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Friends moving in - change of circumstances

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Posted

hello there

 

My friends have just moved in with us (husband and wife) and they will be staying for at least a year and are contributing towards the rent. They are working and are not receiving any kind of benefits. However, I am receving Hartz 4 and would like to know how I go about telling the jobcenter that two more people have moved in with us. I know that in the UK they have a change of circumstances form, and all the relevant information is filled in there. But I don't know whether there is a similar form here from the jobcenter, or do I write them a letter?

 

As I am receiving Hartz 4 then I know that the jobcenter will decrease the rent that they help out with, as my friends have moved in, but I don't know how I go about telling them?

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Posted

Is it a possibility for you to call the job center anonymously and ask them so you'll have the most current information regarding the process first hand?

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Posted

Thanks for the reply, but my german is really bad and I am not able to hold a conversation yet, which is why I was wondering whether they have the change of circumstances form here?

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Posted

If such a form exists, it will likely be in German, so that won't help you much.

 

You'll have to call them in any case, to tell them your new situation (not doing so would be equivalent to committing benefits fraud). They'll either send you the form or make an appointment for you to discuss it.

 

Do you have a German-speaking friend who can help you with the phone call and/or appointment?

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Posted

Thanks for the reply. I do have a german friend whom I asked but she said that it is better to give any information I have by written means and not by phone as the jobcenter can be quite mistrusting with these types of things. Also, I want to tell the jobcenter straight away as I don't want any overpayments backdated, as they are a nightmare when they ask for overpayments.

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Posted

Then I would suggest that you ask your distrustful friend to call the Job Center and inquire whether there is a form to notify them of your change of circumstances and, if not, make an appointment for you.

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Posted

 

My friends have just moved in with us (husband and wife) and they will be staying for at least a year and are contributing towards the rent.

Are they on the lease?

Alternatively, are you subletting with your landlord's consent? If not, get it, PDQ.

 

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. Please have all legal advice you receive here verified by a legal professional.

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Posted

You should also make damn sure to assure the Jobcenter that you do not form a Bedarfsgemeinschaft with your friends, merely a Wohngemeinschaft.

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Posted

Thanks for the replies,

 

Sorry for sounding simple but - Kato - what is the difference between the two?

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Posted

If you are a Bedarfsgemeinschaft then all members contribute to a joint household. Stuff like jointly buying food for all people living in the household counts for example. If a household is treated as a Bedarfsgemeinschaft that means the income and assets of all members count when calculating how much you get.

 

In a Wohngemeinschaft you only live in the same flat/house, and share e.g. kitchen and toilet while running your households separately within the flat.

 

Official details here.

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Posted

Thanks for the reply,

 

As they don't receive any benefits, I don't want them to be on my application. I just want to inform the jobcenter that they have moved in and are obviously contributing towards the rent - which in turn, will reduce the amount of money that I recieve from the jobcenter.

 

I am now worried that the jobcenter might ask about the couples income, assets etc. While they are my friends, I don't know how much they earn exactly each month, as I think that one's personal income, assets etc are private. Will I have to tell the jobcenter of their assets, money in their bank acount, monthly income etc?

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Posted

This is why Kato said you need to make damn sure the Job Center is reassured and certain that this arrangement with your friends is a Wohngemeinschaft and NOT a Bedarfsgemeinschaft. Please read Kato's post #11 again, where he explains the difference between the two.

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Posted

Thanks for the reply,

 

But how do I make sure that they understand? I have filled out the change of circumstance form and I have crossed out the 'bedarfgemeinshcaft' and written 'wohngemeinschaft' is this enough?

 

If they ask me about their bank details, income etc - and I refuse to guve them this info, then what will the jobcenter do?

 

I am worried if they combine their income together and my income, then they might stop my benefit altogether?

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Posted

Okay, so you've filled out the form. When you give it in, I'm assuming you'll be exchanging at least a few words with someone there. Make sure you put an emphasis then also on the fact that it is a Wohngemeinschaft. If you're asked about their finances, all you have to do is reiterate that it's a Wohngemeinschaft and your households are run separately within the flat.

 

I wouldn't recommend "refusing to give them the info", as this will give the impression you're trying to hide something. Instead, explain that you are unable to give the info, as your two households are entirely separate. Sometimes it's all in how you package something.

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Posted

Thanks for the reply, but I've actually posted the form and not gone in and given it personally.

 

Oh eck, now I'm nervous.

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