Trying to save a relationship

well, that's better news than last time you updated us
it looks like all is not lost, then
it might work out in the end

While hormones may be having an effect it seems counterintuitive that a woman would want to sabotage her means of support so close to the birth of her child. Isn't that normally the time when we become grasping and clingy?

Not necessarily.
In the animal kingdom, many types of animal actively choose to give birth in seclusion as a method of protection.
Some folk are clingy, some detach.
Good luck in any case DMW.

Yeh Katrina's right - lotta animals do that ... so if she starts tearing up newspapers anytime soon then... WTF???

Hormones ceased to be an excuse for shitty behaviour couple of thousand years ago I believe...

Anyway DMW as always best of luck

Parnell, you have to work at your exams and you must really work at your image of women! Good luck to you as well my friend. Let me tell you, although I've never been pregnant I just have to think about what women havt to go through once a month, every month, the way we sometimes feel.. I can imagine that many women have these problems and excuse me for being this direct on a forum, but I'm not ashamed of our gender: we do have hormonal problems real often. If a normal cycle can cause discomfort to a woman I could very well imagine how hard it must be to carry out a full pregnancy.

@DMW

It might seem strange but living apart may actually save your relationship. I'm sure that the pressure to confirm to the "living in the same house family" image has contributed to many break-ups. Some people just prefer living on their own.

Again good luck and hope the pregnancy goes well.

maybe it is best to let her do as she wishes. Probably make things worse to try and stop her

Bloody hell, I though Jesus died for our sins, not to sort out PMT or what have you.

I wasn't condoning anybody's behaviour, I'm just talking about the end result.

Extremely stubborn picky people (no talking about anyone I know) can be hell to live with and can be much happier living alone. I, for one, definitely need a serious amount of my own space.

Everyone needs their space. When you live together you just need to find it somehow by pursuing other activities. Space can also mean your partner leaves you to do your own thing or shuts up when you're watching your football. I don't see why people must live in separate abodes so that they can have their space.

its one thing to need/want/demand space when you only have to look after yourself but kids brings a bit of a different dimension and add responsibilities to the equation though

@Ulysses

You can't always leave the house or apartment, nor may you want to. Neither can everybody afford to have a room for each person. If kids are around the place then they tend to permeate the whole place anyway. Which is a good thing, it just may not suit everybody.

It's not just about physical space.

DMW,
I'm glad to hear you were able to ask directly about the massage teacher. I think having got this far you could ask a few more questions, in or outside the counselling sessions. Also, good to hear she wants you there for the scans and you have been able to share this with her.

If your girlfriend really isn't seeing someone else then her motives for moving out are quite hard to comprehend. The comments about needing space are valid but it still strikes me as strange that she is needing space at this particular time when she has a toddler and another on the way. It seems an unlikely choice - to become a single parent - with 2 very young children and I suspect she hasn't really thought it through. This is why I think it is time for a few well thought out questions.

There is much that I would like to ask her but the problem is that I don't know whether or not she is being 100% honest with me. Even the consellor said in the last session that she has a problem with telling the truth or whole story, which she promptly blamed on me.
So maybe moving out is a way for her to get some freedom to test another relationship with that guy. It also makes it look like she is free.

My older brother's wife just walked out on him - totally came out of the sunlight for him - sucker punch. 2 young kids. She says no other guy involved, she just needs to "stop living a lie and be herself". I guess relationships are tough.

Not maybe DMW, definitely

It's not uncommon for women to fall for teachers and authority figures. A teacher is in a position of power over her which is indicative of some sort of elevated status. She's in a vulnerable, hormonal state making her even more susceptible to these kinds of (perceived) influences.

From my own experience if you put very average men on stage, in front of audiences or in positions of power they suddenly become much more desirable.

John2005, are you listening to this?

No truer word !

@Yeti

I was indeed talking about both types of space.

@DMW

It's probably been said already or your probably already know it and it's the most difficult thing in the world to do, but there's a saying "If you love something let it go. If it's yours, it'll come back. If it doesn't, it never was." All I can say is, they've never once come back to me! I can also add though that today I'm glad I let go.

Well best of luck to you...who was blaming you for the problem telling the truth, your gf or the counsellor?

You need to set some boundaries here. Be clear that if you visit you are visiting to see your son as he is the one who needs to maintain a relationship with you. Make arrangements and stick to them. He will only get more confused if his routine is consantly changing.

