Experiences with Alice DSL

Hi,

I am brand new here. I had posted this in another thread, but I hope it is OK that I post it here too, since it seems like a relevant thread

We are in Berlin and read an article about how much DSL with D-Telekom was compared to others, so we started looking into it. We found Arcor was much cheaper and that we could have a 3000 flat rate for less then our 1000 flat rate now. We sent in our contract on Friday and yesterday my wife read how horrible Arcor's service is and that they have MANY outages We have also googled for some other reviews of Arcor and there are many bad ones!

We are sending in a letter and a fax to cancel our contract that we signed with Arcor and are now considering what to do. As you, we are very interested in Alice-dsl, but since they are so new, we are a bit gun shy

It would be really great to hear from some people that have had any experience with Alice!

TIA,
IE

Except up in Hamburg (as Hansanet) I don't think Alice has an installed base yet. They only started selling the product 2 weeks ago so are unlikely to have many (any?) installations yet...

On paper they look good, and their prices are attractive - at least their opening offers. I've spoken to their customer service and found them helpful and informed. This might not mean much - I also had similar experiences with Arcor 3 years ago when they started out...

YL6

And execpt for Hansanet and a few isolated pockets of major cities
ALL DSL providers resell DT Lines/service, only with the hassle of cust. service service probs.,long wait times and a few other "Gotcha's"

We have Arcor and have not experienced any outages. The down side is their lack of service. It would take a month for them to install and configure our WLAN so we hired a third party who charged us a small fortune for the work. I feel as if I got screwed with out a kiss.

Well I have DT with T-Online (all paid for by the company) and have never had any problems. Maybe more expensive, but really is a good connection.

@ Texas - Should have asked around a bit before doing your WLAN. I installed mine at home, and it really is easy to do !

Thanks for your responses and thanks to Bob for moving this to it's own thread and sorry again about the double post.

It seems like they make it so hard for you to switch and I guess that makes sense from a business stand point. The idea of the customer is always right does not seem to work too well in a "Service Wüste"

I had called T-Online to ask them about the switch and the woman was actually pretty helpful. She also offered me 2 months free Flat Rate if we would stay with them, so I guess they are feeling the heat of people getting fed up with the german version of Ma Bell!

But, my wife and I are really freaked about making the move at this point, as now we have to deal with killing this contract! I understand that since alice-dsl has just come to town, there will not be an awful lot of personal experiences with them, but maybe some people that have used them in Hamburg might have some? Maybe I am wrong and they are just starting out in the whole of Germany?

We would dearly like to switch, but hate the idea of lack of service and service disruptions.

Thanks again,
IE

Got my connection with Alice DSL going...yahooo!!!

So here is my experiance with changing the connection from Telekom to Alice:

Background info:

I had a T-ISDN line with T-DSL (1000Mbps) line before and i was paying something like 75 euros a month for the internet alone without even lifting the phone. So time to look for a new cheap connection.

Possible options:

Just before Alice hit the scene, Arcor was the other cheap alternative and i had even applied online with them. Got the contract mailed to me in the next two days for my signature... but then Alice adverts started appearing all over the town. Arcor wanted me to have their connection for a minimum of 24 months. That was a bit worrying, so decided to wait for Alice's offer. When the offer was put up on the net, it was really a great deal for a 5000 Mbps line with only a 4 week notice period.

The story with Alice:

Applied online for their service on the 10th of Feb. I chose to transfer my connection from Telekom to Alice with the option of keeping my old numbers. They sent a confirmation two days later and then a few days later a form for me to sign to authorize them to take the line from Telekom. Signed it and sent it via the free post envelope. (I waited for a week to send this form back since i was not sure if i'll be staying at my present place) That means i wasted a week. In a week i got the confirmation about the line and the date of connection (8th march in my case). They sent me the free DSL modem/router.

Now i have a super fast 5000 Mbps line with Alice and working fine.

