Apartment mildew and problem landlord

Dear all,

I think this is the best place to get some suggestions for my problem.

Let me brief the problem.

I found the apt which I am currently staying through some advertisement in the news paper . And I have signed a contract with the owner for one year

During end of Nov there were some small patches formed on one of the wall just near the window, and later on I realized that these were called as mildews, which I have not come across in my whole life.
I contacted my apt owner for this and he suggested to ventilate the house by opening the windows for some time and I followed the same and this was reduced.

Now my apt owner is saying that, I need to paint the whole apt for this reason.

I had also signed an contract with the insurance and tried to get my apt owners claim through them. But the insurance people did not approve my claim saying that this problem could have been there before Nov.

My owner is insisting me to renovate the whole apt on my own ( he had sent some estimates from one painter which he knew ) and it comes about 1000 Euros.

Can any of you please suggest me how to proceed in this regard ?

I am not aware of German laws as I am not sure its my responsibility or the owners responsiblity to correct this. Because I think its happening due to the construction of apt as there is less insulation to the cold area.

Thanks heaps in advance.
unayak

Tell the bastard to go "F" himself... And should you WANT to paint the place (Not required) get your own estimates/people to do it as the Landlord might be getting kickbacks from his painter friends..

check this link and others from it. do NOT let your bastard landlord try and scam you, darkknight is quite right.

yes upn, go and join the mietverein immediately - many of the landlords here are complete bastards and will try anything on if they reckon they'll make a buck out of it.
good luck

What is it with landlords and painting?

I'm afraid I can't add anything useful here, but I do want to say I'm stunned at everything I'm hearing about problems of this nature, as we are having something similar (though not as serious) at the moment. Thankfully it does seem to be true that tenants here are well protected by the law so as already said, don't do anything without some proper legal advice.

I wish you all the best with this upn - this stuff makes me so angry.

Thanks a lot for all your suggestions..

More over he is insisting me to do it fast, otherwise he would send me an additional invoice if he wont find a next tennat soon.

I really dont understand how to proceed in this regard.

Hi,

in a lot of contracts there are paragraphs telling you to regularly vent your appartement, especially during the winter time. Two times a day is appropriate. Of course you all do this, and you should always mention this if there is any question. Even if it is not part of your contract. There is judgement telling that everybody has to know that to regularly vent and to properly heat the appartement.
The situation is quite delicate, because the burden of proof is difficult to handle. Here for your landlord. There is no must for you to renovate the appartement, in my opinion. It can be the owners fault, due to the bad isolation you mentioned. If you regularly vented, as you did of course, it can lead even to the situation, where you pay less rent, because of "Mängel an der Wohnsache". But again in this case there is the problem of the burden of proof, now on your side.

It would be helpful to see your contract. PM me, maybe.

We had the same situation in our last Munich apartment - and as I remember, it is the owner's responsibilty to solve mildew issues.

There's a group in Munich that deals with Renter's rights - I don't have the number off-hand ... Anyone know it?

You seem to be feeling very pressured upn, I understand this but take a deep breath and remember you are in a good position here,

Don't let him in to do any work and don't let his threats about invoices frighten you.

Take time off work tomorrow morning to do something about this.

If you find it comes to having to get a lawyer, one has been suggested on the thread 'apartment rental deposit release form' in the 'life in Munich' section. A letter in German mentioning legal proceedings might scare him off, and if not you'll have the advice you need.

ok?

Actually, Darkknight (and others) could be completely wrong. People are often too quick to jump onto the backs of Landlords. Mildew is a mould-like growth that can thrive on any organic matter and can appear on clothing, leather, paper, and the ceilings, walls and floors of many homes. It's propogated by poor ventilation, high humidity and wide variations in ambient temperature. It's not normally related to any construction or building issue (which would be a Landlord problem), but an environmental problem. created b the tenant or their lifestyle ( I assume here that this is NOT a new building, and has no history of such problems). This means the problem is almost certainly nothing to do with the landlord, but the tenant, who may not be you, but possibly a previous resident. The problem is that the origin is difficult to prove. It might be that the previous tennant had the same problem but painted it over when he left, and now it has re-occurred. Once it actually has taken hold ventilation, etc., will only prevent mildew spreading. It needs treating first to actually kill it, usually with a spray or anti-mildew paint, then care needs to be taken to prevent re-occurrance. Who is responsible for this is a moot point, but the problem from the landlords eyes is that it is there now, he knows about it and you are living there, and therefore in his veiw responsible.

Personally I'd take care now to eliminate it with treatment, and prevent further occurances by attention to ventilation and heating. At the end of your stay in the apartment you will presumably need to renovate to some extent at your own extent, to bring the place back to the same state it was when you arrived (although this does depend on the rental contract) - wether or not you have to do the whole apartment should be refelcted in your rental contract, and the state when you are ready to leave, compared to when you arrived. It's up to you how you do it or who you use, so long as the Landlord is satisfied (and then, if there is a dispute, is the time to bring in the legal know-alls). In the meantime it would certainly join a Mietverein or get legal insurance, so if you do have problems later you have someone to support you... It's never a good idea (and not often possible) to get such cover at the same time as you need to claim on it...