Or the alternative:

If you love something let it go. If it's yours, it'll come back. If it doesn't, hunt it down and kill it.

Yeah, it's interesting sometimes looking back at the people in your life that you "let go". But DMW has kids. Still, giving her space is the best thing currently.

If you love something let it go. If it's yours, it'll come back. If it doesn't, it's broken.

(Grosse Pont Blank)

My girlfriend blamed me for making her not tell the truth...

Space is nice to have but unlikely if you are living on your own with two kids under 3.

See, told you she's not thinking straight!

Keep going to those appointments. She needs the help.

I would fight for the children. Sometimes, it's better not to though for their sake. You can just live and hope that they will realise the huge sacrifice you made when they're older and not screwed up because they witnessed their parents hurling abuse at each other at a young age. They may even realise how selfish their mother was...

I'm starting to feel a bit defensive for DMW's girlfriend. You all seem to assume she's got a problem. DMW seems like a nice guy, and may even be Prince Charming, for all we know, but that doesn't mean she's going to love him, or is even abnormal for not loving him. Love doesn't turn up or hang around for our convenience. She feels the way she feels right now, and he's just got to respect that. You can't force it.

...and all this time I was actually trying to help guys get laid. Whoda thunk?

@Kat

You're right and you're wrong. That great feeling at the beginning eventually disappears and then it's a hard grind from then onwards. With the media these days, I think there're too many people who think it's "and so they lived happily ever after". What a load of boulderdash!

As someone who has met DMW in real life, I can endorse to the fact that he is prince charming

think you have been in the wrong relationships!

Why thank you roots Kat has also met me in real life; I guess she just hasn't figured out who I am yet.

Well now I am curious. (Hope it doesn't kill me.)

Sorry I had to leave the Arc so quickly last night, but I was feeling a bit worse for wear and I knew I had to get up early for work today.

#430 I don't like to judge a woman I have never met, but yes I think dishonesty in a relationship when the stakes are so high is a problem and one which can be addressed in counselling sessions. Maybe she does need to leave, stand outside for a while and look at what she's got to work out whether it's what she wants.

Couples can find themselves trusting each other again after going through a bad patch but this can only happen if they are able to be completely truthful. DMWs girlfriend may decide she wants to end the relationship but putting the blame on him for her shortcomings will not help her move on.

Well, she should find out this week or early next week if she has the flat or not. Then I guess she has to explain that she is moving out to our son and taking me along. I know he won't be happy not having me around. He is just getting to the stage where he is moving further away from his mother and trying to be more like me.

As far as fairness is concerned, it's a shame we don't get to hear her side of the story. Though I'm sure DMW doesn't have the impression that we're making unbiased judgments!

BTW how come she gets to take the kid? Do I remember you saying something about not wanting to put the stress of a custody fight on him right now? Just for confirmation.

I would love to have custody of my son but what court is going to award me custody when we aren't even married. She has all the rights when it comes to who gets the kids.

Have you checked out the custody thing DMW ? If you are the registered father then you should have equal custody rights.

And if you're not, I believe you don't have to pay child support.

I registered as the father but she never signed up to allow me equal parenting rights.

Oh dear. That doesn't sound good at all.
OK I hope I don't sound harsh here but...
Any way you could barter (for want of a better word) this out as an exchange? If she signs the Sorgeerklärung stuff with the Jugendamt, you'll drop the opposition to her moving?
As a tactical measure.

I doubt she would at this stage. She is in a position of strength and I can't see her giving up that too easily.

I thought you don't get one form without the other. Don't give her any money if you don't get to see the kid, simple enough. As long as you haven't been abusive that should be no problem.

Aye, she's got yer by the bollocks and no mistake.
You really need to bring this up at your next session and try and find some sort of agreement on it because otherwise...God, what a mess.

Oh she will be fine financially if she moves out. she has already worked out how much she will get from the government, so she doen't even need my money if I threatened to withold it.

Get in touch with some father's rights organizations then. You do have rights, don't assume she knows her way around the system better than you can if you inform yourself!

But I don't want to get too confrontational yet while there is a chance that we can solve this. If it breaks down completely I will take that route. I'll try to find out some info on it beforehand so I can at least be prepared for the worst.