Bedienungsgeld and Trinkgeld

On my Gutscheine for the Wies'n it says that Bedienungsgeld is included in the price. However, I read that Bedienungsgeld is not the same thing as Trinkgeld (a tip) and we should tip on top.
As I've never been in a beer tent at the Wies'n before, I'd like to know:
*what is B.geld ?
*how much does one usually tip, if it all?
I found this Tipping at Oktoberfest - And how much do staff earn anyway? but it doesn't really answer my questions.
Thanks.

Bedienungsgeld is what is included in the price of what you order and is split amoung all employees and added on to your paycheck (I think). It will specify on your menu whether it's included in the price, it is a common misconception that all restaurant prices include bedienungsgeld. They do not.

Trinkgeld is a tip.

Many people believe they are the same thing and therefore rationalise leaving really small tips.

Having worked in the industry here I generally leave a generous tip.

well, the tickets are are the same price as a standard beer and a händl etc, so logic would dictatet that if a tip is not included in the standard price it is not going to be included in the voucher.

But to answer your question: Bedienungsgeld means the price of the beer includes the charge for waitress serving you. A tip is a gratuity and is always on top. Service (Bedienungsgeld) is generally included all over Europe, whereas tips are not, and vary in their amount from country to country. I would tip quite well for the first couple of rounds at the Wiesn, just to be sure she somes back.

So what's classed as a 'small' tip and a 'large' tip? €1 per drink? More?
So Bedienungsgeld must be what Keydeck said was the service money.

Can't you go to the bar and get a drink yourself? Not sure if the waiter/waitress would bring me a Spezi

The waitresses at the Wies'n make their official money by buying beer at (say) €6,50 a litre from the barrell and selling it to you at the table for €7.00

The difference is the Bedienungsgeld. You usually never see it becasue the tents ONLY sell beer (and Spezi) via the waitresses at the gross (€7,00 for example) price.

On the ticket you have, the waitress will rip it in half give the bit for €6,50 to get beer and cash in the €0,50 for herself for her labour.

A tip (trinkgeld) on top is up to you. I'm relatively tight, but strategic tipping at the Wies's is a good long term strategy for a whole session. Though not something OTT casue it causes "tip inflation" where waiting staff expect 20% on everything.

I'd orientate at maybe not more than €1 per mass, less if you are ordering a big round.

no its not. the waiting staff just recieve their standard wages in normal situations but (here comes the edit) as MT says, the Wiesn staff work on "commission".


correct. and it usually is in Europe


correct


some people do, you are right. Some people also rationalise that they are indeed paid to do their job. I don't get any tips for performing the job I get paid for either. My rationalisation for when i don't leave a tip is not that they are the same thing. I just don't tip for lousy service or bad food.

Good leprosy gag in here somewhere.

Havent you been to the wiesn before? Nah theres no bar, but yes the waitresses do bring spezis.

thats a bit too much . normally you just round it up,but this year with a mass costing 7.10 .best to order a round of 4 masses thats 28.40 and round it off to 29 euro or if you are generous 30 euro.

Service staff count on tips as a part of their wage as wages can be extremely low (€6,00 per hour). Further, in many restaurants you have to tip out your kitchen as a percentage of sales, if you don't leave a tip your waitress is essentially paying to serve you.

I don't think rounding €7,10 up to €8,00 is in any way excessive.

speak for yourself.the waitresses get 10% commission on food and drinks. most round it up to 7.50 or 8 without asking you.they should never assume!if i get good service then the tip gets better after a few masses.

If I am sitting at a table, and somebody brings me my booze in a timely fashion, I'll tip. What gets my goat is places where you cannot order yourself a beer at a bar, you HAVE to get served at the table. Then I will not tip, unless they bring me beer at my rate of drinking, IE when one beer is finished, I don't wanna sit about for 15 effing minutes waiting for the next. Chop chop.

umm I was speaking for myself, hence the "I don't think . . ."

then my apologises

This has been argued over a milion times and OG summarises the general European I think.

