How to reply in German to complaining neighbours

Ok so I know the quiet kids thing has been discussed to death but I need some good one liners (nothing too rude yet!) to tell my neighbour where to go...

My kids - 2 boys aged 4 and 2 are quite noisy I'll give you that, but for her to suggest I need to take them to a park and not let them play in their own garden because they are ruining her peace and quiet is too much.

She has a thing about them shreiking - but the 2 year old can't talk so it's his only way of replying.

I usually keep them inside with the doors shut till around 3pm but it's now gone 4pm and I've just had a mouthful and feel completely powerless as to how to respond.

Any suggestions as to what I can say?

Thanks

I know there are laws stating the children are allowed to make certain levels of noise within an apartment. I would print it and highlight it and tape it to her door.

See if your lease states anything, or the house rules.

That said there are also certain time frames kids are not allowed to make noise and play outside I believe 1-3, not 100% though.

I'm aware of the quiet times - so generally they're not outside. We;re in a detached house so it's just when they're in the garden its a prob - but of course like today the weather's great and everybody wants to be out.

Quite frankly her smoking by my hedge makes me cross as it drifts into my garden - perhaps I should complain about that too!

I sure would.

Any good German would have called the polizei on her by now or at least complained to the hausmeister

Take your kids round to her, introduce them to her and explain to them in front of her, that they should keep the noise down or they will disturb this nice lady.
The next time they make the inevitable racket, she might feel less inclined to complain, seeing as you are all nice people and that.

If you're in a detached house, your boys can make all the noise they want until 10:00 p.m. From my cursory research at essen.de (here, for example), there's no Mittagsruhe for individuals aside from Sundays and holidays.

So feel free to tell her to take a flying feck at a rolling donut.

This genuinely isn't been antagonistic, but is it worth compromising a bit a taking them to the park for an hour or so. While I see why this situation would get your back up living in any community is always give and take, and you have said they are quite noisy. Another suggestion. If your two year old is communicating through shrieking have you thought about using baby sign language. It is based on Makaton (sp) and relies on big movements, and is very good for that stage when children get frustrated because they can't talk properly.
Ian's suggestion is good too. The thing is while you can legally make noise till ten, sometimes finding a way round it and making life a bit easier is better. Just my views.

Some info here http://www.babycentre.co.uk/baby/developme...nt/babysigning/

If she comes round again suggest she does your housework and prepares dinner for you while you go to the park with the boys.

"hau ab, schlampe" (Oh you said nothing too rude - then, 'abhauen sie bitte' )

I'll just add to this - they are not around in the mornings - big one at kiga little one fine on his own.

Then, they don't go out till after lunch - not till post the 3pm deadline

The come 5pm they're in for tea and bed - small one asleep by 6.30 other one doing quiet things inside.

Not sure really how much more time I can and ought to compromise on quite frankly!

To reiterate, the "quiet time" from 1-3 p.m. applies to industrial noise emissions only, not to residences (unless you're operating power gardening equipment or the like). It does not prevent your kids from playing in the yard.

The next time she comes around, just shrug your shoulders and roll your eyes in exasperation and say "Tja, Jungs - was will man machen?"

Then maybe she needs to compromise if its only a couple of hours. My mistake I got the impression they were round all day making noise.

Shall I come over for a few days with my Jack Russell? She loves playing with kids, and it involves lots of barking.

Probably the best response I've heard used by a parent is:
"I have gotten legal advice and been told that according to German law young children are allowed to play in their own backyard during the afternoon. Feel free to ask your own lawyer for his opinion."

You can't compromise and shouldn't need to. Neighbour is out of order - send her to the park instead.

Summer holidays are coming up - invite all their friends and send them all out to play in the garden from dawn til dusk - then she'll have something to complain about.

That's what I think as well. We were in a detached house in Germany, and ALL the kids in the neighborhood made lots of noise while outside in their gardens. It's what kids do.

I laughed at your shrieking comment... my son would shriek with joy (rarely, as he didn't much like DE compared to home)), and the Germans would complain. I guess they'd rather a grumpy kid.

He is quite happy to be home, where no one cares about his noise -- in fact, our next door neighbors now have chickens! Rooster noise, GASP!