Concerns with Alice:

I chose the ISDN option since i had an isdn telephone already. The only problem right now is that they cant get my phone to work.. there is apparantly some problem at their end. (I need only the internet, so i'm not that concerned about it right now).
Also, it was a bit of a mess to use the software provided by them to connect to the internet. I was trying with that for a whole day and couldnt connect and after a long wait to talk with the support personnel, found out that there are some issues with it and instead used the network connections of windows XP to connect. (Now i'm using a router to connect so that i can share the connection on my LAN)

A note about the router sent by alice:

I got a Frtiz SL DSL modem/router from them for free. Though it can function as a router, you need a hub / switch to share the internet connection in your LAN. Since i already had a wireless router, i'm using the alice box just as a modem and my router for the LAN.

So till now it looks great.. (I enjoy the 5 fold jump is speed and downloads look great ..!!) hope it stays that way.

There you go peeps.. thats was my experiance with Alice and i should say not a bad one considering that telekom made me run for my internet connection login and password for two months after they installed the line at my place. I guess nobody can beat that!!!

(Things to do: i guess i have to cancel the T-dsl subscription by myself. Got to figure that thing out now)

That will teach me to read these boards without my glasse on. I thought the post said Acid, expierences with LCD. Imagine how disapointed I was to read about dowload bandwidths...

Thank you for sharing that.

Do you live in Munich city? Presumably, taking into account your 1 week delay at returning the paperwork, the turnaround from application to working service was 3 weeks. Thats VERY good. Simply wrenching the numbers from Telekom can often take alternative providers more than a month.

Does your new line really seem 5 times faster than the old one?

I'd be curious to know if/when they sort out your problems (which for some people are critical).

How easy are customer service folks to reach? - do they speak English?

Thanks again,

YL6

I also thank you for sharing your info. And am also interested in the phone situation. That is one of the things we were most worried about, is Telkom not allowing another provider such an easy time of getting your phone line transfered. They, Telekom that is, I guess would want to make us feel like..."Oh god what have we done!" This could make others think twice about changing, even though we are paying nearly twice as much

Looking forward to hear if you need a seatbelt while DL'ing along with any other experiences you have with it.

Telekom are obliged to permit you a free choice of provider. That doesn't mean they have to make the transfer process easy. If you do move you won't become a third world customer - they'll welcome you back at any later time with open arms - they need the customers! - their reduction in rates at the beginning of March was partly to compete with the competition and attract (or retain) customers...

YL6

@YL6

yeah, i live in munich city. (Großhadern)

And the line is definitely faster. i clocked 546K max till now and that is consistent.

About my current "problem" of my ISDN line not working.. they said they will get back to me latest monday evening.

About customer service:

They have two numbers for the customers. The free number is for general queries and rporting problems. There is another 15cts/min number for getting help on the issues cornerning your internet connectivity problem. The typical waiting times for both the lines are 10-15mins now. (I guess they are being deluded with calls from disgruntled Telekom customers)

I couldnt find anyone who speaks english there. Both the times, when i had to sort out something with them, my german collegues at work helped me out. BUT, the people at the other end are very courteous AND they seem to know what they are talking about. This is in direct contrast to the experiance i had with telekom service, who mostly didnt have any clue about the technical stuff.

Could you clarify this statement?. Do you mean Telekom people to whom you turned to for technical advice concerning your connection, or T-Online people to whom you turned to for problems with your Internet connection. These are different people working for different organisations. Telekom technical support have recently gone through very intensive training and have a large number of new "tools" available to check connections and problems, before escalating to a local engineer. T-Online, by the nature of their software support experience and the wide range of customer types and problems that might exist can be different (but nonetheless are well trained, and have defined escalation routes).

Don't forget, compared to the (awful) T-Online software (now into the 5th version, and many of the earlier versions are still out there), Alice don't use portal software, just simpler access software...

YL6

I think it was with the T-online people i guess.. I'm not sure since it was one and a half years ago. I was trying to setup my router to connect to the internet and i guess i typed in the logon details wrong. After a few attempts, the account was blocked and i had a tough time resetting that. (I'm not sure if the dsl account gets blocked after a certain number of failed attempts with t-online.. but thats what the support desk told me).