Without asking people to name names, what are the hourly wages as a waitres nowadays? 10 years ago would have been €5,00 - € 7,50. I certainly hear of (non-tipped) casual catering work going for € 10 cash nowadays

@ Don Riina, You are right it is for good service, I object to some of the 45 minute waits I've expereinced at the Wies'n which have me reaching for the hip flask!

I worked in a fairly nice bar and made €6,00 per hour, plus tips, no bedienungsgeld. I don't know but assume that is at least somewhat representative.

Don't waiters (not necessarily speaking about Wiesn) in Germany get pad a lot more per hour than in the US? I always thought that in the US you are supposed to tip cause they are only making minimum wage.

Edit: Silva, you posted at the same time as me. Is that wage representative of the market?

Edit^2: No you didn't. I am actually blind.

Unless I was desperate for something for a short while I would not work for €6.00 an hour (cash) + tips. It is a rip-off and assumes that the cost of living in Munich hasn't risen how it has in the last 10 years and based on the American tip concept that simply doesn't work here in most catering outlets.

i would suggest that 6 bucks an hour is way under "normal". Though I have not worked in the service industry for a while.

I don't know how representative that figure is, it may be on the lower end but can't be too far off. The owner of the bar I worked at owns several other bars in Munich and the pay scale was similar. All of his bars and restaurants are average to above average in price and atmosphere.

Desperate indeed.

When I worked in a bar 7 years ago the pay was 12DM (nearly 6 euro). I sometimes made 100 DM/night tips there as well. You were getting seriously underpaid Silva

Regardless, this is what some (perhaps not all) of your waitstaff are making.

Keep it in mind next time you decide not to leave a tip.

why is it that some people get tips for doing the job they are paid to do, yet others aren't? I mean, you don't tip in McDonalds, yet you are expected to tip in a bar, even if you go and get the drink yourself.

OG:

the statement is actually not quite right. Even if you share tips, the waitress is not paying to bring the food if you don't tip. It just means neither she nor the kitchen staff have anything to share.

Still, it doesn't answer my question. Wages are shitty in McDs yet they don't get tips. neither does the postman.

for a beer at the wiesn, yes. i'd round up to €7,50. 'course the ladies don't like to carry change. but my suggestion too is to tip well at the beginning to be assured she comes around more often.

but we are told in germany, a 10% tip on food and drinks is normal or just round up. i always tip well because i can empathize.

i worked my way through college in the u.s. as a waitress and i started out at $2.35 an hour (granted this was 10 years ago). this was minimum wage for the restaurant industry. only in oregon, where they had a minimum wage, did i make $4.25 an hour.

C'mon, throw in a buck!

Glad you see you were getting paid at the low end of the going rate and you did it out of need for the money. However I'm not going to tip on the possibility that maybe the waiting staff are underpaid. Even if I KNOW they are low paid I don't want to get drawn into the USA system.

Though I do tip for GOOD service, IF I can afford it and in the mood.

Silva, in SOME catering establishments in Europe the waiting staff split off a share of their tips to the bussers and bar staff but I have NEVER come across it going to kitchen staff and I've been around a bit, in catering.

Sure it does, you tip out the kitchen a percentage (say 3%) of what you sell. You have to pay this regardless of whether you get a tip or not.

i very rarely give a tip if i am getting a drink at the bar.Good point do you give a tip when you are in a supermarket,buying shoes,tickets or even at the tourist information where they give good service and the list goes on and on...

Silva, I have worked as a waiter in many places. I have never had to give a % of sales to the kitchen. In some places, but not all, we did share tips with the kitchen.

Edit: sounds like a real rip-off place you worked for.

