak English or even drink the water. But still, they were there.

Are they integrated? First generation people still held onto Italian language and their traditions and values. But for each subsequent generation they give up a little more the old ways and become something new. Not "americanized" but still proudly "Third Generation Italian". These guys in Brooklyn, Bronx, Long Island (for example) may speak English and may not speak Italian anymore but they are definitely their own creatures with Italian flags on their rearview mirrors. US has changed its label of the 'melting pot' to the 'salad bowl'. Everyone there is in the same place but still hold on to their unique identity.

"Germanized" might be a tricky label to apply to anyone. I am a temporary alien. I don't intend to make this my home where I want to die so I don't think I will even think along those lines of 'voting', 'becoming germanized', or 'integrated'.

TV is shite and there is nothing I can do about it.

i've seen cherno around town a few times. has this very petite, blond girlfriend. they looked cute. and he always wears tennis shoes.

anyhow, they've got milka and daisy d for viva but you're right, that is not conservtive ARD.

See: Problems of Inter-Nationality Marriages

Ok, it's not automatically ALL EU states, it is those EU states with a reciprocality arrangement with Germany.

"At the present time, reciprocality exists between Germany and the following countries: GB, Ireland and Portugal. By the end of this year reciprocality with the following states will exist: Italy, France and Belgium "

I habe lived in Germany fpr nearly 12 years now. Ispeak fluent German, I have a German wife and represent Germany at international level in Touch Rugby. I pay my taxes (more than many Germans earn gross) here like everyone else and do I feel intergrated?

Not really! When I first came to Germany I was forced to sit in a dimly lit smelly office waiting room with hundreds of asylum seekers and other immigrants so that I could get a piece of paper (Aufenthaltgenehmigung) that allows me to stay in this country, something that is guranteed to me by EU law.

When I moved to Munich and started looking for a flat I was told repeatedly that they don't rent to foreigners. (Then my wife, who comes from near Düsseldorf in the Rhineland, started doing the phonecalls, she was told they didn't rent to Ossies or East Germans!)

When I wanted to get married here the Baviarian authorities put one hurdle after another in my way (even though we didn't want to get married in Bavaria) and it took over a year to get the marriage licence.

When I wanted to apply for dual Nationality, something that is allowed by German National law for EU citizens where there is reciprocity I was told by the Bavarian Authorities that this law in not valid in Bavaria since the Free State has put in an objection to the Bundesverfassungsgerichthof.

Do I have many German friends? No not really. Most of my friends are ex-pats of all nations ranging from the usual english-speaking to east european and further. The only Germans I can count as real friends are those that have intergrated themselves into ex-pat communities.

Having said all this, I enjoy my life here, my work (I have great German colleagues) and my social life and have all intention to stay here permanently!

Long posting but it all came from the heart!

Ooooh, maybe I'll become a German now... but the last time they invited me they wanted €250 for the privilege.. mmmmmm

Cherno Jobatey is an annoying fuck!
Makes even "lite" morning time on ZDF float away on a cloud of nothingness and pink sofas.

When will there be a non-white / non-German reading the Tageschau ?

Look at foreigners who are "big" in German TV; Rudi Carell and the Dutch bimbo do a bit of comedy and shite for RTL. An odd Turkish walk on character in the Mareinhof/GZSZ/Einheitsbrei. In the cop show and dramas an Ausländer is always good as a dealer, a pimp, a gangster or at the very best, a VICTIM. Victim of of the fact that aren't white German.

One of the few shows that DOES reflect foreigners in a good way is Lindenstrasse:
There's even a Toytown character from Canada:

http://www.lindenstrasse.de/lindenstrasse/...llererich_c.jpg

did they also ask you to prove what your salary was?
pissed me of paying 60DM to a translator to translate my birth certificate, an then she couldn't read the writting and i had to translate it for her, still had to pay 60Dm for the piggin stamp thou

yes..salary (pay cheques going back the last so many months and my Steuererklärung from the last two years), not just my passport but also my Aufenthaltsgenehmigung, my birth cerificate, which I had to get translated into German (costing a bucket full of money!) because nobody could read the English translation of my welsh certificate. And I had to get an "Ehefähigkeitsbescheinigung" which they insisted would be issued by the authorities at my home town. So I send my father along to the offices at my last town of residency and they just laughed at him, saying that they had never heard of such a thing, an even if they had they couldn't issue it because I hadn't lived there for 10 years.