YL6

Glad you had the disclaimer "could be". The mold spores are everywhere here. It has exactly to do with the climate and weather. It will only grow where it is damp and that is why it is usually associated with the bath/shower area. Dampness in buildings has everything to do with construction issues. The mold usually starts growing out of sight behind poorly done caulking (bathroom and kitchen), sealing (especially around windows), those crap sheets on walls here and in damp basements. It needs a source of food and that is the underlying wood. Ventilation does nothing to help outside of drying things (weather permitting) and actually lets more spores in as well as the humidity they need to germinate. Once mold sets in somewhere, it has to be killed before any renovation of the affected area can be accomplished and this is not an easy thing to do. Simply painting over it, as was probably done in this case prior, will not rectify the situation and the mold will reappear in several weeks to several months. If you can see a large patch of mold growing on the wall near the window, then it has probably been there for years and has only been covered up from time to time. The only way to kill mold is by chemicals or dessication (drying out).

I need a sign off like others. Perhaps Humpf.

Gee, did you move into my old apartment? If your apartment is on Luisenstraße, let's talk.

The same thing happened to me - but I really, really don't think it had to do with our lifestyle. We vented and heated all rooms regularly. An expert came to look at the situation and he was able to determine that it was a structural problem - one wall used to have windows, then it was covered up and the windows (glass bricks) were painted over, but without any kind of insulation. We were able to measure the temperature of the wall and the dampness (is there a better word for that?), and this wall was significantly colder and damper than the other walls.

The landlord kept insisting that it was our fault (near the end there were huge patches of mold on the walls). We moved out and instead of taking him to court we wimped out and just took part of the deposit back. I know that we should have followed through but we just didn't have the time or money.

We got some help from the Bauzentrum - here's the link.

Give them a call and see if they can help. Good luck - but you should really get out of there ASAP. Mold is dangerous. An alternative way to get out of your apartment fast is to go to an HNO doctor and have an allergy test. If you're allergic to mold or mites you should be able to get out of your rental contract quickly.

I won't go into the technical details of how mold can occur, but I will advise you to contact the meiterverine to find out the "Correct" info.
on this type of situation and the painting thing..

Ok, well Darknight meant "Mieterverein e.V." I think. Use Google to get more details about their address.

Well, you just moved in and then that kinda problem somehow showed up, all I can say is really... ??? From my point of view that kinda problem already existed, maybe somebody else was already painting the apartment more than once before you moved in. Just a thought... Otherwise, seriously it doesn't make sense...
Personally I think you should contact the "Mieterverein", I am sure they are working together with quite a few experts when it comes up to these kinda questions.

Give it a try, information you get there might solve your problem.

Will

I beg to differ. I don't know anyone in Germany who *hasn't* had a constant battle with mold. I think it's exactly due to the construction standards here in Germany and the thick cement walls. I did everything in my power to prevent mold, and it still ran black up my walls around every window and glass door. Fortunately, my landlord didn't give me any trouble over it and gave me my whole deposit back.

Heres the link to the people/info you need

Renters & Home Owners Rights

@ Interplanetjanet

I disagree... Sorry, there are different types of buildings & construction all over Germany. Been almost eveywhere in this country and even if this weren't the case it's a matter of fact, never heard about this kinda problem before. Well, maybe once, but still... too many people out there not complaining about it. Wonder why? Yeah well, maybe because there is NO problem or maybe if there was a problem, it was solved in the meantime. Any neighbours living next door / co-workers maybe having a similar problem?? Never heard about it, did ya? Not everything is bad in this country, otherwise there would be only a little crowd of expats over here, I think, mean if it's that bad??? Facts, please... Hope it's not necessary to start a poll : blink :

Seriously, I don't think many people ever had such a problem over ere, otherwise we might have heard about it mainly in the mornings I guess, quite a few newspapers in town might have been interested in these kinda stories, don't ya think??
Whatever. Just saying...

Wow, willow, no need to get so excited about it. You're making a big assumption by saying that I think everything about Germany is bad just because I said the mold problem is common. Don't be so silly...or so condescending.

If you think I'm the only one, then read Excessive moisture in the apartment.

@ Interplanetjanet

Not a big deal really as I said, last sentence said "just saying". Maybe you overlooked that.
There are other things in this world to worry about... Not really worth to waste too much energy on this conversation I think.

Told ya about me point of view, you told us about your point of view, that's it, fine. End of story I think, what everybody else thinks or makes out of it: their business, OK? Not interested in a handbag thingy. Never was...

I was just telling you about my impressions which are obviously different, that's all.

Um...right. How could I have interpreted this as anything else:

\beginmode{sarcasm}
I guess I misinterpreted that.
\endmode{sarcasm}

Just saying.

Anyway, it IS important whether or not it is a common problem, because if upn can show that it is due to the construction style, it is not his problem.

@ Interplanetjanet

What I meant was "I never heard about it, did you...?" Forgot the "I". No offence, it was just a question.
Not a big deal as I said before.

Every flat in my building has the problem in the bathroom, its especially bad in my place because the mould was merely painted over before I moved in. The fan in the bathroom doesnt seem strong enough I guess. And I usually have the door open to get air flowing through. I have gotten rid of most of it though with anti-schimmel, but it keeps coming back. Just have to live with it I guess.

I don't believe that Kza posted on a boring normal post.

One small bit to keep this post nearly on topic, this is a much bigger problem for ground floor appartments, so if it's a choice next time between the ground floor or higher up, everything else being equal, take the one higher up.

Yes, we moved from ground floor (where anything left on the solid concrete bedroom floor for more than a couple of days turned into a ball of black fur) to brick built attic. lovely and dry.

Hope upn gone to get some help today though- This has gone way past talking about mildew, the real problem here is the pressure upn is getting from his landlord to pay EUR 1000 for a pointless paint job, with threats of more charges if he doesn't agree.

Not just that, but his response was pretty lifeless too. Maybe someone broke into his TT account...

Yeah used the wrong account, sorry about that.

Isnt there anyway to get the insurance company to pay for it???

Can you even get insurance for using the wrong account?