Interest in opening a bar/grill in HH

47 posts in this topic

Posted

Hello people. How is everyone doing? I am interested in opening a Bar/Grill in Hamburg. It has been on my mind for quite some time. Nothing grand, but a place where one can find some good eats. We currently have another business in Schleswig-Holstein that is doing well, but I feel like it is time to follow another passion and to contribute to the local culinary scene in HH, and make more money while we diversify our portfolio. Any advice on obtaining a permit to sell liquor would be great. matter of fact all advice. I do understand that this town is saturated with places to eat. I also noticed that locations are pretty slim here as well, and hard to find. The GOOD fast food route is also another option if it passes the demographics test. What else? I think that is all for now. I appreciate your help Team Toytown.

Have a great day!!!

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Posted

There are some definite gaps in the market.

Identify those needs, and you could make money. A lot of money.

Take a look at more dynamic restaurant scenes like London or New York. Identify what's hot. Search magazines like Time Out, websites like Zagat as well as food blogs.

Here are a few gaps that I have discovered after being here one year.

You could burst a blood vessel looking for a deli sandwich. I'm talking pastrami, corned beef or rare roast beef.

Have you considered Southern BBQ?

Can you imagine the fortune to be made by simply opening a British Fish and Chip shop!

Dozens of people on this very forum are craving Australian style pies at this very moment.

But there is one need, one urgent overwhelming need which, if you can fill it, you will become a wealthy man, a very wealthy man.

Obviously, for me to impart that information, there will be certain fees involved, but with it, you will change your life from the humdrum to the stella, you'll also change Hanseatic Hamburg and the World!

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Posted

if you proceed, this thread should be required reading. ;)

http://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=27728

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Posted

Unfortunately for us expats, restaurants that try to cater to us exclusively tend to either go broke very quickly or change their menu to adapt to local tastes. While there may be "dozens of people on this very forum ... craving Australian style pies at this very moment," this is a Germany-wide forum, and they will not automatically become your customers in Hamburg. Numerous pie ventures in Munich have opened and closed.

There was an excellent southern BBQ place - Traveller Tavern in Hamburg-Winterhude - that had the best ribs I've had in Germany, but they closed down a while back because people got tired of the fare. Hamburg residents prefer herring, not cod, so they go for Rollmops instead of fish and chips (or they get their fish and chips from Nordsee).

Germans are quite satisfied with their belegte Brote and can't be bothered to go somewhere extra for deli sandwiches, as the demise of both Schlotzki's Deli (200 yards from Checkpoint Charlie) and Tim's Canadian Deli in Berlin prove.

Whatever you do, don't fall into the trap of thinking that what works in New York will work here, or that you can survive on tourist traffic alone.

Good luck!

True. It is different over here. It' will take me about 8 more months to figure it all out. A very small take out spot is an option as well. Lower risk and overhead. Not in the game to be one of the casualties. As far as the bar is concerned, more research is required.

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Posted

if you proceed, this thread should be required reading.

http://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=27728

Not trying to take it in that direction. That was sounding messy at the end.

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Posted

Well that was a worst case scenario so dont waste your time going through it again.

Here is something better and you might think about pming them . Take into account that this was in Berlin and probably the best place for for a restaurant to succeed in my opinion.

Texas BBQ.

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Posted

To be fair, the Texas BBQ place violated the first three rules of running a restaurant: location, location, location. It was barely even in Berlin. It was a 45-minute drive from Berlin proper and over an hour on public transportation (including a 10-minute walk from the S-Bahn station). It might have had a chance somewhere else, but the combination of remote location and extremely specialized fare meant it was doomed from the start.

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Posted

True but a still better comparison than the Twisted experience. The Twisted was based on pure chaos. I say that as someone who went there a lot, and knew it was bound to fail from the start.

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Posted

I was scouting Berlin but that is not going to work. Unless its a second location. I've been involved in the food industry in the states and I seen the big guys with the deep pockets go down hard in Miami. It is rough and tough everywhere I know. In terms of real estate, Berlin city has some nice spots. Take out option is fine for us. This will allow us to own the property and keep all long term costs low so we can concentrate on catering and etc. Thanks a lot people. Keep it coming. Plenty of things are missing for everyone, not just the auslanders. It is all good. Thanks Team Toytown!

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Posted

I'd quite like to see a Nandos (uk piri piri) :blink: or equivalent.

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Posted

...Any advice on obtaining a permit to sell liquor would be great...

You don't need a liquor licence in Germany. You need a serving licence which basically covers all food and drink.

If there was any additional stress, beaurocracy or cost involved, then McDonalds, Burger King and every single little takeaway joint wouldn't be selling beer.

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Posted

I think a burger joint like gbk in the UK or burger house in Munich would go down well.

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Posted

As in good :-)

If you can't make it to Munich Google some reviews about burger house in Munich - simple , well sources ingredients and good beer

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Posted

There was an excellent southern BBQ place - Traveller Tavern in Hamburg-Winterhude - that had the best ribs I've had in Germany, but they closed down a while back because people got tired of the fare. Hamburg residents prefer herring, not cod, so they go for Rollmops instead of fish and chips (or they get their fish and chips from Nordsee).