Anyways, to cut the long story short, i had to wait for a day to sort that out with the t-online/telekom people and had to call almost 5-10 times on a costly number i believe.

But apart from that one episode, got no complaints with telekom and t-online for the three years that i had the connection except for the price they charged for the connection.

(May be they gave me all the trouble in the begining making me run around for my password and log-in mail for almost two months).

One thing common to both telekom and alice is the lack of english support . That pisses me off like anything. (I know its germany and i'm supposed to know the language... but still... atleast one per organisation.. u can have that i guess..)

Three failed access attempts and you are locked out until after midnight. A royal pain, especially since the login-account details are so complicated and easy to enter incorrectly. T-Online support can't reset them either, so you have to simply wait. If your forget or lose your details, then it can take 7-10 days to receive new ones by snail mail (only). Not the most customer-friendly of systems, but damned secure I suppose...

YL6

Hello,

I finally have Alice DSL too (just since Friday)! After applying to GMX (in December) and waiting 2 months I decided to switch to Alice because of the flat rate offer. It took about 3 weeks in total and I am very pleased with the service. Everything is elegant ... the simple login (no hefty installations), the easy switch between 1.500 kbit/s and 5.000 kbit/s, the price ... I have no complaints whatsoever!

Oh ... and since Friday I have already downloaded several Gigabytes ... and that's only using the slow connection! Hehe ... poor Alice is working overtime for me! ;-)

(And for people considering getting Alice ... just remember that this flat-rate deal will only last until the end of this year. With the downloads I am doing poor Hansanet will be paying Telekom through the nose! It is a test-phase ... great to take advantage of whilst it lasts!)

If anyone would like more details please feel free to ask.

could you explain what you meant here?

'Buzz

What makes you say this? - all I can see in their online information is that the free phone calls to other Alice users is limited until the end of the year...
Of course they are free to change prices, but even they know that a major price hike would cause a flood of departures...

YL6

Sorry, I haven't actually read this but heard it from a German Techie. It is normal for new DSL companies to have a flat rate testing-phase ... and then download limits are implemented (according to the results of the testing phase.) Hansanet has to pay telekom for every little bit of data transferred ... the flat rate is certainly not going to stay this cheap for a long period of time. I have heard (but once again NOT read) that it will last until the end of the year. Sorry I can't be more specific!

Unlikely. Hansanet (aka Alice) don't use the Telekom data backbone like many others (e.g. GMX and 1und1), they have their own. They simply rent Telekom cables to get the service into your home. This has nothing to do with data-rates. It's a fixed cost for use of the copper wire. In simple terms they have their own internet service across Germany and simply connect into your house cable via the local Telekom exchange. Their introductory offer (free connection, free equipment) will certainly be limited - it's being used to attract new customers, but their data-rates won't change, and they'd be foolish to implement hefty price hikes on the service...

YL6

I think you are right. If they did suddenly raise their rates drastically, peeps would split in a hurry The free installation and free equipment offer will end April 30th.

This is really great being able to read some on the ground experiences with dear Alice!

Is it true that with a phone line with companies like alice and arcor i am unable to call with call by call?

That is one of the big drawbacks...the answer is yes it is true that you cannot use call by call with them I think this is where they make there Euro's

But you can buy a calling card and use that to call other countries.

Or you use VoiP - once you have high-speed internet the phone line is superfluous...

YL6

Is VoiP like Skype YL6?

Yup, that's what he's talking about. My problem with VoiP is that you are then tied to the location of your computer to dial the call. I'd still prefer to use a telephone (not a headset everytime), is this possible with VoiP?

yes, after this CeBit there a few ordinary phones where you can do VoiP with your phone.

The clue is that you dont need your computer because the phone will use your W-lan router

[img]http://communications.siemens.com/repository/926/92664/wlanphone_CeBIT_72dpi.jpg[/img]

Siemens W-lan Phone

Skype is a "poor mans" VoIP. Skype is a software solution to let you telephone worldwide over the internet, either with other Skype users (free) or make calls to landlines. The downside of Skype is you need a PC and headset (or "USB Phone" to use it). You also cannot dial in to a Skype user from the outside world (yet - this will be shortly announced as the new "Skype-in"). The upside of Skype is that it uses low bandwidth - you can easilly hold a bearable conversation over a dial-up analogue modem connection.

