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Just how good is Lionel Messi?

18 posts in this topic

Posted

Lionel Messi now has 21 goals for Barcelona in only 14 games in the Spanish league. He scored 50 goals last season and if he keeps going he could considerably improve on that record this time.

Is he simply the best ever or is he at least also being boosted by circumstances, such as the fact that in Barcelona he is being fed the ball by one of the best teams ever (he doesn't score that often for Argentina), that outside the top 4 or 5 opposition is depleted by big-club-poaching and of course that in comparison with Pele, Maradona and others he really benefits from being better protected by the rules and the refs?

I haven't made up my mind yet.

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Posted

I would say he is the best I have seen total ball control and balance ,Maradona was similar but a cheating git

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Posted

Maybe im biased as a Manchester United fan but i still rate Cristiano Ronaldo above Messi!

 

I believe Ronaldo will soon get a bad back soon due to carrying Real Madrid for most of the season, yeah no doubts Messi is class but it really is hard not to be in a team like Barcelona. See if Messi could cut it in the Prem, i think its too rough but if he could do well in the prem then i would rate him as best in the world but thats my opinion.

 

Back to the point yeah hes phenomenal, wouldn't mind him in a United shirt. I enjoy watching Barca play, great passing and team work.

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Posted

Messi already scored 84 goals this calendar year. The record is 85 held by Gerd "Der Bomber" Müller. For sure, he is going to break this record. I personally have more sympathy for Messi than Ronaldo, because he is more down-to-earth.

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Posted

Best around at the moment v slightly ahead of CR7 but not the best ever.

Until he drags his Argentina team to glory or near glory then I won't consider him as good as Maradonna the 2nd greatest ever behind Pele.

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Posted

I tend to like Messi a bit more because he doesn't come across as such a tosser. As players it is hard to say as they have different styles and strengths. I did read an article somewhere in which it was opined that Messi would prove to be the better of the two in the long run because more of CR7's quality is reliant on his physical capacities and these inevitable fade with time (e.g. his speed is a big part of his game and when he can longer take on and beat defenders with his pace he may not seem so good). The author argued that as they get older, barring injury, Ronaldo will be the one who will be forced to adapt his game more to compensate for the inevitable decline of his physical prowess - something which he may or may not be able to do successfully. Only time will tell, but there could be something to it.

 

 

Until he drags his Argentina team to glory or near glory then I won't consider him as good as Maradonna the 2nd greatest ever behind Pele.

I don't know that this is a reasonable way to assess either of them. When it comes down to it it is a team game - how do the other players in either of their national teams, or indeed either team as a unit, coach included, compare to those that Maradona and Pele, or even Cruyff or Beckenbauer, played in? It is also interesting that far fewer people seem to raise this issue regarding Ronaldo (at least as far as the opinion pieces I have read and the, admittedly few, people I discuss football with are concerned). I suspect because Portugal does not have the same sort of reputation or record as Argentina, but shouldn't it be just as possible for him to drag the Portuguese team along with him to win a Euro or World title? To look at it the other way, it is probably fair to say that Messi might be so prolific were he not in a team that is full of ridiculously talented players and is, at least to some degree, structured around him.

 

Like Ellis95, I wouldn't have anything against seeing either of them in a ManU shirt, And f&%k knows we could use them right now.

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Posted

The way footy was played across the ages makes it very difficult to compare. The games played by Pele, Eusebio, Cruyff, Beckenbauer and Breitner (who I rate higher as Beckenbauer -- and I'm not a Bayern fan and Dutch(!)) have a completely different pace, style and character than the game today. For one, they didn't have substitutions during the (majority of the) careers of the former. However, the game today is much faster, much more tightly controlled tactically, but nowhere near as bone crunchingly hard!

 

Nice what-if game to consider Pele growing up in the 1980s, but as it stands, looking at the games as they were, players of today are so much better than those of a generation ago, and I bet that if they could be put back in time, even the 2012 St Pauli squad would run rings around the 1966 England squad.

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Posted

In some circles he's known the Landon Donovan of world football.

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Posted

 

Maradona was similar but a cheating git

 

I think that's a bit harsh when you look at the fouls comitted against him and how little the incompetent refs did about it. Is he more of a cheat for scoring with his hand than the guy who crushed his ankle?

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Posted

 

I don't know that this is a reasonable way to assess either of them. When it comes down to it it is a team game - how do the other players in either of their national teams, or indeed either team as a unit, coach included, compare to those that Maradona and Pele, or even Cruyff or Beckenbauer, played in?

 

Because to me the test of true greatness in football is how it affects the players around them.Maradonna dragged an average team to a World Cup win on his back.Pele although not dragging an average team to World Cup glory dominated at National and International level for many years and had a world class all round game,whereas the same could not be said of Maradonna which is why Pele just edges the greatest player ever for me (Plus the handball goal probably plays a part as well :) ).

 

Messi is the jewel in a very sparkling crown whereas Maradonna was a diamond in a dungheap.

 

 

 

It is also interesting that far fewer people seem to raise this issue regarding Ronaldo (at least as far as the opinion pieces I have read and the, admittedly few, people I discuss football with are concerned).

They don't but they should.

He is in my eyes a sun on his back type of player in that when things are going well his class shines through yet when they're not he doesn't seem capable of pulling his team through.

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Posted

In the end, it is impossible to objectively judge players of one generation against those of any other. You can only compare their impacts on the game while they were playing. Pele was, without a doubt, the player that defined footballing greatness for his generation, and probably subsequent generations until Maradona came along.

Despite Maradona's unquestionable greatness, he will always be remembered as much for the handball as for his skill - the two (the man and the handball) are indelibly linked.

Only history will tell if Messi belongs in the discussion with the two of them. He is still young, so it remains to be seen if he can lead Argentina to WC glory. If he does, then he will likely go down in history as at least a peer of Pele and Maradona.

 

These are just the two cents of a football-uneducated, but obsessed nonetheless, boy! :-)

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Posted

I am sorry T.J. Morton but Messi already won 5x spanish league, 2x Spanish cup, 5x Spanish supercup, 3x Champions League, 2x UEFA supercup, 2x FIFA Club worldcup and one Olympic games medal..

 

His individual achievements are also great, so great I would not be able to post them here.

 

And the weird thing is that Messi is only 25 years old, he doesn't get injured easily and can probably play at champions league level for at least 4 or 5 years..

 

The guy is a beast

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Posted

 

I am sorry T.J. Morton but Messi already won 5x spanish league, 2x Spanish cup, 5x Spanish supercup, 3x Champions League, 2x UEFA supercup, 2x FIFA Club worldcup and one Olympic games medal.. ...

 

There is no question of his club achievements. The only question remaining is his play for Argentina. He plays on arguably the best club team in history - so his club achievements could be discounted by some. If he can recreate some of that form for his national team, his name should, and likely will, go down in history along with Pele and Maradona as one of the greatest ever. But if he doesn't have success with his national team, there will always be those who question his abilities outside the best midfield in the game with Barcelona.

 

And the Olympics don't really count since they essentially end up being a U21 tournament.

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Posted

Lionel Messi scores again for Barcelona against Real Betis to BREAK Gerd Muller's record of 85 goals in a calendar year.

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Posted

He is the best player of all time without a doubt. Barcelona are no where near as effective when he does not play.

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Posted

He is OK but he is no Falcao.

 

 

 

I may be biased here

 

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