Actually that cannot quite be true since Montgomery Champs (claims to be a US-style restaurent) is always full to overflowing whenever a family member goes there - we have two birthdays coming up this month & I know that our daughter wants to go there to eat.

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Posted

Champs was around in my Hamburg days, too. I loathed the place. It's self-designated "U.S. style", but not genuine, and is always full of teens who don't know the difference. All the food is prefabricated and made suitably bland to suit Hanseatic tastes.

The worst part is (or at least was, back in the day) when you order their "onion rings": you get a block (actually cube-shaped) of charred, deep-fried onion slices. Non-breaded. It's the first time I've ever seen a cube called a ring before. I never went back there after that experience.

As to Travellers Tavern, perhaps the owners just got tired of running a restaurant. But friends told me they shut down for lack of customers.

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Posted

The worst part is (or at least was, back in the day) when you order their "onion rings": you get a block (actually cube-shaped) of charred, deep-fried onion slices. Non-breaded. It's the first time I've ever seen a cube called a ring before. I never went back there after that experience.

Although its not a place of Haut Cuisine I can at least report that the "onion rings" appear to have improved since your experience.

Its not my favourite place either but its the overall family's if U see what I mean.

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Posted

It's never authentic...

Like Buffalo wings.

I've fallen into the trap of ordering Buffalo wings twice in Munich, to get BBQ Aldi wings.

It pisses me off and I'm not even American.

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Posted

I'm waiting for the Craft Beer revolution to reach Germany.

Germany is rightly famous for its beer, but the very factors that make its beer great have prevented the kind of progress we are seeing in the States and other countries.

I would be willing to bet that, done right, the first brave person to open an operation in Hamburg like, for example, Brewdog, will make a fortune. And have a lot of fun at the same time!

There is just nowhere in Hamburg that is innovating with beer and that sucks!

post-210954-13650854544992.gif

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Posted

Unfortunately for us expats, restaurants that try to cater to us exclusively tend to either go broke very quickly or change their menu to adapt to local tastes. While there may be "dozens of people on this very forum ... craving Australian style pies at this very moment," this is a Germany-wide forum, and they will not automatically become your customers in Hamburg. Numerous pie ventures in Munich have opened and closed.

There was an excellent southern BBQ place - Traveller Tavern in Hamburg-Winterhude - that had the best ribs I've had in Germany, but they closed down a while back because people got tired of the fare. Hamburg residents prefer herring, not cod, so they go for Rollmops instead of fish and chips (or they get their fish and chips from Nordsee).

Germans are quite satisfied with their belegte Brote and can't be bothered to go somewhere extra for deli sandwiches, as the demise of both Schlotzki's Deli (200 yards from Checkpoint Charlie) and Tim's Canadian Deli in Berlin prove.

Whatever you do, don't fall into the trap of thinking that what works in New York will work here, or that you can survive on tourist traffic alone.

Good luck!

I definitely agree with you and also with "Texas BBQ" I want to provide an example.

There was this place in 'Harburg' near the CINEMAX where within a span of 3 years I have seen 3 different people trying to develop 3 different kind of American Style Restaurant. I cannot understand the reason why they kept on closing, as their location was pretty decent. Near the shopping complexes of Harburg and also near a CINEMAX.

I would say try to concentrate mostly on the bar space and then slowly try to bring in the Texas or Grill foods. If you straight away start with restaurants and foods, i think people are not straight away attracted to come in.

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I'm waiting for the Craft Beer revolution to reach Germany.

Germany is rightly famous for its beer, but the very factors that make its beer great have prevented the kind of progress we are seeing in the States and other countries.

I would be willing to bet that, done right, the first brave person to open an operation in Hamburg like, for example, Brewdog, will make a fortune. And have a lot of fun at the same time!

There is just nowhere in Hamburg that is innovating with beer and that sucks!

post-210954-13650854544992.gif

What about the laws when it comes to brewing? I thought they took that sh*t serious. I like drinking craft beer. Anchor Steam and Blue Moon are my faves. Abita Beers are great when I'm in New Orleans. Did you mean MicroBrewery?

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I definitely agree with you and also with "Texas BBQ" I want to provide an example.

There was this place in 'Harburg' near the CINEMAX where within a span of 3 years I have seen 3 different people trying to develop 3 different kind of American Style Restaurant. I cannot understand the reason why they kept on closing, as their location was pretty decent. Near the shopping complexes of Harburg and also near a CINEMAX.

I would say try to concentrate mostly on the bar space and then slowly try to bring in the Texas or Grill foods. If you straight away start with restaurants and foods, i think people are not straight away attracted to come in.

The bar action sounds better. Easier to concentrate on the drinks and the ambiance. I the food can come later at another property as long as the revenues increase. Sounds like the places near the Cinemax could not get it right. It ain't easy and not for the faint of heart.

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