VoIP is basically the ability to hold a phone conversation using the internet as your carrier.

It is now possible to establish your own landline number in many countries. UK, Germany and USA are very well served in this respect. I can setup a UK phone number in any UK area code for free. I can setup my Internet-connected PC and headset on the internet to be "connected" with that number. Anyone calling this number is essentially calling my PC over the internet. The only charge for the caller is the cost of the call to the landline. For a UK or US person, for example, this could be a local call. It doesn't matter where your PC is connected into the Internet - Germany or Outer Mongolia, the call costs fo the originator are the same. Companies providing the access service also allow you to call out from your PC via the number too. These calls are very cheap, especially if to the same country where your number is based. However, because Germany has artificially deflated international call costs because of the call-by-call market here, they are not much more competitive than those. If you cannot use call-by-call (because you have Alice or Arcor, for example) then VoIP is attractive.

The next stage is real VoIP telephones. These exist (€100 or less) and allow you to connect a phone device directly into your internet connection, usually home router. Once configured, then this phone is just like a real phone, the only difference being that it actually has a phone number, usually in another country - people can make calls to you, and you can make calls anywhere in the world at reduced rates.

VoIP Services in the USA for example, give you a US phone number in the area code of your choice, and calling plans permit up to unlimited calls in the mainland USA for around $25 "flat rate". If you establish the number in the area code your family live in, then ALL their calls to you are free (because in the USA calls to the same area code are free) and you can make unlimited calls across the USA with no additional charges.

I have a VoIP number in Yorkshire (where else?). My family have the advantage that they can call me at local (UK) rates (but even then German call-by-call services to UK are cheaper than the VoIP providers calls to the UK). Right now this means my family get the main advantage... Of course, if I am travelling, and my PC is connected to the internet then they can call me whereever I am, and I can often call them with substantially cheaper rates than mobile roaming or hotel charges

Potentially you can setup multiple numbers in different cities, or in different countries. Wherever you plug in your phone (or PC), to any internet connection any where in the world, you are available on that number.

The next development is the "WiFi" VoIP phone. The Siemens press release is just such a model. Others already exist. These are wireless phones that can log into a WiFi hotspot to do exactly the same thing as the wired VoIP phone described above. The result is that you simply need to be near WiFi access and your IP phone goes "live" and your number becomes available.

A further upcoming developement is to add video services to the carrier. I already know someone in Munich from Hong Kong who has brought such a device from their home. The have a VoIP number in Hong-Kong, as does their sister who lives in New York. A video conversation over the internet with the sister is little more than a local Hong Kong phone call, despite call origination in Munich and destination New York...

The wonders of science... I feel a new thread coming on...

YL6

Wait a minute. You mean that I can set up my own landline number in the US for free and then connect my computer/VOIP system to this number? And then the calls would be super-cheap for my family? If you didn't mean this, sorry...I was too lazy to read in detail...

Got it in one.
The US service I am most familar with costs $24.95/month for unlimited calls inside US and Canada. For $14.99/month you can have 500minutes of calls.. You can get a number in almost any state for people to call you on.

Don't forget - the biggest financial advantage here is for your friends and family, not for you...

YL6

update:

the ISDN phone line started working today just as the Alice guys told me last week.

Thats what i call Customer Service..!!

Keep up the good job Alice guys..!!

I just signed up for Alice and am having problems installing the software because I have the English version of Windows 2000 for my operating system.

Has anyone gotten around this issue yet?

- Thrine

I'm having problems with Installing alice as well.

When I first installed it i chose the wrong option i.e. DSL but we have analogue (my flatmate has it working on his machine with that connection) so i needed to chose that option. So done the uninstall stuff reboot etc and tried to install it again.
This time however it skipped about three steps in the installation. one of the steps being the configuration settings I needed to change!