Better: "Feel free to ask your own lawyer to confirm this opinion."

Yep, you're right... that's much better!

Unfortunately for your neighbours, it needs to be the other way, koala's right. They want quiet, they shut their windows.

I have it a bit the opposite. I've older neighbours who feel the need to stand about two metres from my terrace and bellow at each other. Occasionally, I do ask them if they'd mind being quiet but, otherwise, I just leave it and shut my windows. And there's a a noisy small kid next door (who sometimes runs round my land, which I do put a stop to because that's clear). However, said neighbours are nice enough, these are just particular traits or circumstances.

Sometimes life is just random - including who you get as neighbours. Some people have kids etc, others don't. You could try suggesting your neighbours learn to "give and take" but it probably won't work. I'd not argue legals with them unless they start it first. No need for *you* to escalate things. Tell them you are just getting on with life. Then let it go. What can they do?

Not only CAN she compromise, she can be required to. That kids scream on occasion is one thing, but constant screaming is another matter entirely. And if a neighbour has a baby, the newborn's rights to and need for quiet trump, as can certain other medical conditions.

You do wonders when you show your neighbours just a little fucking respect and try to work out a compromise.

woof.

What can they do? If they want to be nasty, they can report you to the authorities. Even if groundless, it could end up giving you lots of aggravation as the social workers come over to check out conditions at your house, interview other neighbours and perhaps even teachers. After the last few very public cases of child abuse, the gov't is now taking complaints very seriously.

But if you make it clear from the beginning that you already have legal counsel... a lawyer or legal insurance, then the neighbours are less likely to make a frivolous complaint or cause any serious trouble. I've managed to cut short quite a few complaining neighbours just by mentioning that I have legal insurance in an off-hand way. But that was at my old place. Thankfully my current neighbours have been great since we moved to our house almost two years ago.

@BD

No no newborn - they're a retired couple...

And it's not constant - I couldn't cope with that and wouldn't expect anybody else to!

Why constantly resort to legal threats, which doesn't exactly make for a condusive environment to live? Surely its easier to work it out between you. If I'm working on my bikes, which can be noisy, then I always say to the neighbours when I see them that if it gets too loud to say something. I don't go up to them and say "I can legally make noise till 10 so if you don't like it get legal representation" Seriously chill out and talk it over with her. Invite her round for a coffee and sort out a way that works for both of you. Even if she is being unreasonable by sitting down and talking you'll take the wind out of her sails. If you start being mouthy back and threatening legal action all you'll do is create bad feeling, and that sort of thing can fester for a long time.

I agree that at first you try to have a normal conversation and find a compromise that works for everyone. But when that doesn't work, then you need a Plan B. Many Germans have "call the police" as their Plan B. So you need to head that off before it gets that far. The OP has already tried normal conversation. The answer they've gotten is apparently that the neighbours don't want the children playing in the backyard AT ALL and they should instead go to the playground. Totally unacceptable.

They had a feature on disputes between neighbours recently on HR3, and the TV lawyer said that outside of the Ruhezeiten there's nothing you can do about noisy kids in the garden. I don't see how anyone can accuse the OP of refusal to compromise. In the original post it sounded like the neighbour was already ranting after just 1 hour of playtime. Sounds like the neigbour could use a lesson in tolerance.
If the kids are getting so excited that the noise levels are approaching airport runway levels it would probably be a good idea to get them indoors for a while until they calm down a bit, but it is completely unreasonable of the neighbour to suggest that you drop everything and disappear to the park, whenever it suits her.

I can really get all that to happen? Simply because I decide next door's three year old is too noisy for me, then all that *would* happen? Just because I feel like it? Or I can't listen to my favorite CD in peace?

No, sorry, don't think so.

See, this is what I meant be not "escalating it". This is exactly how it all gets out of control if you start talking legals. An old couple's concern about their peace and quiet - which may be perfectly reasonable on its own as most of us prefer quiet to noise - gets spun into being indirectly linked with child abuse (NO suggestion here of course, just saying this is what can happen if escalated not dampened).

Option 1)
Ich bemühe mich, die Ruhezeiten einzuhalten. Aber sie sind Kinder und müssen spielen dürfen, auch wenn es manchmal laut wird. Then give her the lawyer dope.