Once we get a seat, if the service person is halfway on the ball i seriously overtip on the first Mass, and ask them to keep an eye on us. They will, too. The rest of the drinks are tipped on the rounding up principle (at same rate as the Bavarians, not OTT), and at the end of the evening one generous tip as a thank you, and the hope i'll be remembered next time (next day?) -- and when all tables are full, the wait/er/ess will actually toss people out to get you and your crowd a seat.

If i have a whole table w/ 10 people, i'd give Eur 20 up front. If you're then tipping 0,50 per beer (that's one mark remember!) afterwards, it's ok, and an occasional rounding up more doesnt hurt. Bad service? no tip, but say so, if you were generous up front. Hello!

Loyalty is also rewarded when tents are closed -- there are back doors and side doors where doormen will let you -- only you -- in, if you can cite the waitress's name and table number.

Many's the time I've wondered how bad does the service have to get before the customer should feel entitled to a tip ?

You mean like getting friendly, timely service?

the same as in the u.s., though not at all restaurants. when i was training as a hostess, the waitresses had to tip us a percent too. some nights i went home with more than they did cause they HAD to pay me a percentage regardless if they got tipped or not.

That's a different way of being paid, on commission and yes it happens in Munich:

The waiter gets X% of the wallet at the end of the night but a minimum pf X € / hour plus any tips they make and the dispensation of drinks from the bar is recorded.

The practice of waiting staff HAVING to pay a % of their wallet take to the kitchen as a tip would be illegal in Europe, possibly under the same legislation as pyramid selling.

The "friendly timely" service you get in the USA is partly becasue the staff have to "hustle for the tips". I work as a volunteer barmen for no pay and no tips for a co-operative pub in Munich. I get few complaints and yes, I've even had TTers as customers.

Excellent advice. I agree completely, and doing it has stood me in good stead at many a Wiesn.

I have a real problem tipping in advance to, in effect, bribe someone to perform a service they are being payed to do. I have no problem with tipping someone for exceptional and swift service. Yet at the Wiesn, it seems to have become the norm to bribe the waitresses, so you either follow suit or go thirsty. Still, I don't think it is right, even if I also do it.

Excellent advice indeed.


When I'm in charge of the kitchen, tips are split evenly amongst all staff (though on a bad night, I usually used to let them split without me). As Monksy says though, it ain't exactly a normal thang. One place I worked did not split tips with the kitchen, but the boss (who worked out front) always took a cut. I simply decided to reward myself based on performance through the simple act of common theft from the store cupboards. Hurrah.

the way everybody is going on , it seems like its like gold dust getting a beer at the wie'sn.the sharp eye waitresses are always on a lookout for anyone with a empty mass within the area where they can sell.

yeah, exactly. The % of sales being split is on top of the salary. You make the sale, both you and the kitchen staff benefit, you don't pay the kithen staff out of your own pocket. and it certainly matters not, whether you get a tip or not.

And the % of the wallet is almost always what the waiting staff gets rather than the "safety net" of X € / hour. In a well known dipenser of beverages in inner Munich with which I am aquainted the X / € and hour rate might only kick in once ot twice a year.

Sorry I left the discussion so early; left work.
So from what I understood, giving the waiter/waitress my Gutschein and 50c or so will be fine.
@Coolerking - thx for the advice, but I have Gutscheine, so obviously can't buy a round of 4 mass and round up.

@Kza - I quote from the very first thread on this post, to answer your question "As I've never been in a beer tent at the Wies'n before[...]".

Thanks everyone for the info. I'll keep my opinions to myself on tipping on top of Bedienungsgeld I think

When I'm paying with one of those "split tickets" I usually give (say) € 1 on the first beer, nothing on the second but tip again when I start paying cash on the third. It's a balance isn't it that depends on how the karma flows.

Roughly 7,50-8€ a Maß, 15€ for 2, 22-23€ for 3 and 29€ for 4 but more likely 30€.
An initial tip on the high side is a good plan - I've only ever had success with that.
MonksTown is a fine barman, he plays top music and will hand out Haribo to the needy