It appears that there is something still on the machine telling the installation that I want a DSL phone line connection no matter how many times I uninstall and try again it still will not work.

I have ran wndow washer and done an search for all things Alice on the machine and deleted them but cant get back to making a 'real' new installation!!

Im running XP pro on a work machine so dont have an XP disc for messing around with windows.

Needless to say this is doing my head in as I cant get internet at home with my machine.

Any ideas???

If you are using win2k or XP you don't need to use the Alice Software that comes with the package.
Just go to network neighbourhood (or possibly network settings in the control panel), select "create new network connection" (i forget the exact name) and then you can choose to create a PPPoE connection, input your details there, connect and you are ready to go.

Nice 1 luap. found what i need to do but i'm at work at the moment so will try it later.
thanks.

If you have DSL (DTAG/1und1/Tiscalli/M-Net/Alice) and you don't want to install
their craptastic Bloated German crap, then you need THIS software. It's for Win9x/Win2k/WinXP/Win2k3

It's much smaller (300k) and will do everything you need to get you online.

Ok which one do I download. there are three software versions there.
Laptop is win XP with intel centrino.

Ok i just read the page again and it does tell you which one to download. Doh!!

Although you can use the RASPPOE software shown for XP, you don't need it. The protocols it installs are already present in XP (allbethey from Microsfot). Win98 and 2000 would need RASPPOE.

In XP simply setup a new dial-up connection using the "Broadband" option...

RASPPOE brings minor advantages over the XP implementation, but oly for the dedicated hacker...

YL6

yeah I figured that out. I was gonna do the windows one frst an if that didnt work then I'd try the RASPPOE thing

If the Windose one does not work, then it's unlikely the other will help, as there will be some sort of other problem elsewhere (with ethernet, modem, user account, cabling or DSL line). In essence they both do the same thing technically.

YL6

We have ordered Alice Now, with what you guys are saying, i am wondering why you would need their or any other software, other then your own network software. i am on a Mac and there is a network setting app that you can put all the info in. At least I hope this is how it is going to work

I really wish that we could have gotten their 40 euro offer if you recommend a friend to Alice. We have a friend that wants to sign up, but it turns out, we have to have Alice installed and running already to get the 40 bucks, ah well...

MacOS also has Broadband/PPPoE support like WinXp, so you don't need any software, just a connection, modem, username and password...
NOTE - Alice MIGHT not work with the Airport wireless router if you are considering it. There are problems with this hardware and almost anyone else than T-online...

YL6

Thanks YL6

BTW, if anyone else that has Alice installed already wants to do the offer they have and split the euro's we would be happy to

my internet works at home!! wooohoooo!!!
I can't believe it was so easy and I didn't figure out how o do it myself!!
Thanks people!

I have my Alice line working... I'll be up for it if you are willing to share the proceeds ;-)

PM me if you want.

'Buzz

The boxes from Alice just arrived and the install is on Thursday...whooopie!

I am wondering:

1) If i can use the t-online ISDN box and the DSL modem that I have set up already, or if due to the speed increase I will need to use Alice's stuff? I just thought it would be easier leaving it set as it is, if it will work.

2) When I go to my Macintosh network settings, how do you find the info to put in? Or does it do all this automatically? ie, in Proxy I input ftp-proxy.t-online.de Would I just change that to ftp-proxy.alice-dsl.de?

It is funny, we got our new t-online bill and the flat rate charge was missing. We thought, hmm, maybe they forgot and they won't charge us. Then we though, ooops, maybe we are on call-by-call already and we will owe a fortune since we have been on the net 24 hours a day My wife called them today and they said they just forgot to bill us this month and they did the same with a bunch of other people

We are really looking forward to it and we hope it is a smooth transition.

IE

@IndustrialEcho

1. DSL Equip is good for Download speeds of up to 8mb / 1mb up
Your current equip will only require a small config change (Logon Name/Password)

2. This Info. should be given to your by Alice/ISP, if not look at their www site. T-Online don't need these settings, even though you seem to have used them.