Option 2)
Meine Kinder sind laut, und Sie rauchen. Wenigstens kriegt man von Kinderlachen keinen Krebs.

fnar fnar

In the end of the day you really need to get on with your neighbors, no point calling the cops or getting legal action unless she does it first….. then I guess having nice neighbors is over.

Have you tried telling your kids not to shout all the time, they can still play in the garden without shouting the odd shriek or two is understandable…its like my dog he barks outside but when it gets excessive he is called in told off and let out again, kids dogs the same they need to know when to shut up…btw I have 2 kids as well grown up now though…I feel your pain but the worse thing is having rows with your neighbors, who knows one day you might need them. Compromise nothing like it….

You could ask her if she would rather you use the Fritzl method of child-rearing.

Yes, it's always better to maintain amicable relations with the neighbors - but if they keep on pissing and moaning about noise, you don't have to tolerate it. The law is on your side.

Yes, bake her cookies and give her earplugs... the gift that keeps on giving.

Personally, while I find barking dogs highly annoying, their shitting in my garden is even worse!! I'd take a shrieking kid over that, any day.

One of our German neighbors took/ trained their dog to OUR yard to shit, even though they have their own yard. I was very tempted to train Jr to piss on their front porch... but they were nice people, so I resisted.

You know you've already compromised. But your neighbour doesn't.

How about telling her exactly what you what you wrote here. And say that when the weather is fine you'd like the boys to be able to play in the garden for an hour or so in the afternoon (It's healthy, they sleep better at night, it's safer than the park and whatever other reasons you can think of). And then ask her which particular hour suits her best? Or, is there maybe a time when she is regularly out of the house so that the boys don't disturb her? If she suggests before 3 (and you want to) you can counter with but isn't that the Ruhezeit? Maybe the other neighbours will complain if I send them out in the Ruhezeit.

There is no Ruhezeit in Essen!

You've obviously never lived next to three neighbours, all with children, who were constantly fighting. It was usually two against one, but the "teams" kept changing. On two occasions we ended up having social workers in our building investigating two of the families.

You don't think so... but I've seen it happen. And just to put icing on the cake, the grandmother got mixed into a fight with her daughter (the third family involved in the fighting, a single mom with two young girls), and took her own daughter to court to successfully get custody of the older granddaughter. Just before we moved out, the grandmother "gave" the child back, saying she couldn't handle her. The original dispute in that case was over a car which the grandmother said was lent out and the daughter said was a gift.

I'm quite happy to be away from that building. Although I must admit that I rarely turned on my TV, since looking out my window always brought new episodes of the local soap opera. Had to do a bit of a tightrope walk to stay out of the whole messy situation, though. When one of the fathers threatened to bash my dog's head against a wall while in a drunken rage, we decided it was time to move.

She lives in a detached house and the boys are playing in the garden and provided they are not playing after 22:00, there is nothing the neighbour can do.

woof

@mlovett you have gone away she still lives here, I do love kids squealing its so refreshing and dogs playful barking but as they say when in Rome... there's nothing the OP says will change the old sour puss mentality that’s just the way it is here.

Why should the OP be on anyone’s agenda she just needs to tell her kids to be quiet now and then and hopefully its all good... that’s what I meant by compromise, I have learned when you are graceful and go out of your way to be nice to people….. they shit all over ya!!

She is already compromising by limiting the time her kids play outside to a few hours each day. Even in over regulated Germany kids are allowed to play outside and, yes, to make noise.

To the OP, have you asked the neighbours if they ever had kids and if so, did their kids spent all day sitting quietly in their rooms with their hands folded? You should not have to keep your children cooped up inside all day and they should not be banned from their own back yard. Next time she tells you to take your kids to the park to play, tell her to go for a walk in the local cemetery - I'm sure it's quiet there.

If everything fails maybe find a nice retirement home and recommend it to them - you can point out to them how quiet it is there.

Hi all.. first time poster and slightly within and off topic...

My husband and I have been living in Leipzig since Sept 08 and have always got on with the neighbours.. even when we got a puppy and she had to learn when to bark and not.