I then went back to the bavarians and he insisted he needed such a thing and showed me an example issued by a Scottish local authority and said he woudn't issue the license without it. In the end I got round it by signing an "eidesstattliche Erklärung" to the fact that I had never been married before and was legally allowed to enter a marriage (costing another bucket load of money).

And then my wife (typical Geman) insisted on having a double name (which she never uses, typical women) which again cost me loads of money extra.

Beurocrats! And when we took the finalised documents to the town where we got married (Neuss am Rhein) the registrar there laughed his head off at all the things we had to produce to get the licence. If we had been living there we would have been married within months instead of years (18 months)

Did a bit of research on this one. It looks like 2 of the States put in a challenge to Dual-Nationality (Bayern and Badem Würtremberg), which as far as I can follow from the twisted german in the following piece:
http://www.spdfraktion.de/cnt/rs/rs_dok/0,,29452,00.htm
was rejected. It remains to be seen however what exactly the 2 states will do.

Last paragraph in particular:
Es bleibt abzuwarten, wie sich die Länder Bayern und Baden-Württemberg angesichts dieser Entscheidung des höchsten Verwaltungsgerichts zukünftig bei vergleichbaren Einbürgerungsanträgen von Unionsbürgern verhalten werden. Da eindeutige Aussagen des BVerwG zur Auslegung des Begriffs "Gegenseitigkeit" in den Urteilsgründen zu erwarten sind, kann damit gerechnet werden, dass das Urteil eine Wende in der Einbürgerungspraxis der beiden abweichenden Länder herbeiführen muss.

yeah theoretically but the Bavarians continue to do there own thing. The only way to get round it is to write some sort of "Einspruch" letter. I have a Brazialian neighbour and she managesd it and is going to help me write one. But the Bavarians will continue to block as long as they can and I am told to expect a long drawn out process!

Yeah, I think my wife is technically my 'domestic partner' since our marriage liscence is in English. We still share benefits like insurance and visa time here but it is not considered a legaly documented relationship. Don't remember all the in's and out's of it but someone during our time of registering here said that to us.

does that mean your married or not???

how about just for fun trying to get a divorce in the german courts
love to see the paper work on that one

love the topic -- reminder to all US citizens don't get married in Germany, do it in the US, it took us 15 minutes at the courthouse and no Ehefähigkeitsbescheinigung, no eidesstattliche Erklärung, just passports and $50. (California) To get it recognized in Germany we got an Apostille, which is NOT A TRANSLATION, it's an international document that tells Germany that the US marriage certificate is valid. You can also get an apostille for birth certificates etc. And it was only $13 too...

yes, yes, he's on it. He recently wrote an article about the foreigner's right to vote in Deutschland. I asked him to post on this thread. will follow up tomorrow and get all the deetz. Apparently he's out on the Isar at the moment.

* Are you SURE EU Citizens can retain their old citizenship if they become *
* Germans ? I am 99% certain this is NOT the case. *

What's up with the constant misinformation?


So if Turks and other non-EU nationals can become German citizens and keep their old passport, why shouldn't y'all be able to do the same? Maybe we're not trying hard enough?
Just wondering.

Shouldn't have to fucking try so hard, that is the point. Most other countries give the vote to people who have been in residence for a specific number of years. That would never happen in a million years in Germany. It's the old Fremdenfeindlichkeit: repressed and more subtle, but still there.

* Shouldn't have to fucking try so hard, that is the point.

Yeah, they should automatically give you full citizenship after 3 years without you even having to ask for it, right? With some government official kowtowing and saying pretty please with cherries on top

* Most other countries give the vote to people who have been in residence
* for a specific number of years.

Oh really? Got any examples? Most other countries I can think of don't do that.

* That would never happen in a million years in Germany. It's the old
* Fremdenfeindlichkeit: repressed and more subtle, but still there

You poor opressed victim.

I'm not defending the German immigration laws, but the 'Don't bother me with facts, I already made up my mind...' attitude doesn't make much sense to me. If you don't want German citizenship then what's the point in complaining?