Problem now is that 2 new men have moved in upstairs and play music really loud.. at all hours. Now these men are not kids.. 40 year old +

The music is on all day and when it is not on in the day it is on at night.. and to be honest I am at my wits end. The other problem is that I am trying to keep the dog from barking at said music and thought I was doing a good job of doing that including sleeping on the sofa etc to keep her happy..

However, I was just confrunted by the neighbour next door who compalined that she barked in the middle of the night.. that I understand.. and I tried to explain that it was because of the music from upstairs. He replied that he cannot hear the music (how on earth not) and that my dog is too loud during "quiet time" because he works shifts. Now my husband works shifts as well and so I have to keep her amused while he sleeps including taking her to the park for long stints to wear her out.

Now the music upstairs is that loud that when I rang their doorbell to complain they either didn't hear it or chose to ignore it. (Incidently the name on the door hasn't changed just who is residing there).

Any ideas gladly appreciated.

TnT

@TNT
I was in a very similar situation once.
Best thing & first thing is always: talk to them directly. ring their doorbell again next morning, when they dont open at night. try to be friendly and explain that you cannot sleep etc. - I guess that should help in most of all cases.

In my case it didnt help, these guys were drunkheads and they just didnt care at all if the neighbors could sleep.
After talking to them 15 times, I finally contacted their landlord. The address of the landlord was given to me by the "Hausverwaltung". After the landlord had spoken to them, it was suprisingly quiet!

Good luck!

If your house is like mine, there may be a nice kind of cupboard downstairs in the cellar with everyone's power cut off switches in them.

If you live close enough that you could get downstairs, turn off the power and be back in your room before they can get out of their door...

Or just do it and hide somewhere...

On a more serious and less thin legal basis, have a word with the landlord. Failing that, if the noise is loud late and night call the police. You can always say you are worried something is wrong with the neighbor as the music has been like that for hours and they do not answer eh door.

In fact, do it every time and every time you see the neighbor ask them if they are ok - they may get sick of the attention. Or, maybe feel they need to be nice.

Failing that, wait until they leave and the superglue their door and lock! It is hard to turn your music on when you cannot get into the flat!

Very bad advise, you can have serious problems if you are caught.


Oh, I see, you are 16 years old.

Thanks for the suggestions.. although I dare say that if I tried the superglue I would end up with my fingers stuck to the door!!

@ Austriana - I think that the situations are very similar in that I just think that these guys don't care - and to the point being antagonistic on purpose. But thanks for the support.

I am in the process of drafting a letter to the landlord as I belive that it is the same management company for all the flats in the block. Failing that I have to say, with the attitude I got from next door, (and fuming about it all night) I am really thinking of moving, preferably where the nearest neighbour is not within 'sound' distance!

I live in a house that as far as I can tell is almost exclusively occupied by couples with young children. Our apartment is a Hochpattere with my bedroom at the back overlooking the communal yard. Ever since the first few days of warm weather, the whole yard becomes a kindergarten at approximately 15:30 when they all get back from school, and it's not just the screaming and crying, there is a fleet of fucking plastic tractors that make more noise than a Boeing 747 taking off when they're all being pushed around on the same piece of concrete at the same time.
Spare a thought for those of us who didn't feel the urgent need to procreate so far..

@krieg - you seem to have missed the irony of my post.

As well as the bit that says 'on a more serious note'.

How could you have missed this very important part of the post? Or did you choose ignore it as you couldn't think of anything else to post but were bursting to write something?

As you didn't actually write anything regarding the topic I think we can say - yes, you were just bursting to take part. Did they ever actualy let you play football at school or did you sit on the bench a lot?

This is too funny of a topic, I'm now scared. We will be arriving in Stuttgart in September and we are a loud family! I have 2 girls 3 and 4 years old oh did I mention we have two huge Alaskan Malamutes! Since I have been in Germany before and didn't have kids and everyone else did, they were all loud to me in fact I hated kids back then still do infact I only like mine!

I think the best thing to do is hold your head up high and smile and say "O.K." and carry on doing what your doing. People hate to be ignored...Do what the pengiuns do in Madagascar...

"Just smile and wave boys, just smile and wave!"